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eagle27: Something is wrong here! Though COTW is notoriously incomplete and unreliable regarding old European cartridges, it is right on the 10.5x 47R! W.B.Dixon wrote a whole 196 page book on "European Sporting Cartridges", listing umpteen cartridges on the "MB" m71 Mauser .511" base, ranging in caliber from 8 to 12.5mm and in length from 28 to 80 mm. There were 7 in 45mm, 9 in 46mm, 24 in 47mm and 2in 49mm lengths! Calibers available in these lengths between 10 and 11 mm were 10.0; 10.25, 10.5, 10.75, 10.8 and 11mm. To further confuse things, many of these cases existed with different shoulder shapes and positions!Apparently every country gunsmith designed his own proprietary cases to ensure his customers coming back to him for resupply. All were black powder, lead bullet numbers. Most of them were obsolete by 1910.
The "G" or Gruendig series of rimmed cartridges were completely different. All were on a base of 12.48mm = .491", with a conventional rim of 13.7mm = .539" and were straight taper. They came in lengths of 45, 52, 60 and 65mm. All were smokeless loads from the start and used the same 347gr 10.75mm jacketed bullet. What was the reasoning behind these weak and slow big bore cartridges? They, except the longest ones, were meant for woods hunting in Germany. About 1900, many hunters who hunted woodlands with open sights only abhorred the idea of those new-fangled 6.5 to 9.3 mm "knitting needle" bullets. They desired the big entrance holes and minimal meat destruction of the old 11mm blackpowders and were quite contend with the low velocities and curved trajectories, but saw the advantages of smokeless loads as reduced fouling and smoke. To satisfy their demands the shorter "G" cartridges were designed.

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German foresters: We like sustainability! For merely 300 years by 2013.

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