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I am right now re-reading the book Ndlovu of Rich Harland. Rich was in plenty of cullings and provide lots of advises.
Of course, no double rifle, because they are to slow to reload et the more ammos in the rifles the better.
Calibers : he insist on calibers from 416 and larger. On a practical point of view, 416 Rigby and 458 WM or 458 Lott. 505 Gibs is perfect but few rifles offer this caliber.

Barrel lenght : 28 inch too long, 20 inch perfect balance and handling in jesse.

Among the makers :

Weatherby : out, the bullets are way too fast and very prone to deflect or explode without penetrating.

Remington 700, lots of jammings and very tricky to reload, too slow when in action

Wincherster M70 : better with controlled feed instead of push-feed. The safety catch is on the wrong side, dangerous in action.

Ruger M77, OK but bedding required. Troubles with the 416 Rigby , it needs a stonger magazine spring.

Browning A Bold : Good, but trouble with closing the floor plate, the safety is excellent.

BRNO ZKK62 excellent

CZ : Good but safety the wrong way and wrong side. The 458 WM softs feed badly, too short for the large receiver, opt for the 44578 Lott. Bedding recommended.

Mannlicher Schoenauer : the very best, no discussion
approved by Don Heath.

BSA : top notch if pre 1967 with the serial number prefixed by 9C.

FN : top notch

English, careful : Westley Richards made “native” rifles very poor built on Mauser action. Same with Cogswell and Harrison with P14 actions.

Mauser : The rare Mauser magnum and Brevex are impossible to find.
Mauser Standard receiver :OK with 404 and 9.3x62. Other calibers are customization where the worst more than the best might occur.

Customized rifles : stay clear.


Reading that I wonder why the Sako insn’t tried.
I suppose that out of courtesy, Rich doesn’t mention Blaser, Sauer, Merkel, Heym……..

Finally some commentaries :
Barie Duckworth : "Had I used a double I'll be a deadman" (during ele culling)
Ivan Carter : " Had I used a repeater, I'll be dead" stopping a charging lion.

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Mr Harland wrote the book in 2001. He culled over 1200 elephants on control, best, Mike

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I am right now re-reading the book Ndlovu of Rich Harland. Rich was in plenty of cullings and provide lots of advises.
Of course, no double rifle, because they are to slow to reload et the more ammos in the rifles the better.
Calibers : he insist on calibers from 416 and larger. On a practical point of view, 416 Rigby and 458 WM or 458 Lott. 505 Gibs is perfect but few rifles offer this caliber.

Barrel lenght : 28 inch too long, 20 inch perfect balance and handling in jesse.

Among the makers :

Weatherby : out, the bullets are way too fast and very prone to deflect or explode without penetrating.

Remington 700, lots of jammings and very tricky to reload, too slow when in action

Wincherster M70 : better with controlled feed instead of push-feed. The safety catch is on the wrong side, dangerous in action.

Ruger M77, OK but bedding required. Troubles with the 416 Rigby , it needs a stonger magazine spring.

Browning A Bold : Good, but trouble with closing the floor plate, the safety is excellent.

BRNO ZKK62 excellent

CZ : Good but safety the wrong way and wrong side. The 458 WM softs feed badly, too short for the large receiver, opt for the 44578 Lott. Bedding recommended.

Mannlicher Schoenauer : the very best, no discussion
approved by Don Heath.

BSA : top notch if pre 1967 with the serial number prefixed by 9C.

FN : top notch

English, careful : Westley Richards made “native” rifles very poor built on Mauser action. Same with Cogswell and Harrison with P14 actions.

Mauser : The rare Mauser magnum and Brevex are impossible to find.
Mauser Standard receiver :OK with 404 and 9.3x62. Other calibers are customization where the worst more than the best might occur.

Customized rifles : stay clear.


Reading that I wonder why the Sako insn’t tried.
I suppose that out of courtesy, Rich doesn’t mention Blaser, Sauer, Merkel, Heym……..

Finally some commentaries :
Barie Duckworth : "Had I used a double I'll be a deadman" (during ele culling)
Ivan Carter : " Had I used a repeater, I'll be dead" stopping a charging lion.

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The comments on double rifles above are probably the difference between shooting a herd with an FN, no "sporting" attempt at all, just slaughter, including cows and calfs. Shoot multiple times until it drops, versus a sporting hunt or for example following up a beast into thick bush where it is waiting for the hunting.

After all, what do bastard poachers use, or protrayed to use, AK-47's in 7.62x39 full auto. Just blast away until the poor beast dies, even if the pathetic penetration of that inadequate cartridge. Elephant can ne killed with multiple spear hits too. Different story to a sporting and ethical kill.

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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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.458 bolt gun would be my choice from what I have around, but doubt the "friends of animals" types would let real culling start again, even where it is needed.

Anyone hear from Dan/500grains any time recently?

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Aren't elephant herds still culled in Zimbabwe? They were still being culled ten years ago in this manner when I was last there.

Dan spat the dummy here and "resigned" and asked to be deleted when I deleted a photo he posted of US soldiers urinating on muslim dead in Afghanistan. Claimed it was a free speech issue. I think it is just a decency issue and not needed on this forum. He decided to leave on his free will. Probably his tirade was prompted when I joked to him privately NE was one of few forums he wasn't banned from, after he listed all the forums he had been banned on. Immediately silly posts started after that ...

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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Sorry to hear that Dan is gone from here. Despite his quirks, he was quite knowledgeable on rifles and ele hunting.

Zimbabwe stopped the culling in Parks a good while back as I understand it. The do "ration" hunts, tuskless, and some non-trophy, non-export hunts but the culling you read about where they managed the numbers in the parks is a thing of the past so far as I know.

I may be off but that is my understanding.

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Dan voluntarily left. So if he reapplied he would probably be rejoined. His account probably still exists, but "turned off". I enjoyed his posts and regarded him as a friend up to that point.

Zim was ding a cull in Binga in 2006 when I was there. Of a herd of about forty two animals. I guess that is ten years ago now. Time flies.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Depends if we are talking about culling individual beasts or whole herds. Completely different scenarios.

Harland's comments below are contradictory somewhat ie as in .416 and heavier best, yet names the FN 7.62 (.308) as "top notch". The reason being the semi auto or full auto FN with a large twenty round magazine is useful in a herd situation. Where follow up shots to drop a beast are quick and readily available, or other animals, and magazine changes are quickly done. I guess the military spitzer FMJ ammunition here still worked, perhaps with multiple shots when needed. Even though the same sort of bullet is very much criticised in sporting ammunition and use???

Mannlicher Schoenauer, the "very best" - why?

Interesting he claims the safeties are on the wrong side even though most rights do have the safety on the right side??? Any comments of that?

Customised rifles - "stay clear". Stupid statement as a customised rifles is not "standard" and could be anything of what he either likes or dislikes ...

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I am right now re-reading the book Ndlovu of Rich Harland. Rich was in plenty of cullings and provide lots of advises.
Of course, no double rifle, because they are to slow to reload et the more ammos in the rifles the better.
Calibers : he insist on calibers from 416 and larger. On a practical point of view, 416 Rigby and 458 WM or 458 Lott. 505 Gibs is perfect but few rifles offer this caliber.

Barrel lenght : 28 inch too long, 20 inch perfect balance and handling in jesse.

Among the makers :

Weatherby : out, the bullets are way too fast and very prone to deflect or explode without penetrating.

Remington 700, lots of jammings and very tricky to reload, too slow when in action

Wincherster M70 : better with controlled feed instead of push-feed. The safety catch is on the wrong side, dangerous in action.

Ruger M77, OK but bedding required. Troubles with the 416 Rigby , it needs a stonger magazine spring.

Browning A Bold : Good, but trouble with closing the floor plate, the safety is excellent.

BRNO ZKK62 excellent

CZ : Good but safety the wrong way and wrong side. The 458 WM softs feed badly, too short for the large receiver, opt for the 44578 Lott. Bedding recommended.

Mannlicher Schoenauer : the very best, no discussion
approved by Don Heath.

BSA : top notch if pre 1967 with the serial number prefixed by 9C.

FN : top notch

English, careful : Westley Richards made “native” rifles very poor built on Mauser action. Same with Cogswell and Harrison with P14 actions.

Mauser : The rare Mauser magnum and Brevex are impossible to find.
Mauser Standard receiver :OK with 404 and 9.3x62. Other calibers are customization where the worst more than the best might occur.

Customized rifles : stay clear.


Reading that I wonder why the Sako insn’t tried.
I suppose that out of courtesy, Rich doesn’t mention Blaser, Sauer, Merkel, Heym……..

Finally some commentaries :
Barie Duckworth : "Had I used a double I'll be a deadman" (during ele culling)
Ivan Carter : " Had I used a repeater, I'll be dead" stopping a charging lion.

---

The comments on double rifles above are probably the difference between shooting a herd with an FN, no "sporting" attempt at all, just slaughter, including cows and calfs. Shoot multiple times until it drops, versus a sporting hunt or for example following up a beast into thick bush where it is waiting for the hunting.

After all, what do bastard poachers use, or protrayed to use, AK-47's in 7.62x39 full auto. Just blast away until the poor beast dies, even if the pathetic penetration of that inadequate cartridge. Elephant can ne killed with multiple spear hits too. Different story to a sporting and ethical kill.

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Just a few thoughts on some issues raised.

The safety catch. To be on the correct side for a right hander should be on the left to be activated with the thumb of the shooting hand aka SMLE FN SLR M16. Minimal time to disengage and hand does not have to loose the shooting grip.

Customized rifles. I see two reasons for the "stay clear". One is they can be a botched job where they do not operate as reliably as they should. 2) they are a top notch job and the tolerances are too tight, so rifle jams with the slightest of dust/crud in the system.

It amazes me when people say the Remington is no good. If this was the case then the US Marines and others would not of used it as the base for their sniper rifles. I personally have never experienced any problems with Remington 700. This may be because I was taught on the SMLE where you had to place the round in the magazine and slide it back into position, not just roll it in with the base already at the rear of the mag. Same method as required for any single stack mag that I am aware of. But each to their own.

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