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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
12GA From Hell
      #44720 - 23/12/05 02:53 PM

Got some testing done with 12GA FH using
730 gr Dixie Terminator hard slugs..First the gun is 25 lb built on a Savage 210 action,
heavy barrel 31 in long.Stock is full of
lead shot and epoxy in the butt section..
We got 2700 fps top speed with TERMINATOR
lead slugs.No leading..All shooting done with one case to see how they hold up,over 2 dozen
firings and no resizing needed on the bottom
2/3 of the case yet, only size the top 1/3 to
grip bullet..cases fall out of chamber, and I have a minimum 12 gauge chamber as it is tight fit to get regular 12ga shot shell in it.Cases are made from BMG brass
that we put Rims on.Uses BMG primer.John at Bridger
made the rims, and put them on.

Loads done so far with 730 gr Terminator--

230 gr HBMG---1550 fps
280 ge HBMG---2000 fps---21k load

260 gr W860---2200 fps
300 gr W860---2400 fps---27k load

250 gr 7383---2560 fps---35k load..slight comp.

260 gr Magpro-2430 fps
300 gr Magpro-2700 fps---35k load-11,800 ft lbs.

As this crappy weather allows,
Will test 750 gr Bridger bullet; and
A Barnes 3/4 oz sabot(should get 4 grand).

Maybe we can find a way to get a thick walled reciever done to put the Savage bolt, bolt carrier, trigger etc on,with slightly larger
barrel thread..Then it would have safety margin for 50-55k loads.. The 3 lug bolt will hold if in thicker reciever...It is a real super smooth
operating action.

Rob on AR got his going also. His action is a Borchardt
falling block.He got 750 gr Bridger over 3000 fps,
15000 ft lbs energy.He can run full pressures as action
was made for 50 cal BMG.Ed Hubel



--------------------
Ed Hubel


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bulldog563
.400 member


Reged: 21/10/05
Posts: 1153
Loc: California
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #44723 - 23/12/05 03:04 PM

Wow.

--------------------
Join the National Rifle Association:
https://membership.nrahq.org/forms/signup.asp


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BlainSmipy
.375 member


Reged: 24/11/05
Posts: 558
Loc: Washington, USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: bulldog563]
      #44736 - 23/12/05 06:43 PM

But can you hit the side of the barn with it.
Colorado

--------------------
You horde gold, I horde lead.


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #44758 - 24/12/05 03:59 AM

We got it through the wires on the chrono at
20 ft.Muzzle blast could knock small barn down.
back stop is a big banded pallet of slabwood about 6 ft
through and it shakes when those slugs impact.
Did testing with 3/4 oz Barnes sabots, got out at about 3900 fps, using 300 gr of H-335 ball powder.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel

Edited by hubel458 (08/01/06 01:05 PM)


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BlainSmipy
.375 member


Reged: 24/11/05
Posts: 558
Loc: Washington, USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #45503 - 02/01/06 03:13 AM

This is really just smokeless version of the old BP bore guns. They were king in their day. Exactly what creature on the plant needs this cannon? And how many bearers are needed to carry it for you?

Colorado

--------------------
You horde gold, I horde lead.


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #46053 - 08/01/06 01:13 PM

Gun handles nice, has good balance.Very good for
stopping dangerous game.And making holes in target easy to see without a scope. Tailgunner came down today
and fired off a few rounds,and did it easy.And he
is a smaller guy than me by 90 lbs.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 2687
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #46055 - 08/01/06 01:41 PM

Ed:
I have been following this development for years, originally over on AR. Good to see it reach completion. Many of these "hare-brained schemes" never make it past the drawing board. Congratulations, mate!

BTW, you are obviously nuts, however the symptoms are shared by many of us here!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Marrakai]
      #46796 - 17/01/06 12:22 PM

Marrakai--Thanks..We tested 750 gr Bridger hollow
base brass bullet got it to 2520, at about 33k psi.
We checked bolt lugs and seats on Savage and no signs of
setback.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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BlainSmipy
.375 member


Reged: 24/11/05
Posts: 558
Loc: Washington, USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #46818 - 17/01/06 04:16 PM

I know about those holes, my 12 bore punches those too. I shot my 458 cal and the 12 bore into the same target, it was laughable to see the difference.

Who says size doen't matter!

Colorado

Bigger is always better!

--------------------
You horde gold, I horde lead.


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BlainSmipy
.375 member


Reged: 24/11/05
Posts: 558
Loc: Washington, USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #46819 - 17/01/06 04:17 PM

How about some pictures?

Colorado

--------------------
You horde gold, I horde lead.


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60falconclif
.224 member


Reged: 14/01/06
Posts: 13
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #46843 - 18/01/06 03:23 AM

You really do have some awsome #'s there. Would love pix the only thing that keeps that thing from knocking you down has to be the wheight, and the four guys holding the gun up>>> sounds like fun...

Recoil Builds Character!!!


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: 60falconclif]
      #47022 - 19/01/06 04:21 PM

Here is pictures of cases-1st is our case next to
12ga plastic case-2nd is BMG case with rim put on
next to fired case, fireformed from first case, and with
730 gr Dixie Terminator slug loaded in it.Ed





--------------------
Ed Hubel


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #47919 - 25/01/06 02:38 PM

Here is pic of my gun and one below of Rob's--







--------------------
Ed Hubel


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bulldog563
.400 member


Reged: 21/10/05
Posts: 1153
Loc: California
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #47953 - 25/01/06 08:57 PM

WOW

--------------------
Join the National Rifle Association:
https://membership.nrahq.org/forms/signup.asp


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: bulldog563]
      #49290 - 06/02/06 02:09 PM

Here is picture of the Savage 210 three lug
bolt, next to an Enfield bolt to show the size
and it can be used for NE Cartridges.Got a fellow
who is going to use one to make 700NE. Rims are .880
same as 12ga diameter and 700NE base is .780 in
where our 12ga base is .801..Ed.




--------------------
Ed Hubel


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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 17923
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #49344 - 07/02/06 04:32 AM

Check out www.accuratereloading.com for loads for the .700 Nitro Express in a bolt gun. They ran 1,000gr. bullets up to 2,450fps but wwere plagued with hang-fires until they used 2gr. of bullseye to kick the charge off better. They also used .50BMG brass, I believe.
: Be carefull in your loading and start quite conservativley.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Daryl_S]
      #49368 - 07/02/06 10:37 AM

They used regular 700NE cases with mickey
mouse primers, which can hangfire without
bullseye.. With our case built from bmg we have
a primer 3 times as powerful, and it starts
230-320gr of slow powder fine.My 700HE a
long straight belted case, soon to be
tested is built from bmg brass and won't have no
hangfires, and it will add at least 500 more fps,
than the NE.Ed

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 17923
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #49427 - 07/02/06 06:34 PM

OK so, in your words, they used mickey-mouse cases, well that makes you even as you are using mickey-mouse bullets - 260gr.- my word! That's too light for my .375 let alone a .73 cal rifle. At least they used 1,000gr. bullets. ;-)
: You say YOUR ctg. is going to get 500fps higher than the 700 Nitor Express?? You're saying you are going to make or beat 2,950fps with a 1,000gr. bullet? That will be something. I'm champing at the bit to see that.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Daryl_S]
      #49448 - 08/02/06 01:39 AM

Daryl--my 12ga bullets are 730gr-- The 260 grain
figure is in the range od powder weights.One load
Rob had was 2000 gr.The only light bullet I used in
12ga was a 3/4 oz sabot just to test it
for somebody.Be shooting heavier in couple weeks.
860 gr for somebody, 1100gr later on....
I used that mickey mouse
term because of the marginal primer they have in
the 700 NE relative to the amount of powder.Case
is fine, just primer isn't big enough.....And
everybody has trouble without fast starting powder,
which is a hell of a way to have to do it.
I am telling everybody that has 700NE to put a pocket
in it for bmg primer.They are only little over 20 cents
and it seems out of place to by a 700NE case for
60-100 bucks and not use a big enough primer.
Here we have my lowly Savage at moderate, medium,
pressures. outdoing all the NEs, Nyatis,
TREXs, JDJs, etc..And My 700HE(3.87 in long belted
staight case made from bmg, bmg primer) will be on BMG
rated action and it will get a 1000 grainer over
3000 fps.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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**DONOTDELETE**





Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #49454 - 08/02/06 03:13 AM

Ed,

Party on! How are the bore guns coming along?

Scott


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: ScottS]
      #49463 - 08/02/06 04:02 AM

Scott--Got 2 barrels for 2 bore.Ernie should be making
4 bore barrels by summer.Got 4 bore bullets, probably just use shot loads in two as smoothbore(will ream out
the too tall and too fast of twist rifling).Got to
get action.I will test 4 bore in state arms action
for load development.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 17923
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #49550 - 09/02/06 05:15 AM

WOW - not for me. I've gotten away from most of the big kickers these last few years. I've only a wildcat .458 and .375 for large bore smokeless ctgs. now. I expect soon to re-barrel a 4140 actioned Sharps to .50 Alaskan in the near future.
: The .17 cal small cases are much nicer to shoot.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Daryl_S]
      #49841 - 13/02/06 03:05 PM

Daryl--Recoil isn't bad, as gun has good weight and
balance-It don't kick any worse than a ten pound
458 Lott,with full loads.When tailgunner fired
it, muzzle only went up 6 inches.Found a long
shotcup that holds 2 oz of buckshot.We will test
that in coupleb weeks.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #50163 - 17/02/06 09:29 AM

Shot 18 buckshot in shotcup, about 700 gr.Case 60%
full of powder, a 16ga wad on top of shot in cup.
All nice tight fit. Pattern at 25 ft was 3 ft due
to wad and rifling..Good redneck defense load??
Your a redneck when all your bigbores are singleshot
and your safari car is a double...Ed




--------------------
Ed Hubel


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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #50477 - 21/02/06 05:38 PM

Here is picture the case we fired 36 times,
sectioned.. No thinning to be seen by eye or
measured by calipers..Cases super and will go
couple hundred firings at our pressures..And
they have big primer so no misfires or starter
powders needed.Ed




--------------------
Ed Hubel


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