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I believe the .700 has always suffered from a lack of penetration compared to the .577 because the diameter of the bullet is so large while the velocity is similar, which is why the .450s -.500s penetrate better. Of course penetration and shock are not the same thing though, so the .700 should deliver plenty of shock, but perhaps not in the correct place to knock out the elephant in question!

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Gentlemen I think Jabalihunter has hit the nail on the head here! There is a long drive from the skin on the nose of a bull elephant to the brain in the back of the head. The profile of the big .700 blunt nosed solid bullet, along with the low velocity no higher that the 577NE, IMO, is the problem with the 700NE. The 577NE sometimes has a penetration problem, and the 500NE is far better on Elephant that either of the larger rounds. The old .450s of all configurations is what set the mark for shooting elephant afther the Cordite came out.

An elephant, unlike the cape buffalo,is usually turned by any big slap in the face. That is one of the two things a "STOPPER" is needed for. Not necessarily to kill the elephant, though that is the ultimate goal, stopping the charge is the most immediate need. In this case the .700 did that. However, if this had been a 500NE it would have likely either stopped him in his tracks,giveing time for a second frontal brain shot, or knocked him out if the first shot was close to the brain.

We were standing about twelve yards from a big bull ele in Botwana, when a friend of mine poped him in the face with a 500NE double rifle. The shot missed the brain enough to turn the bull, but not put him down. By pre-arranged precedure the PH and I were to shoot the heart/lung area if he turned, because we were near the park boundry. As he turned I poped him in the heart with a 500/450 Westley Richards double, and the PH hit him about the same place with a 470NE. That was all for naught, because my friend hit the bull behind the ear at the base of the neck, coursing into the brain dumping the bull in a cloud of red dust. So all in all, close to the brain doesn't always knock them out, but it certainly, in my experience will turn them, which is the most immediate need!

There is nothing wrong with haveing a .700NE double rifle if you can afford a toy that expensive,but size is not a fix all for everything, and just like those who want to use rifles that are too small for big animals, those who use one that is too big to be practical, both can be detramental to you extended life expectancy. Both are day dreamers toys, but are legitimate persuits to those who want, and can afford them.

Bigdog has some of the largest double rifles, and bolt rifle you can name, and all are beautifully made, and shoot well. His 2bore double is not only beautifull, but shoots well to boot. I have handled that 26 pound double, and it is awesome, But not my cup of tea, but certainly holds a prominent place in the gun world, for those who like all firarms!

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..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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