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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: Ruger No 1 303
      18/08/11 07:59 AM

Somewhere in my materials I have a short note in American Rifleman from the '50's identifying Finnish State Rifle Factory experiments with bore wear.

Included is an interesting graph of tracked accuracy over the course of the experiments with 7.62x53R ammunition.

Summary is this; As long as bullets were sized to GROOVE depth, the amount of BORE/LAND wear was relatively irrelevant AND ACCURACY STANDARDS WERE THUS MAINTAINED TO 35,000, YES, THIRTY-FIVE THOUSAND ROUNDS SHOT THRU THE GUNS.

The key here was that accuracy fell off due to bore/land wear in conjunction with increasing groove depth due to surface erosion. Since there was less and less "land" to grab the bullet, and more and more "looseness" around the bullet due to erosion of the bottom of the grooves, the bullet needed to "grow", and if it did, thru the use of bigger bullets, accuracy was just fine. This is NOT the same thing as shooting undersize bullets in a barrel possessing proper bore diameter with excessive groove diameter. Such barrels often shoot very well indeed, at least as long as they are relatively new.

The accuracy standard of the time was 3-shots into 3cm at 100 meters IIRC.

If somebody calls me a liar I'll be forced to go mining for the information to prove what I am saying here. I may have to quit my job and stock up on rations for the extended stay in the basement rooting thru old moldy AR magazines, and it might take me some months but I can probably locate it.

Daryl and I can both vouch for the accuracy of oversize barrels with undersize bullets in our 9.3x57's. But our barrels have in-spec bores {land diameter} tho having obese groove depths. As long as those lands hold up we'll do just fine. If they wear, I suspect accuracy will then fall off precipitously. Of course, both of us have sizing dies which we can use to custom fit bullets which we do now as a matter of fact. This merely being identical work to what the Finns accomplished and proved in the State Rifle Factory experiments.

That is why I wondered about Ruger's dimensions. If they are spinning out .303/.315 barrels all should be fine with .311 bullets for quite a bit of shooting.

But if they have , let's say, .306 or more land diameters with .315 grooves, things might be henky right off the bat. In such a case you have less grab on the bullet shank and none around it. Mere groove depth not being the problem.

I'd sure like to see what fellows are getting for land diameter of slugged Ruger No.1 barrels.

Also, IIRC, Ruger rifling form is narrow lands, wide grooves, yes? Check the rifling form. This type is likely least able to handle oversize LAND diameter as there is just not much metal there to engrave the bullet.



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What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Edited by 9.3x57 (18/08/11 09:58 AM)

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* Ruger No 1 303 underlever 29/10/10 06:14 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   08/11/10 10:30 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 baileybradshaw   09/11/10 12:14 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 hunter_angler   09/11/10 04:09 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CWJ1898   21/11/10 01:15 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rockdoc   21/11/10 02:23 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   21/11/10 02:55 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rockdoc   21/11/10 05:50 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   26/01/11 06:28 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Con   27/01/11 10:10 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Oldbrit   16/05/11 09:42 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 portdivers   16/05/11 11:44 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   17/05/11 07:11 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 AdamTayler   18/05/11 11:34 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 bwanabobftw   18/05/11 12:21 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   18/05/11 12:35 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 AdamTayler   20/05/11 12:01 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   30/06/11 06:53 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Nyati404   22/07/11 11:40 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 underlever   17/08/11 08:58 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   17/08/11 09:15 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   17/08/11 11:08 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   17/08/11 11:45 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   18/08/11 08:12 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   18/08/11 10:49 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   20/08/11 07:09 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   20/08/11 10:44 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   20/08/11 11:03 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 HuviusModerator   21/08/11 12:23 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   21/08/11 09:04 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   21/08/11 12:32 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 underlever   21/08/11 09:53 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   24/08/11 11:04 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   26/08/11 09:13 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   26/08/11 10:57 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   28/08/11 07:15 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   28/08/11 11:09 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   01/09/11 08:47 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   28/10/11 07:43 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   29/10/11 07:28 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   18/11/11 10:16 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Brithunter   20/11/11 02:54 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   20/11/11 03:17 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   20/11/11 10:08 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   21/11/11 07:02 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   25/11/11 01:04 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Brithunter   25/11/11 01:26 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   26/11/11 05:23 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 wjw   26/11/11 10:09 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Phillip   24/01/12 10:32 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Brithunter   21/11/11 10:44 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Brithunter   08/11/11 01:17 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   08/11/11 03:13 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 TilleyMan   09/11/11 10:18 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 tophet1   09/11/11 10:42 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   09/11/11 04:22 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Brithunter   21/11/11 10:59 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 bonanza   09/11/11 11:03 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   10/11/11 02:31 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 TilleyMan   13/11/11 01:41 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Phillip   13/11/11 11:16 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   14/11/11 03:44 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 TilleyMan   14/11/11 08:25 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   15/11/11 03:46 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 TilleyMan   03/09/11 05:06 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   03/09/11 06:16 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   20/10/11 07:00 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   21/10/11 02:20 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 TilleyMan   21/10/11 01:06 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   22/10/11 02:17 AM
. * * Ruger No 1 303 ,now London proof Mike_Bailey   01/09/11 10:57 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 ,now London proof 450   03/09/11 03:50 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   25/08/11 12:42 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 kuduae   25/08/11 05:12 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   25/08/11 05:39 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 HuntingSchneider   25/08/11 02:36 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   26/08/11 02:08 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Classic416   21/08/11 10:28 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   24/08/11 01:48 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   23/08/11 06:44 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   18/08/11 11:18 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   19/08/11 12:37 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   19/08/11 02:58 AM
. * * Well I just bought one..... crusty   19/08/11 11:53 AM
. * * Re: Lee-Enfield .303 Accuracy Standards 9.3x57   19/08/11 10:56 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   17/08/11 11:53 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   18/08/11 01:16 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   18/08/11 02:18 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   18/08/11 03:39 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   31/08/11 09:20 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 radin   24/08/11 09:42 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Mike_Bailey   18/08/11 04:13 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 belgmart   24/08/11 04:27 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   24/08/11 09:25 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   18/08/11 06:00 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   18/08/11 06:35 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 9.3x57   18/08/11 07:59 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   18/08/11 10:02 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 tophet1   18/08/11 07:43 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   18/08/11 01:09 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 bonanza   15/07/11 11:10 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   16/07/11 10:48 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 bonanza   16/07/11 11:36 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   17/07/11 12:23 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 xausa   17/07/11 01:41 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   17/07/11 02:28 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 DarylS   17/07/11 03:22 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   16/07/11 11:35 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CHAPUISARMES   30/06/11 07:02 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   01/07/11 05:57 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CHAPUISARMES   01/07/11 06:37 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 450   15/07/11 07:05 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   15/07/11 07:18 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   18/05/11 08:56 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Rule303   15/07/11 10:58 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 CptCurlAdministrator   16/07/11 10:41 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   17/05/11 07:31 AM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 eagle27   21/11/10 03:45 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   29/10/10 07:32 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 underlever   31/10/10 09:56 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 bonanza   31/10/10 11:30 PM
. * * Re: Ruger No 1 303 Ben   31/10/10 10:44 PM

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