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Carpetsahib
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Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers
      #185604 - 11/07/11 05:52 AM

Here is a partial list of calibers chambered in Mannlicher Schoenauer rifles. The list reflects both commercial and experimental calibers offered by Steyr, as well as one offered by Holland and Holland. In addition, there may have been some rifles chambered for 7.5x55 for the Swiss market, but that needs to be verified. Surprisingly, there seem to be no rifles made in 7mm Rem Mag or .300 Win Mag.

.243 Win, .244 Rem,
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win-Mag
6.5x54MS, 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68
6.7x57 Chinese (per Ludwig Olson)
.270 Win
7x57, 7x64
.280 Rem
.308 Win
.30-06 (7.62x63)
8x56MS, 8x57JS, 8x60S, 8x68S
9x56MS
.338 Win-Mag
9.3x62
.358 Win
9.5x56 MS
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win-Mag


Are there others to add?

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kuduae
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #185605 - 11/07/11 06:44 AM

IMHO the rumor about Mannlicher-Schoenauers in 9.3x53 Swiss is based on a misunderstanding. Both the 9.3x53 and it's rimmed twin were developed post-WW1, when the usual pre-war import of German and Austrian made guns and ammo came to a halt due to the Versailles and St.Germain "peace treaties". The only repeating rifles in 9.3x53 Swiss I have ever seen were all Mannlichers, but not Mannlicher-Schoenauers. Instead, they are on the rare, less than 8000 ever made, Swiss M93 Mannlicher cavalry carbine actions. These carbines were made under licence from Steyr by a Swiss arsenal and SIG. The M93 carbine used v.Mannlicher's straight pull action (same as the M90 and M95 Austro-Hungarian ones)combined with a Swiss type detacheable 6-shot box magazine. These M93 carbines were just, in 1919, declared obsolete, replaced by the M11 Schmidt-Rubin short rifle and the more powerfull 7.5x55 GP11 load. These M93 carbines, rebarreled or rebored to 9.3 mm, made light and handy hunting rifles for roe deer and chamoix, the only "big game" then in Switzerland. Remember, the use of the military 7.5x55 cartridge for hunting was prohibited in Switzerland and scope use was outlawed as unsporting.

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Rule303
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #185637 - 11/07/11 07:35 PM

I am suprised that MS made them in 358Win. Nothing wrong with the calibre I quite like it, just a bit unusual.

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Rule303]
      #185691 - 12/07/11 11:06 AM

I have an MCA carbine in .358 Win. It's a great rifle.

Curl

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lancaster
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: kuduae]
      #186020 - 18/07/11 04:56 AM

Quote:

IMHO the rumor about Mannlicher-Schoenauers in 9.3x53 Swiss is based on a misunderstanding. Both the 9.3x53 and it's rimmed twin were developed post-WW1, when the usual pre-war import of German and Austrian made guns and ammo came to a halt due to the Versailles and St.Germain "peace treaties". The only repeating rifles in 9.3x53 Swiss I have ever seen were all Mannlichers, but not Mannlicher-Schoenauers. Instead, they are on the rare, less than 8000 ever made, Swiss M93 Mannlicher cavalry carbine actions. These carbines were made under licence from Steyr by a Swiss arsenal and SIG. The M93 carbine used v.Mannlicher's straight pull action (same as the M90 and M95 Austro-Hungarian ones)combined with a Swiss type detacheable 6-shot box magazine. These M93 carbines were just, in 1919, declared obsolete, replaced by the M11 Schmidt-Rubin short rifle and the more powerfull 7.5x55 GP11 load. These M93 carbines, rebarreled or rebored to 9.3 mm, made light and handy hunting rifles for roe deer and chamoix, the only "big game" then in Switzerland. Remember, the use of the military 7.5x55 cartridge for hunting was prohibited in Switzerland and scope use was outlawed as unsporting.



kudue, did you have any pics from such 9,3x53 swiss hunting rifles? was the original military stock used, sporterized or new stocked?

there are also rumors about a version in 9,3x57 but till now I have not seen such a rifle.
maybe in sweden somewhere

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kuduae
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: lancaster]
      #186028 - 18/07/11 08:28 AM

Quote:

any pics from such 9,3x53 swiss hunting rifles? was the original military stock used, sporterized or new stocked?

there are also rumors about a version in 9,3x57 but till now I have not seen such a rifle.
maybe in sweden somewhere



sorry, no pics at the time. Of the few M93s in 9.3x53 Swiss I have seen many years ago, two were still in their military full stocks, handguards and all, one was restocked, but apparently quite recently. Perhaps a pre-shaped sporterstock for the M95 Austrian by Schweigert, Augsburg was modified?
The only Mannlicher-Schoenauers in 9.3x57 I have ever seen came from Sweden. Clearly rebarreled M05 and M08 actions. I have not yet seen a factory M-Sch in 9.3x57. From the factory standpoint: why should they offer this chambering? They had their own proprietary 9x56 and 9.5x57 running in the same class.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #186043 - 18/07/11 01:01 PM

Quote:

Here is a partial list of calibers chambered in Mannlicher Schoenauer rifles. The list reflects both commercial and experimental calibers offered by Steyr, as well as one offered by Holland and Holland. In addition, there may have been some rifles chambered for 7.5x55 for the Swiss market, but that needs to be verified. Surprisingly, there seem to be no rifles made in 7mm Rem Mag or .300 Win Mag.

.243 Win, .244 Rem,
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win-Mag
6.5x54MS, 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68
6.7x57 Chinese (per Ludwig Olson)
.270 Win
7x57, 7x64
.280 Rem
.308 Win
.30-06 (7.62x63)
8x56MS, 8x57JS, 8x60S, 8x68S
9x56MS
.338 Win-Mag
9.3x62
.358 Win
9.5x56 MS
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win-Mag


Are there others to add?

Note: The Chinese cartridge is 6.8x57, not 6.7x57. The Military rifle chambered for it is marked Modell 1906.

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Kiwi_bloke
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #187106 - 02/08/11 04:16 PM

Don't forget 8x64S. Here's one for sale in a Mannlicher-Schoenauer. Same as very popular 7x64 Brenneke case but necked up so it's easy enough to tweak the M-Sch. magazine follower and offer the 8x64S as another option.

http://www.vdb-waffen.de/gebrauchtwaffen...mp;Kategorie=52

The 8x64S is a close metric copy of the .30-06 and, on a hunt in Germany a few years ago, the gamekeeper there, Alfred, was using this classic caliber.

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bpesteve
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: kuduae]
      #187922 - 14/08/11 09:10 AM

Somewhat off-topic, but with all the references to the Swiss '93 Mannlicher there just happens to be one on the market pictured here:

http://collectorsfirearms.com/admin/product_details.php?itemID=44591

I have no interest in the sale, but is is an unusual item and seldom seen.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Kiwi_bloke]
      #191546 - 10/10/11 08:14 AM

So far, the count is up to 32 calibers, counting a couple of rumored calibers. Here is the revised list:
5.6x57 RWS
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.257 Rob., .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS, 6.5x55, 6.5x67, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06, AKA 7.62x63
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60S, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56, AKA 9.5x57
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

Any others?

Edited by Carpetsahib (10/10/11 12:12 PM)

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gtrotz
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #192288 - 22/10/11 08:46 AM

I have one in 7,65 argentine
gtrotz

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: gtrotz]
      #192338 - 23/10/11 01:05 AM

Quote:

I have one in 7,65 argentine
gtrotz

Awesome! Can you give us further information? I am particularly interested in the model number, barrel length and stock configuration. A photo would be great.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #192339 - 23/10/11 01:11 AM

Quote:

So far, the count is up to 32 calibers, counting a couple of rumored calibers. Here is the revised list:
5.6x57 RWS
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.257 Rob., .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS, 6.5x55, 6.5x67, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06, AKA 7.62x63
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60S, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56, AKA 9.5x57
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

Any others?

7.65x54 brings the count to 31 confirmed, with 2 more rumored.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #192341 - 23/10/11 02:09 AM

The revised list revised yet again; there are now 33 calibers:
5.6x57 RWS
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS (aka 6.5x53), 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06 (aka 7.62x63)
7.65x54 Arg
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56 MS (aka 9.5x57)
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

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lancaster
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #192419 - 24/10/11 06:49 PM

Quote:


10.75x57 (Rumored)




my last correspondence with Collath 500 BPE before he was surprisingly dying in 2009 ( you will find him here in old mannlicher forum post) was going arond the Mannlicher Schoenauer Modell 1912 in 10,75x57. Collath had told me that he have known 2 or 3 M 1912 rifle's in austria. he was then on a trip to vienna were someone had offer him such M 1912 but in the end it was a worn M 1910. He had no pics from such a beast and to my knowledge nothing floating around. in all we know it must be engraved Mannlicher Schoenauer M 1912 on the receiver.
have heard that Erich Schoeder http://www.eschoder.com/english/english-index.htm
also confirm the existence of the M 1912 in 10,75x57.
it's the only good explanation while the 10,75x57 is sometimes called 10,75x57 Mannlicher. cartridge collectors have found it under this name in the Georg Roth list. this designation is wrong



I have a Suhl made M 98 in 10,75x57 and collect informations about this cartridge for year now. my opinion is that the little 10,75 was created in Suhl beetween 1904 and 1907.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by CptCurl (27/11/11 04:20 AM)

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: lancaster]
      #192439 - 25/10/11 01:22 AM

Thanks for the information. I regret to learn that Collath 500BPE (Johann) has passed. He made a great contribution to the forum.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #192740 - 29/10/11 09:22 AM

I just ran across another odd one: A M-S Model 1950 sold on liveauctionworld.com in October. It was from the Robert Peterson Collection and was listed as 7.7x64! Has anyone ever heard of such a thing? Surely that isn't another designation for the 8x64S.

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georgegibbs505
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #193875 - 16/11/11 02:59 PM

There was also the .256 Gibbs Magnum chambering.

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Phillip
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: georgegibbs505]
      #193928 - 17/11/11 01:34 AM


a 1952 Mannlicher/.308 in the Southern deer woods...my favorite walk around..

--------------------
My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.
-Winston Churchill


Edited by CptCurl (27/11/11 04:21 AM)

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #193929 - 17/11/11 01:53 AM

Quote:

The revised list revised yet again; there are now 35 calibers:
5.6x57 RWS
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.256 Gibbs Magnum
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS (aka 6.5x53), 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06 (aka 7.62x63)
7.65x54 Arg
7.7 x 64 ????
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56 MS (aka 9.5x57)
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

How about the .318 WR?

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Phillip]
      #193930 - 17/11/11 01:58 AM

Quote:


a 1952 Mannlicher/.308 in the Southern deer woods...my favorite walk around..

My first M-S was a 1961 Carbine in .308. It was a wonderful rifle; wish I still had it.

Edited by CptCurl (27/11/11 04:21 AM)

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kuduae
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: georgegibbs505]
      #193946 - 17/11/11 05:44 AM

Quote:

There was also the .256 Gibbs Magnum chambering.


A friend of mine has one. It was not made by Steyr, but was built and rechambered by G.Gibbs on a M-Sch 1903 barreled action from the Military production line for Greece, dated on the receiver wall "Steyr 1912" and without the commercial production bolt-hold-down spring. The .256 Gibbs Magnum is named so for it's bore diameter. The .256 Gibbs Magnum case is essentially a 6.5x57 with a shorter neck. My friend uses 6.5x57 brass shortened to 55mm and 6.5x57 load data. The 6.5x55 Swedish case is too fat at the base to fit his chamber.

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mehulkamdar
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #194099 - 19/11/11 08:14 AM

Erich Schoder who builds Mannlicher Schonauer type rifles would be able to give more information. I have heard that the gentleman is very particular about building rifles only in calibers and configurations in which they were historically built - he would be able to give information.

I would only suggest calling on the phone - e-mail is something that the company is very slow to respond to.

Good hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #206911 - 11/04/12 10:05 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The revised list revised yet again; there are now 36 calibers:
5.6x57 RWS
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.256 Gibbs Magnum
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS (aka 6.5x53), 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06 (aka 7.62x63)
7.65x54 Arg
7.7 x 64 ????
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56 MS (aka 9.5x57)
.375/43/270 Westley Richards Proprietary Cartridge
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

How about the .318 WR?

Edited to add the .375/43/270 Westley Richards.

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Carpetsahib
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Re: Mannlicher Schoenauer Calibers [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #207902 - 01/05/12 07:21 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The revised list revised yet again; there are now 37 calibers:
5.6x57 RWS
.220 Swift (By G&H on a 1900 Action)
.243 Win, .244 Rem
.256 Gibbs Magnum
.257 Rob, .257 Wby
.264 Win
6.5x54 MS (aka 6.5x53), 6.5x55, 6.5x57, 6.5x68S
6.8x57 Chinese
.270 Win
.280 Rem
7x57, 7x64
.308 Win
.30-06 (aka 7.62x63)
7.65x54 Arg
7.7 x 64 ????
8x56 MS, 8x57JS, 8x60, 8x64S, 8x68S
9x56 MS
.338 Win
.358 Win
9.3x57 (Rumored)
9.3x62
9.5x56 MS (aka 9.5x57)
.375/43/270 Westley Richards Proprietary Cartridge
10.75x57 (Rumored)
10.75x68
.400/.375 H&H
.458 Win

How about the .318 WR?

Edited to add the .375/43/270 Westley Richards.

Added .220 Swift and updated count to 37

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