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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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carpediem4570
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Reged: 28/06/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Round ball insert for 9.3x74R
      #175091 - 08/02/11 02:26 PM

Hello All:

I went to the local gun show here over the weekend and found this little beauty. It uses a 9.3x74R cartridge with the primer hole drilled out and a stainless steel insert soldered into place. The insert takes a 22 calibre blank that is used in explosive impact guns. You know, they come in brown, red, green and yellow. Each colour is more powerful than the one before it.

You then take a round lead ball and using the swager supplied, you resize the balls to .366 diameter.

In the field, you pop a blank in the back end put the ball in the front end and chamber. Pull the trigger, blank goes off driving the ball down the bore and into the small game or target. Take out cartridge, use finger nail to remove blank, reload and repeat as necessary.

This will be great for taking grouse while out hunting big game.

Kindest regards,

Carpediem





--------------------
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways-Chrdonnay in one hand-Chocolate in the other-body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WHOO-HOO, WHAT A RIDE!!"

Edited by CptCurl (09/02/11 09:47 PM)

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Oldbrit
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Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: carpediem4570]
      #175104 - 08/02/11 08:27 PM

It looks like a Hammond Game Getter

http://www3.telus.net/gamegetter/

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Sarg
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Reged: 20/01/07
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Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: Oldbrit]
      #175112 - 08/02/11 11:13 PM

I would say you are right , it has "Hammond" stamped on the side , I think I have heard of these Game Getter's before , sounds like a cool idea !

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carpediem4570
.300 member


Reged: 28/06/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: Sarg]
      #175131 - 09/02/11 03:59 AM

Yes, you are correct. It is a Hammond Game Getter.

The fellow that makes these lives in my city. He was, as usual, at the gun show displaying his wares. We chatted and I told him I would like him to make one in 9.3x74R and he reached in to his drawer and pulled one out.

He has them in every calibre and if he doesn't, he will make it.

I have never used one so it should be interesting getting it to function.

I am going to set it up for use in the left barrel so the right barrel always stays lead-free.

Kind regards,

Carpediem

--------------------
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways-Chrdonnay in one hand-Chocolate in the other-body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WHOO-HOO, WHAT A RIDE!!"

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Reged: 01/05/04
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Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: carpediem4570]
      #175178 - 09/02/11 09:48 PM

An interesting device. What size round ball do you use for it? Please report back when you have it up and running.

Thanks,
Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26504
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: CptCurl]
      #175200 - 10/02/11 04:24 AM

.375 is a normal 'cap and ball pistol' size sold by Lyman, Lee, RCBS, Saeco, etc and would indicated using the swage or drawing tool provided.

The next smaller 'standard' size is .350", although I think Lee might make a .360", which would be undersize as well, but perfect for .358's or 9mm's.

It is an easy system to make for yourself, but a lathe would be handy. You don't want the firing pin to hit the hard metal - only the rim of the inserted blank.

In smaller sized cases, I've heard of boring out the primer pocket of normal brass and using shotshell primers. Shotshell primers can be bought in several different 'strengths'. .358 Winchester or the 57mm cases come to mind.

Read the primer tests on page 18 of Ed Huble's 12 Gauge From Hell thread,(near the bottom of pag. 18) for strength in shotshell primer. They'd be the easiest to set up and would probably do for close range. You could have 3 or more in a pocket for grouse. If mor power is needed, a grain or two of AA's 5756,5746, 5677 5766, 5767??? or whatever that number actually is, would help. It's AA's fast burning cast bullet propellent that doesn't need fillers is the one I'm referring to. Look up the correct powder number before trying this. Hanloaders know which powder I'm referring to. Red dot shotgun powder might also work - without fillers. Only a gr, or 2 is necessary - just to boost speeds a bit. In that situation, I'd use normal primed brass only(easier), not modified, but it really wouldn't matter. This system would also work in larger cases, like the 9.3x74 with round blls or short lighter cast bullets.

My brother has a grouse load for his .356 Winchester using 110gr. 9mm bulk cast bullets & a fast pistol powder. At 25 yards, they shoot on the top of the post of his 'plex' scope and into a 3/8" group, normally - sometimes an odd flyer - maybe a bad bullet. I had a similar grouse load for my .458 using 230gr. Speer .45Auto bullets. They'd shoot into bug holes at 25 yards and still hold 3" at 100. At 1,340fps, they had about the same power as a .44 mag 6" Smith with descent loads but only 'popped' when fired - very quiet.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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FatAlbert
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Reged: 04/03/09
Posts: 4
Loc: North of La,Peoples Repb of Ca
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: carpediem4570]
      #175327 - 11/02/11 12:36 PM

Don'do it. Impact gun cartridges are very-very corrosive.

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AkMike
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Reged: 19/11/05
Posts: 2576
Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: FatAlbert]
      #175329 - 11/02/11 12:56 PM

What if anything is used for lube on these round balls?

This sounds like it could be useful!

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand

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carpediem4570
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Reged: 28/06/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: AkMike]
      #175997 - 22/02/11 05:24 AM

CaptCurl:
The round ball in the kit measures .375".
We are still knee deep in snow so it will be a few months before I get out and try this device. I hope I can get it to put two balls within one inch of one-another at 100 metres. Great practice rounds in preperation for hunting the big stuff . Should duplicate factory balistics no problem .

Hey, Hey, Hey, Fat Albert:
I did some checking and those .22 impact cartridges are no more corrosive than a primer. At least here in Canada. Where did you get your info?

AkMike:
The fellow who sold me the game getter said use any type of lube when pushing the ball through the sizing die; such as bullet lube, sewing machine oil, vegatable oil, motor oil, etc.

Kindest regards,

Carpediem

Edited by carpediem4570 (22/02/11 05:26 AM)

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: carpediem4570]
      #176012 - 22/02/11 11:11 AM

Hundred yards with a tiny RB from a DR? - maybe.

Now, I did use my .32 Flintlock on the trail today, hit every 100 yard target, too, but it's designed to shoot well - & sighted in with 35gr. 3F and a tightly patched round ball.

Good luck.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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450
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Reged: 30/12/06
Posts: 199
Loc: Melbourne,Victoria, Australia
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: DarylS]
      #182699 - 28/05/11 04:17 PM



I have used round balls with trail boss in my 9.3x74R browning double and my 45-70s. The 45-70 I use 12 grains with a 458 round ball and out to 25 yards it is very successful on rabbits and tin cans. The 9.3 is still being worked with but 6 grains is doing really well.

--------------------
The worst days shooting and hunting is better than the best day at work

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bwanabobftw
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Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 666
Loc: Texas
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 450]
      #182708 - 28/05/11 10:49 PM

".450",
Do you use a regular 9.3X74R case ? or do you have a "Game Getter Case" ?
Thanks,
Robert

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450
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Reged: 30/12/06
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Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #182748 - 29/05/11 03:55 PM

Bwanabob.

I just use the normal case. I expand the case mouth a little and push the ball in so it is halfway into the case and then crimp it useing the seating die. I first started doing this in my 9.3x62 Tikka and it worked a treat. I have had a few problems using other powders trying to get the velocity low enough and consistant. Trail boss works really well. the same procedure is used for the 45-70. But an virtually straight wall case lends itself to this procedure.

Wayne

--------------------
The worst days shooting and hunting is better than the best day at work

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bwanabobftw
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Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 666
Loc: Texas
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 450]
      #182812 - 30/05/11 02:50 PM

Wayne ,
Thanks , I will load some in my 9.3X74R and give them a try !!!!!
Robert

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450
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Reged: 30/12/06
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Loc: Melbourne,Victoria, Australia
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #182837 - 30/05/11 08:52 PM

bwanabobftw let me know how you go and what powder charge worked best for you.

Wayne

--------------------
The worst days shooting and hunting is better than the best day at work

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aromakr
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Reged: 20/04/11
Posts: 849
Loc: Hamilton, Montana
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 450]
      #182950 - 01/06/11 07:43 AM

What a great idea. I have a 9.3X74R, I think I will take this one step further and try some lead .357 mag bullets and paper patch them up to .370 as my barrel is a little oversize. Should be great on grouse and rabbits.
Bob

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450
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Reged: 30/12/06
Posts: 199
Loc: Melbourne,Victoria, Australia
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: aromakr]
      #182966 - 01/06/11 03:25 PM

Aromaker.

Never thought of that. Paper patching might work, but the next step is I wonder if it would be possible to bump up a 180 grn 357 slug to 366. It is only 9 thou. mmmmmmmmm.. A mate of mine bumps up 300 458 to 500 for his black powder express and it works. The slugs look very strange but they seem to shoot well enough to use the rifle. Keep us informed of how it goes.

Wayne

--------------------
The worst days shooting and hunting is better than the best day at work

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BlackFly
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Reged: 04/03/09
Posts: 2
Loc: Newville, PA, USA
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 450]
      #183045 - 03/06/11 10:29 AM

I use 9mm Makarov bullets for my light loads in my 9.3x74. They are usually .365. I get pretty good accuracy (2") out to 25 yards, but don't expect them to regulate. I use magnum primers and small charges of Unique powder to almost 1000 fps. They worked in my drilling and I still use them in my Chapuis. I suspect the Gamegetter would give better accuracy and be safer. There is a bit of danger messing around with small charges in big cases.
Bfly

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Mike_Johnson
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Reged: 17/10/09
Posts: 104
Loc: York, Pa
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: BlackFly]
      #183046 - 03/06/11 10:39 AM

I have a 9.3x74R to 9mm makarov chamber adaptor I got from a guy in Alaska. Works great for target practice and small game hunting
I think I will look for one of these adaptors and give it a try. thanks

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: Mike_Johnson]
      #183047 - 03/06/11 10:57 AM


Blackfly

What weight are the Makarov bullets ?


Seems strange that you can't get a 9.3 to regulate with a lighter bullet - of course depending on how light it is !!!

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BlackFly
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Reged: 04/03/09
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Loc: Newville, PA, USA
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 500Nitro]
      #183048 - 03/06/11 11:04 AM

They are only 95 grains, my rifle is regulated with 286 grainers. Both barrels are close enough to center for fun shooting at 25 yards, just low. I can't say whether they cross or spread. I've only shot to 50 yards. Out there, they just go helter skelter.
Bfly

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500Nitro
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Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: BlackFly]
      #183049 - 03/06/11 11:10 AM


That is light. No wonder.


We might have to come up with a 33% rule for double rifles !!! LOL

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aromakr
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Reged: 20/04/11
Posts: 849
Loc: Hamilton, Montana
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: 500Nitro]
      #183111 - 06/06/11 07:51 AM

Early tests look good. My barrel mikes .370 so I paper patched some 158gr .357 cast Keith type bullets. Two wraps of damp computer paper gave me .372, after the patches dried, I seated some Win large rifle primers in Norma cased and loaded 10 grains of IMR 4759 and placed a 1.00" square piece of toilet tissue on top of the powder with a pencil to hold the powder in place. Then seated the patched bullets until just the top edge of the patch was visible, at 15 yards both barrels centered the bottom of a pop can, off hand, I'm impressed. As usual take care in loading this in you gun and I will not resume any responsibility if it doesn't work or causes problems.
Bob

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bwanabobftw
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Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 666
Loc: Texas
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: aromakr]
      #183114 - 06/06/11 08:03 AM

Bob ,
Sounds like a great load. I am with my sick Dad now. As soon as I can get home I will try that load in my 9.3. Sounds like just the ticket for small game and birds !!!!
Robert

PS want to try Wayne's "round ball load" load as well.

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aromakr
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Reged: 20/04/11
Posts: 849
Loc: Hamilton, Montana
Re: Round ball insert for 9.3x74R [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #187338 - 05/08/11 09:58 AM

I've done some more playing with this load. Instead of paper patching I used some Teflon plumbers tape Three wraps gave me the dia. I wanted on a 158gr .357 keith type cast bullet. Using a Win large primer and 7 grains of H4759 with a very thin slice of foam to hold the powder against the primer, I'm next going to try florist foam. I can hold 4 shots in 1.5 inches at 20 yds offhand. I might also try modifying the case for a shotgun primer and no powder.
Bob

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