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TilleyMan
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Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project
      #192146 - 20/10/11 12:13 AM

At last a chance to post some photos of a recent pickup... a 1972 Brno ZKK600 (rare early pop-up peep with twin assist springs and lock screw!) fitted with the standard trigger.

It had been converted by a reasonable gunsmith from 7x57mm to 9.3x62mm utilising the existing front banded swivel and foresight ramp... which means a nice trim and lightweight rifle, a 24" barrel should get the most from the cartridge.

The checkering was quite carefully recut, but the original front barrel bedding tension screw was deleted and the hole rather crudely filled in with bedding compound.

Seen a lot of carrying but not much use... fairly standard for a Sambar rifle.
The bore was mirror bright when I finally got all the powder fouling and copper out

Unfortunately at some stage the rifle passed onto someone who really didn't care for it... very poorly fitted recoil pad, two 5/8" holes drilled into the butt to lighten it has upset the balance and shifted it too far forward, various screw heads butchered etc.

Since I got it at a very good price, I thouight i would have fun restoring it and sharing the process with forum members who appreciate the ZKK!

Will provide updates as I go... but as a start here's the 'before' shots






Note gap between end of extractor to receiver... the ZKK extractor has been replaced by the slightly shorter M98 extractor
Luckily a CZ550 extractor is the same as a ZKK!












Someone has done a poor bedding job, which has meant the stock has cracked around the recoil reinforcement and rear tang.
I intend to try and fix the stock, but if too far gone will replace it.










Note 'mousetrap' coiled trigger assist spring to replace the original flat one

Update... metalwork is now well into the white, should clean up nicely... more shots to follow soon!
I'm being careful to retain or restore crisp edges, peening galled screw heads back in place... enjoyable when you can take the time to get it right

Edited by CptCurl (28/11/11 01:08 AM)


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Sville
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #192149 - 20/10/11 02:13 AM

Will be a great hunting rifle in a usable caliber. Will be fun to see this project proceed....

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DarylS
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: Sville]
      #192152 - 20/10/11 02:52 AM

Any time there is metal to metal fitting between the top and bottom metal, without the intermediate piece of metal being ONE with the stock, the stock will split. This is due to the impossibility of a tight fit of the barrled actio in the stock- it is tight only to a moving object - the bottom metal. This cracking happens at the wrist as well as at the recoil lug. Loosness when screws are tight is the reason 90% of Husky's rifle's are cracked through the wrist - the steel tube prevents a compressed wood fit between the bottom and top metal after the wood shrinks or compresses slighlty. It appoears part of the steel tube has been removed and the bottom tang area bedded to allow a hard fit. I suggest the cracked wrist was pre-bedding.

Is the crack though the recoil lug surface in the bedding,or underneath it? Being fired when the guard screws are loose, will crack most any stock throught that area.

The bedding at the recoil lug looks fine to me.

If the crack is through the bedding, I would dremel it out, sprad the crack as much as possible, then inject heated thin acraglass into the crack and use cross bolts through the recoil lug and behind the tang, then re-bed the barreled action. A steel crossbolt could have been inlet into the recoil lug but as the stock is already cracked, a cross bolt, side to side is indicated, in my opinion.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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FATBOY404
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: DarylS]
      #192172 - 20/10/11 07:58 AM

Hi Tilleyman.

My two favorite things..........ZKK's and 9.3x62.

Looks like a fun project mate.

Will be nice when finished.

Tony Small,Afro408 has my old ZKK 600 stock that was pretty good if you are interested contact him.

Look forward to this one.

--------------------
"WHATEVER BLOWS YOUR HAIR BACK"


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9.3x57
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: FATBOY404]
      #192192 - 20/10/11 01:04 PM

Fun project, indeed!

Oh, Daryl...here we go again with those dang-blasted-F!&(!%#@%!!&%!!! stock ferrules!

Tilley, punch'em out and go from there!

I like the rifle and will look forward to the end result.

Fun indeed!

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?


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kamilaroi
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: 9.3x57]
      #192196 - 20/10/11 03:04 PM

There was never a finer stock factory rifle than the 600 series BRNO.

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JDL
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: kamilaroi]
      #192297 - 22/10/11 11:16 AM

I'm really liking your rifle! I've never seen that type of aperture sight before. Really cool!

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GK
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: JDL]
      #192316 - 22/10/11 06:42 PM

Excellent pick up TM, it looks like the perfect project for you as I can remember you were always after a BRNO in 9.3x62. But what's going to happen to the 9.3x62 SAKO?

This is the sort of rifle I need to stumble onto, as I've tried to buy three ZKK's as donnor actions
and I have ended up not being able to pull them apart.

Thanks for the clear pics of the early peep sight design, the locking screw should never have been deleted. I imagine that it will be a real headache to re-assemble the sight with twin return springs as one is bad enough.

George


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Poss
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: GK]
      #192318 - 22/10/11 07:26 PM

No matter how old and rough they look, there's something about the ZKK's that have appeal.

Great rifle and look forward to seeing her done up.

Edited by Poss (22/10/11 07:26 PM)


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CHAPUISARMES
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: GK]
      #192320 - 22/10/11 07:39 PM

Quote:



This is the sort of rifle I need to stumble onto, as I've tried to buy three ZKK's as donnor actions
and I have ended up not being able to pull them apart.

Thanks for the clear pics of the early peep sight design, the locking screw should never have been deleted. I imagine that it will be a real headache to re-assemble the sight with twin return springs as one is bad enough.

George




Hi George,

Fear not, here is another two, one has a peep.

http://www.buyagun.com.au/5-centrefire-from-270/listings.html

http://www.evansclarke.com.au/auction_items.asp?id=6093



Cheers,

Jeff Gray

.

Edited by CHAPUISARMES (22/10/11 07:45 PM)


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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: GK]
      #192321 - 22/10/11 07:40 PM

Quote:

Excellent pick up TM, it looks like the perfect project for you as I can remember you were always after a BRNO in 9.3x62. But what's going to happen to the 9.3x62 SAKO?

This is the sort of rifle I need to stumble onto, as I've tried to buy three ZKK's as donnor actions
and I have ended up not being able to pull them apart.

Thanks for the clear pics of the early peep sight design, the locking screw should never have been deleted. I imagine that it will be a real headache to re-assemble the sight with twin return springs as one is bad enough.

George




Thanks George

Yes, I was utterly amazed to see it in amongst a job lot of other guns that had obviously been stacked 'out the back' of the regional dealer waiting for the annual Bendigo Arms and Militaria Show. It also had a set of Talley QD mounts in similar condition... they are sound but will be brought back to the white in a grit to match the rest of the rifle.

Ah, yes... the Sako AV 9.3x62mm will stay with me, just not to be used as a general knock-about hunting rifle. It was in mint condition when I got it with a very nice fiddle back grained stock, but was getting too damaged when chasing Sambar in the sort of heavy country they like. So the ZKK will fill that role now...

Agree the early pop-up peep sights are the one to go for, the lock screw is a very good feature as are the twin assist springs... they mean the sight is very solid when in the up position, the later sights with only one assist spring tend to rock a little side-to-side when up.

Aha... easy when you know how, like getting the assist spring, ball bearings and button into the ZKK cocking piece

Both types of peep sights have assist springs with corresponding recess(es) in the receiver and in the underside of the sight body.

With the action held level horizontally in a padded vice, put the springs into position in the receiver, then lower the sight body onto them, (making sure the release button and other parts are correctly oriented) Use fine pointed tweezers if needed to get everything located.

Push downwards and use a pin punch to centre and locate the retaining pin holes... also acts as a guide.

Insert retaining pin and gently tap into receiver using another pin punch... it will gradually drive the other one out. May have to wiggle the sight assembly a little but it all usually goes together in one try... without half a dozen tiny irreplaceable parts being spring-assisted into the farthest darkest corners of your workshop


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GK
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #192327 - 22/10/11 09:38 PM

Hi Jeff,
I had stumbled on both of these. The .270 would have been good but I prefer the other type of stock and I think its a bit overpriced for a donor (esp. given the stock).
I will however be keeping an on the auction.
Regards
George


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AdamTayler
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: GK]
      #194719 - 24/11/11 01:51 PM

Looking forward to the finished work!

--------------------
It's the journey, not the destination.


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Igorrock
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: AdamTayler]
      #199210 - 12/01/12 05:34 AM

Does anybody know BRNO 602 barrel threat ? Is it compatible with m98 Mauser?

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FATBOY404
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: Igorrock]
      #199215 - 12/01/12 06:37 AM

Quote:

Does anybody know BRNO 602 barrel threat ? Is it compatible with m98 Mauser?




No it isn't mate.

--------------------
"WHATEVER BLOWS YOUR HAIR BACK"


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tophet1
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: FATBOY404]
      #199217 - 12/01/12 07:34 AM

Any chance on some progress photos ?

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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: tophet1]
      #199267 - 12/01/12 07:04 PM

Sure John...

Will take some on the weekend, I'm finally back in Australia after the Ranger launch in Thailand and have some more time for projects at last!

Status is nearly all the metalwork is in the white down to 320 grit, will start on the Talley QD mounts this weekend. Coming up nicely.

Boyd's Classic pepper laminate stock has arrived, will be sent off with the barrelled action for inletting on Monday.

Remember this will be a specific Sambar rifle, and will be used hard on extended Alpine backpacking trips 'behind the gates'. I had a nice piece of fiddleback Qld walnut earmarked for this project but the scrub country is just too hard on quality timber stocks, hence the laminate... one less worry.

Once back from inletting will take the metal down to 400 grit and hot tank blue via Bob De Vries at Kudu Services to match the job he did on my ZKK600 .270 Win.

Zeiss Conquest 1.8-5.5x38mm scope has arrived and will be pretty much perfect for this calibre in low light conditions in Talley QD mounts, backed up by the pop-up peep (which is surprisingly accurate on my .270).


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CHAPUISARMES
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #199269 - 12/01/12 07:25 PM


Hi Tilleyman,

That sounds like a good combination and look forward to the pictures.

Cheers,

Jeff Gray

.


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tophet1
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: CHAPUISARMES]
      #199279 - 12/01/12 08:53 PM

Good to have you back in country and on-forum again.

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Rule303
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #199284 - 12/01/12 10:01 PM

TilleyMan,

That sounds like it is comming along well. Looking forward to the finnished product.


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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: Rule303]
      #199432 - 14/01/12 03:38 PM

Thanks for those kind words guys, it's good to be back

Some update photos...

Receiver will be bead blasted along with the pop-up peep sight parts, so not rubbed back.
The bolt took a LOT of work to get sorted 'someone' had filed off the top surface unevenly to clear a scope, and there was significant galling under the extractor collar
Safety lever still to be done...


A few small rust pits still to remove from the trigger guard, but otherwise looking good:


The image below shows the difference between the M98 extractor and one from a CZ550 that I bought as a spare part to replace the incorrect M98 one fitted. Note the CZ550 extractor is ~5mm longer and is almost exactly the same as a ZKK600 one... good to know if you need a replacement, don't know about the shorter ZKK601, maybe a M98 Kurtz?


Matching 320 abrasive paper on the Tally QD rings


Edited by CptCurl (13/03/12 10:04 PM)


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CHAPUISARMES
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #199436 - 14/01/12 04:12 PM

Hi Tilleyman,

Welcome back home, the project is looking good and starting to take shape.

Cheers,

Jeff Gray

.


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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: CHAPUISARMES]
      #212761 - 15/07/12 08:09 PM

Righto... the ZKK project is FINALLY complete!

Now I'm as much a fan of fine walnut on a stock as most here on Nitro Express, but this rifle was built to take hard work in its stride hence the Boyd's Pepper laminate stock and non-traditional finishes

Barrelled action back from hot tank blueing by Bob De Vries at Kudu Services (to match my ZKK600 .270)

Stock was stippled using a 3mm Dremel tool, then two pack marine sealer applied.


Wet sanded and then two coats of satin finish marine urethane sprayed on.
Action bedded in Devcon Plastic Steel, with a block just under the fore-end to help stabilise the barrel when using the sling as a support.
Tally crossbolts were blued to match the rest of the rifle, in a laminate stock should be very strong.









Note the correct length extractor installed... CZ550 9.3x62mm spare part has restored the trademark ZKK action smoothness along with a M98 extractor collar. Feeds anything smoothly!

Scope is the now-discontinued 1.8-5.5x38mm Zeiss Conquest... compact, sharp and clear.

I decided to try the Alaska Arms QD mounts at $129.99... very happy with them.


Superbly finished, a quarter turn has the scope off in seconds and it will return to zero.


Need to order the 0.5" height to clear a non-modified ZKK bolt handle and a Euro style quick focus scope ocular.
http://www.alaskaarmsllc.com/

Now... the acid test, how does it shoot?!
Headed off to the range this morning with one box of Highland 286gr factory rounds, one box of Norma 286gr PP factory, and some reloads.
270gr Speer, 286gr Hornady, 286gr Nosler Partition and the 250gr Nosler Accubond all in front of RL-15 powder.

Wind gusting all over the place had my testing shortened a little, I will finish the Noslers next range trip.

Got on paper using the Highlands (Privi in the US) but suffered 4 hangfires out of a box of 20 Normally Highland is reasonably good quality but things seem to have suffered recently!
Only grouped about 2" at 100m.

The Norma 285 PP factory offering was unfortunately very accurate indeed... but at over $70 a box its not really plinking fodder


Speer 270gr in front of 58.0gr RL-15 which shoots into one ragged hole in my Sako AV was not that great in the Brno ZKK. Quite tight groups laterally but pronounced vertical stringing not evident with other loads. I'll check this load again next trip shooting more slowly and ensure the barrel cools off properly.

The Hornady 286gr again in front of 58.0gr RL-15 showed the most promise with three shots almost clover leafing at 100m and a couple of fliers... that I think I pulled when someone next to me fired a 20" barrelled WSM



Anyway... hope you have enjoyed the build, I'm pretty happy with the result.
The real test comes very soon, when I'm backpacking into the Victorian Alps chasing Sambar for a week.
Hopefully I'll blood it on a decent stag

Edited by CptCurl (02/12/12 12:22 AM)


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AFRO408
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #212762 - 15/07/12 08:49 PM

Very, very nice job, Tillyman.
The good ones take time, eh.

--------------------
Flinch ? Wot flinch ? Gunsmithing is my PASSION.


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Ben
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: AFRO408]
      #212763 - 15/07/12 09:25 PM

Good stuff.

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Rule303
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: Ben]
      #212767 - 15/07/12 11:51 PM

Well done TM. Verygood job on the stock and refinnishing the rifle.

Now to go shoot something with it.


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DarylS
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: Rule303]
      #212787 - 16/07/12 02:23 AM

Looks very nice - same stock I put on my Daughter's .260 Rem. Your's looks MUCH better!! I need to do some slimming on her rifle - thanks for some ideas.

Some questions:
Is the barrel bedded in glass for 1/2" to a max of 1" ahead of the action?

Did you relieve the bedded from directly underneath, in front of and on each side of the recoil lug? Contact in any of these areas is normally not deemed to be good from an accuracy standpoint.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: DarylS]
      #212795 - 16/07/12 06:36 AM

Thanks for those kind words everyone... it was nice to be able to take the time to do the job properly.
I guess I was trying to keep the feel of the old stock with a 21st Century nod towards the Mauser Oberndorf Type A

Daryl... yes, the action is bedded for about 1" around the front screw and recoil lug and under the rear tang. Front and sides were relieved with tape but the bottom was left in contact... from my experience ZKK's seem to prefer it.

Then around 1" of contact just back from the fore-end, two thin pieces of cardboard were wedged under the barrel as the Devcon set to give a small amount of preload.


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DarylS
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #212862 - 17/07/12 01:26 AM

Sounds good, but now, due to the grouping, I'd try removing the forend tip pressure and see if that eliminates the vertical stringing. I know some guns like it (aparently), but something is causing the stringing - either the tip pressure or the bedding under the lug - perhaps.
Of course, load components, ie: primers and slightly high or low loading can also cause stringing. One merely eliminates the causes, one by one.

I completely floated my 7x57 M600 barrel ahead of the 1" chamber bedding and the .358 Norma and .375 BRNO's 602's behind and ahead of the front recoil lug (devcon bedded) and they all rewarded me with sub inch (mostly 1/2" or less for all) grouping at 100 yards(602's) and meters (7x57) off the bags. The really nice aspect about their grouping, was that a barrel running cold to too hot to handle had absolutely no effect on the grouping capabilities - on any of them.

With the .358 NM I actually beat a 6x47 BR Sporter group for group one afternoon in the 70's I was shooting 250gr. Speers and my largest 5 shot group was just over .250".

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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TilleyMan
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: DarylS]
      #212891 - 17/07/12 12:04 PM

Hi Daryl

That's astonishing accuracy from your .358NM!

There's a bit of a back story to my bedding decision...

I'm sure the fore-end bedding has some influence on the vertical stringing... my question is do any of your very accurate Brno ZKK's have the barrel band swivel?

I had no end of trouble bedding a ZKK601 .308 with integral barrel band sling swivel.

Orginally bedded as you recommend, with a fully floating barrel, it would change POI if carried even a short distance!

Barrel harmonics changed at the range if a sling was mounted or not.
The barrel would also visibly flex if the sling was looped over the left elbow as a brace when shooting offhand.

I never felt I could trust it completely... so it stayed in the safe.

I like a barrel mounted swivel as it enables a much lower profile when pushing through heavy tea-tree or dogwood scrub. My Sako AV 9.3x62 has a traditional stock mounted swivel which made the barrel about 5" higher so the front sight and hood were always catching on things overhead. Annoying.

So for this particular rifle, which will be carried a lot up and down some very rugged and remote hills and not fired a great deal, I'm willing to accept some vertical stringing so long as the first couple of shots out of a cold barrel are consistent.

Cheers

TM


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DarylS
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Re: Brno ZKK 600 9,3x62mm Project [Re: TilleyMan]
      #212927 - 18/07/12 01:42 AM

I understand the situation.

The only rifle I had a barrel band swivel on, was my .458 2". That rifle's quite heavy, stubby 22" barrel didn't seem effected, but - I never shot it using the sling for support, only for carry.

When using a sling for support in shooting, I believe the sling should be attached to the forend and the barrel fully floated so as to not effect the barrel's direction nor harmonics. You must check to see that the forend does not bend over to touch the wood when the sling is tight.

It is surprising how little tension it takes to bend a barrel and thus throw shots.

I use a long enough loop on the sling so the muzzle, even of my 25" .275, sits at or below my head when I carry it. My right hand is on the sling (or stock if I am carrying it in front of me, to prevent the gun from moving or slapping me when walking.

The front carry is interesting, as the gun is then usually carried on the left side, with left hand on the forestock. If needed quickly, the hand is already where it needs to be to shoot the rifle. Simply place the right hand on the wrist as you rotate the rifle butt up onto your shoulder as the left hand aims the rifle and it is instantly aligned with your intended target s the butt comes into your shoulder.

I will switch to that method when in areas where game might be seen at any time - it allows a faster presentation than about any other carry, except for double handed. At least with only one hand, the left, on the forestock, your right is free for tree branch deflection.

True - the first 1 to 3 shots being accurate are the vital ones.
Best wishes

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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