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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns
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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Got my GP Greener re-stocked.
      #180489 - 02/05/11 08:23 AM

At long last, after about a 12 month wait, I have finally got my GP Greener back from the stockmaker.
The stock was made by Allan Murray in Brisbane, I visited him a couple of times during the making of it to make sure we had the length correct, as well as the height of the comb.
This firearm has a Pac-Nor rifled barrel fitted and weighs 9 lb 5 oz's as it is here. Allan also bent the lever to shape and lightened the trigger, it was seriously about 20 pound!

I need some suggestions on the finish of the stock, Allan has given it a gloss finish, which originally I was not happy with, but it has since grown on me, it seems to contrast against the matte bluing of the metalwork, and it does tend to highlight the grain pretty well.
But I'm not against getting in to it with the rubbing compound to remove the gloss to a degree.

Thoughts anyone?

The target you see was fired at 25 metres, and was fired from the offhand position, no rest whatsoever.
The load used was a 570 grain round ball of .732" diameter, just loaded in a plastic case, a double ended gas seal wad with the ball lubed in liquid alox and sat on top of the wad, then 8 point star crimped. A bit basic, but it works well. A fellow shooter at the range yesterday and myself were then shooting handgun chicken silhouette targets at the 50 metre line with it, we were easily sending them back about 2 metres with a solid hit.

Regards,
David.



Edited by CptCurl (07/05/11 11:04 PM)

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180490 - 02/05/11 08:28 AM


Since it has a new barrel and stock, I would leave it like it is.


Re the target, couldn't you have done any better ?
I would have thought a ragged clover leaf type was
more the order of the day !!! LOL

Well done.

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26489
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180492 - 02/05/11 09:13 AM

I'm jealous, David - capital J. that is an exquisite stock - looks to be beautifully filled and finished. If you want, you can cut it back a bit with some rotten stone.(fine pumice)- smooths it out and softens the look. I really like it, but some don't.

looks like it appreciates the quick load, quite well.

What's your groove and bore diameter if I might ask?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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CHAPUISARMES
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Reged: 16/01/08
Posts: 2908
Loc: DUBBO, NSW, AUSTRALIA
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180493 - 02/05/11 09:13 AM

Hi David,

I can only see one problem..... it's for a Lefty ....

All jokes aside, it looks really nice and to shoot like that.... Wow...

Cheers,

Jeff Gray

.

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tophet1
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Reged: 15/09/07
Posts: 1873
Loc: NSW, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: CHAPUISARMES]
      #180495 - 02/05/11 09:25 AM

Nothing wrong with a gloss finish. Beautiful wood.

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FATBOY404
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Reged: 14/11/09
Posts: 1730
Loc: QLD
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: tophet1]
      #180505 - 02/05/11 10:32 AM

The cheek piece is in the right place mate.

Use it as it is and years down the track after some wear and tear you can oil finish it.

Sounds as though you have a new silhouette gun.

Look forward to having a shot !!.

Nice !!!.

--------------------
"WHATEVER BLOWS YOUR HAIR BACK"

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450_Ackley
.375 member


Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: FATBOY404]
      #180511 - 02/05/11 12:29 PM

Daryl,
Groove diameter is .729", have not measured bore diameter, it's a 7 groove barrel, which measuring bore diameter of an "odd grooved" barrel is above my limited mathematics ability!
Might have to push one of the round balls through and see what I can measure.
Twist is 1 ~ 20", fast for a 12 bore, but it likes the round ball loads, which I might say I loaded after reading your posts quite a while ago.

I am convinced I can be competitive with round balls at the 25 and 50 metre ranges, at 100 metres, the Paradox style projectiles come into their own.

Thanks to everyone else for the comments.

Neale, got a new mould coming for it, 900 grains, you can be the first to shoot them if you wish!

Here's a picture of it, mould should be about 2-3 weeks away.



Regards,
David.

Edited by CptCurl (07/05/11 11:04 PM)

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180512 - 02/05/11 12:32 PM

450

To measure an "odd" number of grooves, measure from the Edge of one to the Edge of the other after it comes out of the bore.

That's the only way I have been able to get an accurate measurement out of DR barrels.

HTH.


EDIT
I mean the EDGE of one of the Raised bits of Lead
that is pushed into the grooves.

Edited by 500Nitro (02/05/11 01:29 PM)

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180514 - 02/05/11 12:47 PM

500,
Thanks, I'll try that this afternoon and report back.

DC

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180785 - 05/05/11 06:13 AM

Forgot to post the results from 500's measurement technique.
Near as I can measure, I get a bore diameter of .722"

Regards,
DC

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180786 - 05/05/11 06:21 AM


450


So a 7 difference, does that sound right ?

Apart from knowing .729 in 12 bore, I am no expert on bore guns.

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
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Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180817 - 05/05/11 04:14 PM

500,
Yes, it would be close, if I had to guess, I would have thought .720-.721 would have been about right.

DC

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26489
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180861 - 06/05/11 01:36 AM

Sounds ok - lead might have to be fairly hard, but then, velocities are low and a soft bullet has considerbly purchase if the pressure behind is trying to slug it up for it's entire trip out the tube.

The bullet looks good, David and will be fun to shoot.

The slow shotgun powders will give quite good speeds at low pressures, however you should have considerable strength there - have you been following Ed Huble's thread?

I've some of his loads to try for 3" cases in my rifled 12- should run close to 2,000fps with a 500gr. slug. Ought to work on bear at close quarters.

Oh YES - try to find someone with the Lyman 12 bore sabot slug mould. It casts an undersized slug, but it's very accurate and fits normal lead shot wads. The slug itself is about 506gr. in WW alloy and 525gr. in pure lead. They have a reputation of being quite accurate from rifled 12's. The slugs' size is 14 bore- something like .690" to .693"(true 14 bore) - not bad - same as the old 40 point, 12 bore full choke measurement = .690".

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180863 - 06/05/11 01:38 AM

Quote:

500,
Yes, it would be close, if I had to guess, I would have thought .720-.721 would have been about right.

DC



Unless you have a micrometer (as opposed to a caliper), you will get 1 - 2 thou variation and even then, you get that if you measure different one's even on the same bullet.

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500Nitro
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Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180864 - 06/05/11 01:40 AM


i reckon it would be awesome on something like a Buffalo or Scrub Bull with the right bullet.

On smaller game like 'Roos and Pigs, bullets this size flatten them - in fact lift them off the ground and deposit them back down sideways

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26489
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Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180881 - 06/05/11 07:58 AM

David- your bullet with a small cup point - aka woodleigh hydro - can add some devistating effect if striking at over 1,000fps.

Harold Johnson of Cooper's Landing used the rear portion of a cut-off .5, 7540gr. down to 450gr. Browning bullet as a penetrating bullet in his .50 Alaskan M71 Winchester. He reversed the bullet so the steel core's cup base became the cup point. He remarked about the extent of the cavitation on large Alaskan island's Brown Bears (not brown faze black bears, btw).

The same might do wonders for this already impressive bullet. A small lathe and a quick cut - maybe 10 seconds per bullets and done! A centre-drill, with the projection point cut off at it's 60 degree angle would be perfect. That's the angle cup I put on the sized down 300gr. Hornady RN's in .367", that turned them into bombs from Rod's 9.3x57- only 2,100fps.

The cup would be considerbly wider on the 12 bore bullet. I'm thinking rodents ie: Roos and pigs.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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AFRO408
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Reged: 21/01/09
Posts: 312
Loc: Arding NSW
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180885 - 06/05/11 08:06 AM

Man , that's a nice gun.
Allan sure does a good job.
Where's the checkering?

Tony

--------------------
Flinch ? Wot flinch ? Gunsmithing is my PASSION.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: DarylS]
      #180886 - 06/05/11 08:08 AM



I reckon it would blow a 6" Exit hole in the "rodents"
as well as drag out a whole load of internals with it
as I have seen done with others.

.

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180899 - 06/05/11 10:54 AM

Daryl,
I remember reading about Harold's adventures with the 50 Alaskan and the reversed 50 BMG projectiles.
Now that I have a lathe, I'll be able to cast some of these monsters, not hard to grind the end off a centre drill and see what we can do, I've got centre drills from #1 - #5, so something will look about right.

Might have to make a menace of myself and end up at Fatboy's to shoot a few pigs?

AFRO, the stock took him 12 months, and I'm not sure Allan does checkering, otherwise it might have been 2 years!
Are you offering to do it for me???

Regards,
David.

Edited by 450_Ackley (06/05/11 01:27 PM)

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180900 - 06/05/11 10:57 AM


450

Talkig about reversed projectiles, my original 505 Gibbs was used to test the strength of Woodleigh FMJ's when they were first made - by firing them out of the gun backwards until they stopped breaking, then they knew they were good enough !!!

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DoubleD
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Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #180905 - 06/05/11 12:57 PM

Here is a old Gunsmith/millwright trick for measuring odd sided slugs.

Hold the slug between the slack jaws of a dial caliper and keeping light thumb pressure on the slack jaw, roll the slug between the jaws and watch the needle move. The high number that the needle reads is your measurement.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: DoubleD]
      #180907 - 06/05/11 01:26 PM

DoubleD,
Thanks for the tip, I'll have to give that a go when I get home.

Regards,
David

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AFRO408
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Reged: 21/01/09
Posts: 312
Loc: Arding NSW
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180934 - 06/05/11 07:43 PM

Quote:


AFRO, the stock took him 12 months, and I'm not sure Allan does checkering, otherwise it might have been 2 years!
Are you offering to do it for me???

Regards,
David.



I might just do that mate.
We can discuss it when I come up in June.
Afro

--------------------
Flinch ? Wot flinch ? Gunsmithing is my PASSION.

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450_Ackley
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Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: AFRO408]
      #180941 - 06/05/11 08:29 PM

Sounds good, be bloody good to see you at the shoot in June if you can make it.
We are shooting Group 1, Group 2, Charging Animal, Bore Gun and Rook and Rabbit Rifle.

Hope to see you there.

Tophet1, if you happen to read this, you should get your butt up to Dalby on the 5th of June as well, if you can make it.

Regards,
David.

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AFRO408
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Reged: 21/01/09
Posts: 312
Loc: Arding NSW
Re: Got my GP Greener re-stocked. [Re: 450_Ackley]
      #180994 - 07/05/11 08:20 PM

I think Topper will be getting acquainted with some camels up north.
Getting in touch with his ancestors, no doubt.
I hope for his sake there are some good looking ones.


That's enough stirring for one evening I think.
I'll be there, barring any misshaps. Just got to work out what rifles to bring to get me into the different groups.
I don't have anything suitable for Group 1 except my .408 Nickal which is suitable for Group 2. Don't have a bore gun and would a .310 Cadet be alright for Rook & Rabbit rifle?
What group would a, 450-400 2 & 3/8" shooting a .310g PB lead bullet, fit into?

Tony

--------------------
Flinch ? Wot flinch ? Gunsmithing is my PASSION.

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