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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns

gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g
      24/03/10 03:22 PM

When a bullet begins to transition from supersonic to subsonic it becomes unstable and erratic. Accuracy is greatly diminished. A lead Paradox bullet leaving the muzzle at 1250 is going to become subsonic somewhere close to 125 yards. So, yes, the faster bullet will have more kinetic energy within 100 yards but will not be of much practical use far beyond that because of accuracy issues.





I tend to believe as does Daryl that the paradox conicals are not as greatly affected as you might think. Here are the results from Holland testing completed in 1905:



Ross Seyfied wrote in the Spring 2006 DGJ of a killing shot on an elk at 250yds using a 1250fps Explora capped bullet fired from a 71/4lb Explora.





The cost to getting the big bullets to go that fast is, as you mentioned, a heavier gun. My 1911 'Royal' ejector with a 15" stock weighs 7 pounds, 3 ounces, my 'Royal' non-ejector with a shorter stock is about 7 pounds even.

7 pounds is light for a paradox 7.25 pounds or an once or two more is about right. I have a magnum that is under 8 pounds but it has 26” barrels. Is the "Paradox" a birdgun that kills game or borerifle that fires shot?


The H&H magnum 'Paradox' guns were advertised as weighing 8 to 8-1/4 pounds and they probably handled accordingly. Whether or not the additional energy is worth having a heavier gun is a matter of preference. The standard Paradox seems capable of taking any thin skinned game and I don't think a 1250fps bullet of soft construction would be a good choice for thick skinned game.

Your forgetting the beauty of the paradox; matching the ammunition to the intended use.




Westley loaded a heavy slug for use on heavier game animals. The capped bullets and increased velocity were needed to increase the range of the ball and shotgun.

With little additional usefulness to be gained from the faster bullet, I would rather retain the 7 pound "bird gun" handling qualities of the standard Nitro-Paradox gun.


Fosbury saw the benefits and the shortcomings of the smoothbore ball and shotgun. He increased its range patterning and usefulness Leslie Taylor did the same for the Holland Paradoxgun and Holland t followed suit.

The WR Super Magnum Explora bullet is a different story. With a muzzle velocity of 1500fps it wouldn't become subsonic till way out there. That would mean a considerable increase in both energy and effective range. The 1910 H&H catalog lists a Long Range Paradox with similar results. I would imagine that all these guns must have weighed well over 8 pounds but I don't know. I have never seen nor handled one.


They are great guns. Probably less than 100 Westley's made, you need one

Edited by gatsby (24/03/10 03:37 PM)

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Subject Posted by Posted on
* conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge guns? doubleriflejack 07/03/10 05:37 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge guns? gatsby   07/03/10 07:07 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge guns? jaz   07/03/10 09:56 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge guns? gatsby   07/03/10 10:30 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge guns? tinkerModerator   07/03/10 03:39 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g calpappas   16/03/10 01:16 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g DarylS   17/03/10 01:24 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g Grenadier   17/03/10 05:49 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g DarylS   17/03/10 01:25 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g Grenadier   18/03/10 01:07 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g gatsby   18/03/10 05:25 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g DarylS   19/03/10 01:54 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g Grenadier   23/03/10 10:25 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g gatsby   24/03/10 03:22 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g Grenadier   24/03/10 06:05 PM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g gatsby   25/03/10 02:04 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g DarylS   25/03/10 03:21 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g DarylS   24/03/10 06:37 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g Grenadier   24/03/10 10:27 AM
. * * Re: conical bullet weight for paradox like guns, and gauge g gatsby   18/03/10 10:24 AM

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