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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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gryphon
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Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
how accurate is the ave double
      #50780 - 24/02/06 09:18 PM

At say 80 yards and out to 100 yards for example,is the average priced double as good a shooter as an expensive one?By this i mean accuracy not style or addons.

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
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Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50782 - 24/02/06 10:03 PM

Gryphon:
The Scott-built Rodda I just acquired is around 110 years old and cost less than 1/2 the cheapest new SxS double (Baikal excluded!), yet it will do this at 55 yds:

First two shots overlapped, second 2 shots touching!


My Jeffery .400 puts every shot into 1 1/2 inches at 55 yds all day, with most into an inch. That's a 6-inch group at 200 yds easily, and with open sights remember.

The Wilkes-made Manton .470 I picked up a while back will do this at 55 yds:



To answer your question though, there are probably really good ones and not so good ones in any price bracket. If you hand-load, you can tweak the loads a lot to improve regulation, provided the barrel-groups are good.

Several of the cheaper new doubles are adjustable via a jack-screw or wedge between the barrels. Provided each barrel groups well, these should be the most accurate doubles possible, at least in theory! The Krieghoff 9.3 belonging to my mate Bruce K_ would shoot extremely accurate groups if he'd only stop tinkering with it!

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
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DarylS
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: Marrakai]
      #50814 - 25/02/06 06:07 AM

That's vry nice accuracy, but they both need higher front sights. Are those available?

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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: DarylS]
      #50816 - 25/02/06 06:24 AM


Darryl

We don't all shoot at the Bull as it is sometime harder to
see that if you aim at 12 or 6 o'clock.

Also, by shooting at the 12 or 6 o'clock you can generally
get 4 - 8 pairs of clearly distinguishable shots per target

Front Sights are available.


500 Nitro

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gryphon
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Reged: 01/01/03
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Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: 500Nitro]
      #50834 - 25/02/06 08:19 AM

Tar for answers but what could a good shooter expect at 100 yards with a scoped double of some reasonable quality, can i expect accuracy to take a deer size head shot at around the 100y mark with confidence...mind you i dont run a tack holer or at least dont try and extract the smallest possible group either even though my bolt actions are capable of such.

I have seen scoped D rifles in my SCI mags and have never really got a super straight answer.The following over a rest eh! And just with ordinary hunting ammo out of the factory.

IE: Bolt 416 whatever = ? in possible group sizes

double 416 whatever = ? in possible group sizes

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davem3
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Reged: 10/02/04
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Loc: birmingham,al usa
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50835 - 25/02/06 08:22 AM

Smokeless for black loads in my G. Little DR. at 50 yds.
I have never gotten this accuracy untill I tried a smokeless load and I expect it is because I can't duplicate the BP load/ballistics in current brass.

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5307
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: davem3]
      #50837 - 25/02/06 09:08 AM

Davem3,

I think I recognize that load in your .500 BPE. I'm glad it's still working so well.

Earlier thread by Davem3

Best regards,
Curl

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RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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NE450No2
.375 member


Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 942
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: davem3]
      #50840 - 25/02/06 10:39 AM

davem3
Nice shooting.
From what I have read the problem with getting BPE rifles to shoot good is that todays black powder is not near as "good" as the British black powder "of the day".
However as you know, and have done, with Nitro for Black loads they can be made to shoot as good, maybe even better that when the left the maker.

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3652
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50843 - 25/02/06 11:30 AM

Gryphon:
From my own experience, which may differ from others, I would expect a scoped big-bore bolt-rifle to shoot 5 shots into 1" to 1.5" at 100 yds. I would expect a modern scoped big-bore double to put 6 shots into 1.5" to 2.5" at 100 yds. Many will do better of course. My experience with scoped rifles of any configuration is limited though, so happy to defer to the wisdom of others.

Unscoped vintage or older Brit and European doubles are subject to many factors which affect accuracy of course, particularly remaining bore condition, but it is pleasing to find that many are still tack-holers despite the ravages of time.

Nice groups with the Little .500, Dave. A case in point!

Also, many of you will have seen this story, but I love tossing it up whenever the opportunity arises! Long Shot

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
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NE450No2
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: Marrakai]
      #50844 - 25/02/06 11:57 AM

Marrakai
Re: Long Shot.
Well done, and well told.
Like you I have found the flip up sights on my British Doubles to be spot on, to 300 yards on my 450/400 and to 200 yards with my 450 No2, longest distance fired with each rifle.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: Marrakai]
      #50845 - 25/02/06 12:35 PM


Marrakai,

That story brings back some memories. I look alot
thinner in the photo than I am now !!!

That was one of the longest shots with a double I have seen.

I was talking to Marty last night about it and
getting back up to see you and have a beer.

Speak soon.

500 Nitro

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gryphon
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: Marrakai]
      #50853 - 25/02/06 02:49 PM

Tar for that M,interested in what the other fellas reckon too of course.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50865 - 26/02/06 12:24 AM

My 9.3 puts two shots from each barrel touching at 50 metres and sometimes also at 100 metres. I regulated the barrels to shoot approximately 20 mms apart (the top barrel being higher, it being an U/O) at 100 metres.



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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50868 - 26/02/06 12:54 AM

grypon,

You asked about accuracy for a scoped DR.

I have a Josef Winkler DR in .300 Win. Mag. that is topped with a 1.5-5 Pentax in QD lever mounts.



It consistently places 4 shots (2R + 2L) into 1.25" at 100 yards. That's pretty good accuracy in my book.

Curl



--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: CptCurl]
      #50871 - 26/02/06 01:23 AM

Curl

What is the weight of that lovely .300 double rifle?

Also what sort of velocity of loads / bullet weight can you put through it?

Thanks.



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John aka NitroX

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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: NitroX]
      #50881 - 26/02/06 04:25 AM

It's just shy of 10 pounds with the scope on.

The rifle is regulated for the 220 grain round nose bullet, and it doesn't want to shoot anything else. That's just fine with me; I wouldn't have it any other way.

My load is:

80.0 grains Hodgdon Retumbo
Hornady 220 RN
CCI-250

It clocks 2748 fps over the chronograph.

As always, reduce loads appropriately and work up. Hodgdon's manual lists the max load at 81.0 grains.

This raises an interesting story about load development for this rifle. I think I'll start a new thread about it.

BTW, "lovely" is a bit over-indulging for this rifle. It's not "ugly" but I wouldn't go so far as to say "lovely". Nevertheless, it is "lovely" in performance.

Curl



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YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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gryphon
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: CptCurl]
      #50886 - 26/02/06 06:59 AM

I am not much for the drop stock style of that rifle CCurl,i believe that in conjunction with a scope the shooter dosent get to bed his cheek into the stock as well as a straight stocked rifle.... this type dosent give the support with it being so low and the shooter has to lift to line up the c/hairs....nothing against your rifle as a double as i believe the same for any type of rifle stocked this way..double,bolt any of them.
This style is also not so good with the real big bangers recoil wise and thats according to what all the apparent experts from around the world tell us


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bonanza
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Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50895 - 26/02/06 09:38 AM

.375 H&H six shots at 50yrds


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"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

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gryphon
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Reged: 01/01/03
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: bonanza]
      #50896 - 26/02/06 09:41 AM

So that would be about 2 1/2 inches ?

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bonanza
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Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: CptCurl]
      #50897 - 26/02/06 09:44 AM

Curl,

If you decide to sell that 300, let me know.

B.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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bonanza
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Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: how accurate is the ave double [Re: gryphon]
      #50898 - 26/02/06 09:46 AM

2.35"

Same load is 2.25" at 100yrds, still in the X ring.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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