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The most exotic german medium bore cartridge is the 11,2x60 Schueler, since I am looking for a rifle heard only about four worldwide. One is standing in my safe.
The next after this is the 10,75x57(also called Mannlicher), since yesterday one of seven rifle’s I found till now stand’s next to my schueler rifle. one year ago I was talking with my gunmaker about making a new rifle for the small 10,75 because it wasn’t possible to find an old gun. I talk with triebel about making a chamber reamer but then was an old M 88 sporting rifle in 9x57 Mauser crossing my way. Also on my to do list. It was expensive and asking a dealer about the price and btw telling him about my 10,75x57 project.
His answer: I have an 10,75 Geco and you can have a M 88 with a repaired stock for half of the money from me.
then I feel that a Husqvarna Mod.46 in 9,3x57 Mauser would make a good team with the other’s and order such a Swedish crown jewel in denmark. Build with mauser 94 action it give’s a nice medium bore evolution with the 10,75 x57 Mauser 98 rifle

German commission M 88, sporting rifle build with a Karabiner M 88 action 9x57Mauser
Swedish Husqvarna M 46 9,3x57
Mauser 98 sporting rifle from Geco 10,75x57
Mauser 98 sporting rifle from E. Steigleder 11,2x60 Schüler

The M 88 sporter is the nicest compare with the mauser actions
You see that the whole thing is a big disappointment , what I need now is a Mannlicher Schönauer in 9,5x56 to close the gap and there is also a Mannlicher M 93 (Rumänien Modell) in 375 NE 2,5” I know – very expensive.
And we will see what is coming from finland in the future

The action use the old style charger clip, when empty you open a trap door and remove it.

Most M 88 sporting rifle’s are build in Suhl from Haenel and Schilling. My rifle don’t have a name on it, under the barrel ,it looks very “haenel” like. The broken stock is old, I have no problems with this. It’s the history of the rifle! The checkering will cut again in future and this will change the situation something.
The 9x57 Mauser is the mother of all medium bore’s, in 1938 DWM load 5 different bullet’s for this.

After the war only the 16 gramm bullet was loaded as softpoint round and flat and full metal jacket round nose. Its my feeling that the 16 gramm bullet is the “right “ weigth, giving the best balance between case and bullet

This is very interesting: “Wichtig für die Kolonien“ important for the colony’s
For the german colony’s where its not allow to bring Rifles for the 8mm Military cartridge into the country we make the mauser sporting rifle’s also for the 9mm cartridge Mod. 88 (9x57)

I never see this before, Albrecht Kind catalog 1908

The tiger in the catalog wasn’t a joke:

M 88 have kill in action - a sporting rifle in Dutch east India on tiger and elefant, chance is very high that this was in 9x57 Mauser

The Mannlicher Schoenauer Mod 1905 in 9x56 MS was on the same level as the old 9x57 Mauser but the rifle cost 165 Mark against 82 Mark for a M 88 sporter. The quality of the Mannlicher was higher but this was not the argument for a farmer in the colony’s if you have the chance to buy a rifle for the half

Post war RWS load again with 18,2 gramm softpoint. In the 1962 DWM catalog only available while stock last,RWS also see the 9x57 as a dead cartridge. Of course the DWM and RWS post war ammo was in the old ballistic specification. Around 1973 only Kynoch ammo was available in germany. That how things are going on.

18,2 and 16gramm bullet are no longer available, Delsing and Degol in Europe make this on demand. American .358 bullets can be used and for plinking the .357 revolver bullet

Kemira loading data for the 9x57R, in all the same like the rimless round
Old copper crusher pressure 2500 bar, new pieco pressure is 2800 bar

The 9x57R was a favorit in belgium for light double rifles. The Belgian’s have build a lot of light doubles in 8x60RS, 9x57R and .35 WCF for the domestic market and FN in liege make ammo into the eighties. Found with FN or Browning headstamp.

The only recent CIP proofed load in 9x57

Wolfgang Romey in Horneber brass, 14,7 gramm, 225 grain softpoint

Its not nessesary to say so much about the husqvarna M 46, since the Swedish government was thinking its better torestrict gun ownership many of this fine sporting rifles have leave the country. With every rifle there goes also a little bit of Sweden.
The 9,3x57 history must be write from a Swedish collector once because I don’t find enough material about this cartridge. In the www not a single vintage pic with a moose hunt in Sweden.

because the action is drilled it will get a scope again, maybe an old Zeiss Ziel 6 with steal tube.

Norma is the only maker of this round and that’s what they says about:
“Interestingly, no one seems to be able to determine exactly when or by whom the 9.3x57 chambering was designed but it dates back to around 1900. This is nothing more or less than the 8x57J with the neck opened up to accept the then widely popular 0.366-inch bullets. Since it differs only by 0.008-inch in bullet diameter, this chambering is obviously similar in performance potential and range of applications to the 9x57 Mauser (which uses 0.358-inch bullets). Performance and design are also similar to the 9.5x57 Mannlicher, which has a differently shaped case. It is far more powerful than the rimmed cylindrical 9.3x57R. Several similar chamberings were common at the turn of the last century. Of these, only the 9.3x57 survives in common use. This chambering is still used all over Scandinavia for hunting driven moose and lesser species. The most common gun chambered for this round is the Husqvarna bolt action. This chambering has been nicknamed "The Potato Thrower" due to the fact that it launches a heavy bullet at moderate velocity and, therefore, produces a rainbow-like trajectory. With such popularity and such a good track record on game at typical driven ranges, it is likely to be with us for a good many years, despite the fact that no mainstream manufacturer now chambers it. Since no pressure standard exists for this number, we chose to use a relatively conservative 43,500-psi (3000 Bars) maximum pressure for loads presented
here.”

I understand that Norma means 3000 Bars with the new piezo pressure gauge. The old copper crusher method had have 2600 bar.
Norma factory loads
232grains ( 15.0 gramm) Full Metal Jacket
Velocity fps
0 100 200 300

2215 1930 1670 1440

232 grains( 15 gramm) Oryx

Velocity fps
0 100 200 300
Energy foot pounds
0 100 200 300

2362 2058 1778 1528
2875 2182 1630 1203

285 grains ( 18.5 gramm) Alaska

Velocity fps
0 100 200 300
Energy foot pounds
0 100 200 300

2067 1859 1666 1490
2704 2188 1756 1404

And Norma reloading data:

http://www.norma.cc/sortimentladd.asp?Kaliber=9,3x57&Lang=1#

RWS load, make 1944 in steel case

Between the wars Suhl make some Mauser 98 rifles in 9,3x57 for export to sweden. The firm Gustav Genschow and Co, a big ammunition maker(Geco) also having a firm in Suhl for making guns was very busy exporting rifles to Sweden. Most sporter coming to surface today are making from this firm. I don’t know if the Swedes value this higher than the common Husquarvna. The last one here, a G.G.&Co, make from Kaba (Karl Barthel, Suhl) is very similar with the 10,75x57 from Gustav Genschow, so similar that is possible also made from Karl Bartel for Genschow

A finnish Sako load is listed in 1972

You see in this Kemira list that the 9,3x53R runs a little bit higher than the 9,3x57 Mauser because the mosin can stand a little bit more than the Swedish M 94 action.
This kemira load is always indentical with the sako factory load that we can assume it is the sako factory load:

The 10,75 x57 was in production till WW 2 with the 10,75x63 and the 10,75x68. its also called 11mm Mod.88 meaning it have the 8x57 as mother case. In fact the 8x57 will be to short when necking up. I have made brass from 30 06 and it seems right. Don’t have the die set till now, barrel diameter is .4245 maximum.

the family:
10,75x52R Gründig(H.UTENDOERFFER NÜRNBERG)
10.75 x 52 R Mannlicher. (Hirtenberger) - 8x57R basic
10.75 x 63 Mauser. ( R.W.S. NÜRNBERG)
10.75 x 65 R Gründig. ( H.UTENDOERFFER NÜRNBERG)
10.75 x 68 Mauser. ( R.W.S. NÜRNBERG)
10.75 x 70 R Barella. (also called 10.75 mm Mauser ,DWM case list number for Stahl Suhl 495, G.C. Dornheim 495 A, H. Leue Berlin 495 B.
this one is made for Barella, gunmaker of the king of prussia
( B.BARELLA * BERLIN *)

Gründig from Dresden was gunmaker of the king of Saxony, his 10,75 mm cartridge family with 45mm, 52mm, 60mm and 65mm case length is more or less the rimmed version of the rimless cartridges with 57, 63 and 68 mm cases.
Would like to find a double for the 10,75x70R, Barella was a very busy man, work for a lot of foreign noble customers and explorer.

the same rifle again but without the stock screws , sold in Sweden, GECO must have been very busy in Sweden before the last war and they also send some 10,75 with the 9,3x57 mauser sporter.

543
KULGEVÄR, Tyskt, repeter, fabrikat: G.G & Co ÒKABAÓ, kal. 10,75x57, tillvnr. 1273, piplängd 62 cm, klaffsikte med ett fast och ett fällbart, halvoktagon pipa med hel spång, träkolven med pistolgrepp och kindstöd, bakelit bakkappa, tryckmärken på kolven, GOTT SKICK.
Såld för 3500 SEK

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Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
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bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by CptCurl (10/09/10 08:41 PM)

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