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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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fourbore
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Reged: 28/03/10
Posts: 70
Loc: NewEngland
Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square)
      #223989 - 21/01/13 01:52 AM

I learned of this book a few years ago. It is a wealth of knowledge and provides some personal in sight to Art Alpin and his cartridge development and his company A Square(his name A x 2). Chapters are written by Art and other contributors include Craig Boddington, Finn Aargard, and other well known individuals. There is a lot of opinion, theory and personal experience mixed together in this book.

Art was apparently a controversial figure. I read some criticism (or out right slander) on another forum. But; on that same forum members constantly quote right from this book as if they were presenting their own ideas.

This book is out of print, but copies can be found for $25-50 price range if you are patient. There are always a pack of hyenas asking $100-$500 a copy for any good out of print gun book. And this is no exception. Please, do not let yourself get screwed. If you dont already have a copy, I recommend keep you eye open for an honest offering. I got mine from Amazon, but dont see any fairly priced today.

One topic I found of interest was the 577 TREX chapter. Developed By Art. I believe is fatally flawed. Reading the fine print I discovered the A2 rifles used a 1/12 twist! Compared to 577NE with a 1/30 twist. Now, watch the infamous video of guys dropping the gun shooting the TREX. What is happening is the gun twist out of their grip. That EXCESSIVE twist is due to 1/12 twist with 750 grain bullet at 2400fps. Crazy enough ballistics, and too much twist. I think the consensus is some where around 1/18 to 1/24 is proper.

Why over spin? Art had a reason, discussed in another chapter. That is for a projectile to travel straight and true in game requires enough spin to remain stable during penetration. Simply having sufficient stability to punch a hole in paper was is not nearly enough. This is being re-discovered and verified by good scientific work today.



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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: fourbore]
      #223994 - 21/01/13 04:25 AM

Have read of Art's work off and on through the years..and yes, it appears you either liked him or hated him...but had a huge amount of knowledge...

Have to check out that book..thanks for the heads up..

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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hubel458
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Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Ripp]
      #224001 - 21/01/13 04:57 AM

A fellow with knowledge of the old Asq company bought out
the last 800 books at the closing auction in Dec in SD.
Where all the bullet and brass making part of the
companie's remaining assets were sold. He could sell them on
ebay for 75-100 a piece or sell them to big guys like
Midway who sold the last ones a while ago they had for 40.

Sad to say Art is in bad health and his wife is immobile
due to a stroke, and Asquare is no more. The rifle factory part
of the company in WY is now part of Sharps Arms and they plan on
making a small caliber tactical type gun.

As for the fast twist in their trex it was thought to be needed
for the roundnose bullets of the day but now tests with bullets with
wide flat meplat penetrate better at half the twist rate..Ed

Edited by hubel458 (21/01/13 05:02 AM)

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Altamaha
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Reged: 29/12/08
Posts: 376
Loc: Washington State USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: hubel458]
      #224002 - 21/01/13 05:26 AM

My copy is well worn. Some good stuff in the book. Also some witchcraft.

Well worth having on the bookshelf as it contains load data for some hard to find cartridges. With pressure readings! IMHO velocity is meaningless unless pressure data is included.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Altamaha]
      #224010 - 21/01/13 06:46 AM


It's a great book, one of the first I purchased.

One thing I like about Amazon is it lists 2nd hand
books as well and the odd time I have purchased a book it has always been good.

Agree, well worth picking up a copy if you can
and as the OP said, not over paying for it.

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: 500Nitro]
      #224055 - 21/01/13 08:26 PM

Ripp, I have a copy and didn´t enjoy it and like someone above said there is a lot of "witchcraft" in it in my opinion but it does have a fair bit of loading data in it though be warned I have heard some of it is "toppy" If you send me your address I will send you my copy FOC, best, Mike

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albertan
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Reged: 13/06/06
Posts: 432
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #224064 - 22/01/13 01:53 AM

The information on the importance of brass annealing is worth the price of the book alone. Of all the problems the .458 Winchester magnum supposedly had, poor annealing of the brass was the cause of most of the problems. Without sufficient neck tension, erratic performance is guaranteed. The big Weatherby's and the Nitro Express rounds also benefit from case annealing after every use.

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Homer
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Reged: 07/04/09
Posts: 3081
Loc: Canberra, Australia
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: albertan]
      #224120 - 22/01/13 09:15 PM

G'Day Fella's,

AA was a Let's Do It kind a bloke, so I imagine it would be a good read!

Doh!
Homer

--------------------
"Beware the Lolly Pop of Mediocrity,
Lick it Once and You Will Suck Forever"

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Dresden
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Reged: 19/06/12
Posts: 20
Loc: Minnesota, USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Homer]
      #224298 - 26/01/13 01:16 AM

High twist rates in any caliber can cause higher pressures as I understand things, isn't it better to match the velocity and bullet weight or just be slightly faster in the twist i.e. one in fourteen as opposed to one in fifteen. This was always a subject of concern when building 50 BMG rifles, the military had different considerations in twist rates than target shooters, bullet weights were another
consideration as well. The custom barrel makers were able to sort this out eventually.

Dresden

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chuck375
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Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Dresden]
      #224446 - 29/01/13 02:35 PM

I have the book and it's got a wealth of information including load data. My 500 Jeffery has a 1 in 10" twist much like Art recommends for the 500 A2. It doesn't torque anything like the 577 TRex though!

--------------------
"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"

Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"

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DoubleD
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Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2396
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: chuck375]
      #224479 - 30/01/13 02:40 AM

This is one of my favorite books...I mean where else are you going to find good load data for your 105x608mm?

The Alpin book pops up on www.abebooks.com every once in a while. Put it on a wants list. ABEBooks is a worldwide old bookseller data based owned by Amazon. For some reason know only to Amazon the two do not interface. So if you are looking for a book search both places.

FWIW it is sometimes possible to buy regional titles cheaper from books shops outside the region. Several years a ago I bought some books on Zulu culture from a book seller in India. The books were mailed to my US address which reshipped to me in South Africa for half the price including all the postage than I could buy the book from an old book seller two blocks from my office in Durban.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

Edited by DoubleD (30/01/13 02:41 AM)

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DoubleD
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Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2396
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: DoubleD]
      #224708 - 04/02/13 03:16 AM

I just saw this on Midsouth Shooters supplies. Limited quantities found in wharehouse. $99 still in shrink wrap.

http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=00285ASQUARE



A-Square Reloading Manual Any Shot You Want

Limited Quantities.
NO BACKORDERS.

ONLY 1 EDITION EVER PRINTED, COLLECTOR'S ITEM!

One of the most comprehensive reloading manuals ever printed. This is a collector’s item, with 626 pages of reloading information, pictures, and descriptions on cartridges ranging from .22 Hornet to .600 Nitro Express and 105x608mm. Written by Arthur B. Alphin, Craig Boddington, Finn Aagaard, Terry Wieland, this is one of the most sought after reloading manuals to date. This manual has articles on safety, basic and advanced reloading, powder compression, cannelure, crimps, throat and freebore, headspace, terminal ballistics, mechanics of penetration, recoil, psi, velocity measurement and interpretation, difference lot to lot, changing components, effects of temperature, changing barrel length, rifle selection and cartridge and bullet selection. All data is SAAMI approved. Printed in 1996. - Still in shrink wrap.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

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Grenadier
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Reged: 20/02/08
Posts: 570
Loc: North of the Columbia, USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: DoubleD]
      #224710 - 04/02/13 04:01 AM

"OEM BLEM" "Only 493 Of Item 285-ASQUARE Available -- This Item Cannot Be Backordered"

--------------------
~

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Grenadier]
      #224774 - 05/02/13 06:57 AM

If they got them "all" from the A-Square final auction, either
directly or from 3rd party who go won the bid, there are
almost 800 of them. And the bidder got them for
about 8 bucks each. Ed

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: hubel458]
      #224802 - 05/02/13 07:50 PM

As I said a couple of weeks ago I have a copy free to a good home, first reply gets it, best, Mike

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TilleyMan
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Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #224806 - 05/02/13 08:39 PM

Quote:

As I said a couple of weeks ago I have a copy free to a good home, first reply gets it, best, Mike



Yes please

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albertan
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Reged: 13/06/06
Posts: 432
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: TilleyMan]
      #224808 - 05/02/13 09:46 PM

Another good read if you are into large calibre rifles is Pierre van der Walt's African Dangerous Game Cartridges. Written from an African perspective, it covers many calibres that are not covered in the popular reloading manuals and shooting magazines. Strengths and foibles are dealt with honestly. The only criticisms I have ever read come from North Americans who never venture too far from home. They may be subject matter experts on guns and reloading, but they have never(AND WILL NEVER)hunt anything that can hit back.

M.L. McPherson is going to have a new reloading manual out on Safari Press soon. It should be a dandy as well. Mick McPherson has to be one of the most knowledgeable authors on all aspects hand loading in the world. From precision shooting to big bores, cast bullets to why you should use match primers in semi's, pumps, single shots, and lever actions. Yeah, I like his writing.

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: albertan]
      #224812 - 05/02/13 10:43 PM

Albertan, I did like Pierres´book. Tilleyman, PM me your address and I will post it. Why is it always a bloody Ozzie on the other side of the world who gets in first buggering up postage best, Mike

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TilleyMan
.333 member


Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #224846 - 06/02/13 07:51 AM



Thanks Mike, PM sent

Happy to pay postage

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TilleyMan
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Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: TilleyMan]
      #228119 - 05/04/13 03:25 PM

Mike

Book arrived safely in yesterday's post...

Just dipped into it, and there are some very good articles... but some with a decidedly 'interesting' angle. I can see why it tends to polarise readers...

Thanks again for your generous offer!

Cheers

TM

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Dresden
.224 member


Reged: 19/06/12
Posts: 20
Loc: Minnesota, USA
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: TilleyMan]
      #228682 - 13/04/13 11:25 PM

I enjoyed albertan's comments about North Americans. I was inducted into hunting Whitetails in the
"Peoples Republic of Minnesota" by my Maternal Uncles.

I started Deer hunting at age 18 and found the culture so repulsive I never hunted again until age 63. In the intervening years I still cultivated an interest in rifle and pistol shooting. I am a good shot with either and prefer open sights.

I became interested in big game guns as a pastime, I shoot 416 Rigby and Ruger, 9.3x62 and 57, and 35 Whelen, my 8x57 is my mouse gun.

Back to the issue of gun culture, I always heard the hunting crowd wanting snow when hunting for tracking wounded game, I heard some people talk about sound shots, people were shot out of tree
stands, in Wisconsin five people were shot by a trespasser involving a tree stand, three died. Alcohol after hunting and drinking until the bar closes is to prevalent here, I think a DWI
(Driving While Intoxicated) should impact hunting and fishing privileges as well.

That being said, I did go hunting on private land, shot a deer, one shot kill, K98k Mauser military
with handloads 196gn round nose.

Dresden

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SteveB
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Reged: 31/12/11
Posts: 2
Loc: Auburn, IN
Re: Any Shot You Want by Arthur Alpin ( A Square) [Re: albertan]
      #230267 - 20/05/13 02:23 PM

Quote:

The information on the importance of brass annealing is worth the price of the book alone. Of all the problems the .458 Winchester magnum supposedly had, poor annealing of the brass was the cause of most of the problems. Without sufficient neck tension, erratic performance is guaranteed. The big Weatherby's and the Nitro Express rounds also benefit from case annealing after every use.



I had to go back and look that section up in my copy. The case cleaning solution was particularly interesting also!

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