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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns
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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader
      #141103 - 25/08/09 11:37 AM

I'm nearly done with the rifle. All I have left to do is finish the front sight, what this really means is all I have to do is manage to work up a load and file the front sight down so it hits at the given yardage(50 yards) and then a little final bluing and it's finished. If I actually shoulder this thing for more than a few shots I may not be able to type for a long time after so I figured I better post these pictures now. Haha.
The Details: Black Walnut Stock, 16 LPI Semi-flattop Checkering, Smoothbore 1.277" dia, Full top rib with quarter rib and front ramp integral.Full bottom rib, steel ramrod with brass ends. The final weight is 24 pounds. And I made every piece of this rifle from stock, if you would like details of the build you can go to my website: Stolzer & Son's 2 Bore project
Later this week I will be strapping it down to my sight in rig that I built for this gun and getting it close to sighted in, hopefully, and then if I'm feeling really brave or just have a total laps in judgment I might actually shoot it a couple times. Bwahhahahahaha(evil Laugh)






























Any questions that you can't find the answers to in the build documentation on my website, feel free to ask.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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eagle27
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Reged: 24/01/09
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Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141129 - 25/08/09 08:29 PM

Jez cowboy it wouldn't look out of place poking out the gun turrets of an old Gallion and would probably have made a good job of defeating the Spanish Armada.

Lotta nice work gone into this. Thanks for the photos.

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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: eagle27]
      #141144 - 25/08/09 11:58 PM

Thank You, it's good for Elephants and all things smaller.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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DarylS
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Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141152 - 26/08/09 02:22 AM

Colin- if a squirrel backed down the bore, you could blow 'the' nuts out of his mouth!

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: DarylS]
      #141189 - 26/08/09 11:50 PM

That's funny, Daryl.

I was going to start working on load development today, so I could get the front sight finished, but I woke up to pouring rain, so I'll have to wait till it clears up. The upside is I won't have to worry about setting my pasture/Rifle Range on fire for a couple days.

I spent part of yesterday casting balls for this thing, learned a few things, like it takes a lot of lead to make any quantity of balls, I know that seems kinda obvious until you start pouring from a 20 pound pot and see how fast it disappears. When I cast the proof balls a while back I only cast enough to get the proofing done, so I wasn't really paying attention to how long it was taking to cast. Yesterday though I was trying to get an idea of what kind of production could be done and get a smooth rythme going. What I discovered is you can only cast about 1 ball about every 1.5 - 2 minutes and about every 5th ball you have to set the mould down and let it cool for a good 3-4 minutes. So the average is 1 ball about every 2.5-3 minutes. The mould is so massive and the amount of lead is so great that it would almost be worth it to machine a mould with cooling fins. I also learned that a soup ladle makes a pretty good pour, since you need a pound of lead or so at a time, so you can not only fill the mould but also keep over pouring the sprue for at least 15-20 seconds.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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DarylS
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Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141192 - 27/08/09 01:53 AM

Casting would not be fun - there would be an increidible amount of shrinkage resulting in internal voids if you didn't keep pouring the lead over the spure area after pouring the cavity. A larger ladle might be advantageous to holding enough lead to continue pouring lead over the sprue for a good stretch of time.

Had a moth fly into my lead pot yesterday while casting 15 bore balls - glad I was wearing a sweater and at least the one glove (got hit heavily with olten lead) on my right hand. As I caught a flash of a small white 'thing' flutter over the pot, I raised my right hand in front of my face and POW, the pot seemed to expload- lead flying everywhere. There was quite a puddle of molten lead hit my sweater, which protected my chest as well as my jeans and 'crocs'. The holes in the crocs let a bit through, but the socks stopped that. Exciting to say the least. Be careful casting - bugs are not our friends.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader [Re: DarylS]
      #141194 - 27/08/09 02:49 AM

Ouch, I've never had my pot explode so to speak, but I've been splattered a few times. Earlier this summer it was 100+ deg outside and I was casting some .62 cal conicals, and a drop of sweat fell off my brow and landed on the rim of the pot, thankfully not in it, cause just the little bit of spray from that caused a couple of nice pea size blobs to land on my forearm. Keeping the mould resting on the edge of the pot to keep the temp up and over pouring for 15-20 seconds seemed to work pretty good. I didn't cut any apart and I haven't weighed them yet, but from the outside appearance they are nice and smooth. After I cut the sprues off I may run them across my scale just to see if they are pretty close.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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CowboyCS
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Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader VIDEOS [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141214 - 27/08/09 10:39 AM

The moment so many have been waiting to see; VIDEO of me actually shooting it. There should be two videos below one is hi-res(16mb) for the guys who have faster internet, and the other one is lo-res(2mb) for the dial-up users. They are the same footage of me taking three different shots; the first shot was the very first shot from the shoulder, the load was 13 drams(355 grains FFg) and patched round ball, the other two shots in the video were the final shots I made, 16 drams(437 grains FFg) and patched round ball.

Hi-res:


Lo-res:


This was the target from the last two shots in the video, shot at 50 yards:


I'm not sure exactly how to describe the felt recoil other than it was a lot, but it is still within my range of tolerance.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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bigdog
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Reged: 05/02/06
Posts: 559
Loc: Southern Illinois
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader VIDEOS [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141229 - 27/08/09 03:59 PM

CowboyCS, a great rifle. The 2 bore that Steve made is mine. I may have missed it, but what barrel length did you end up with? Have you chronied any rounds yet? The balls weigh?? thanks and great pics. It takes a gun nut to really appreciate a rifle like this. Sure glad I qualify.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader VIDEOS [Re: bigdog]
      #141241 - 27/08/09 10:45 PM

Biddog, Thank You. I handled your 2 Bore(I apprenticed under Steve) before it was finished, I built the underrib that is on your 2 Bore. I didn't run any across my Chrony yet, I was working on load development and accuracy yesterday. I don't know exactly what the balls weigh(don't have a grain scale big enough), I cast these ones from Wheel Weights, and the bore on my 2 bore is 1.277" not the true 1.326", so I would hazard a guess that they are around 3000 grains maybe. The barrel is 24".

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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CowboyCS
.333 member


Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Boxlock Muzzleloader VIDEOS [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141252 - 28/08/09 01:02 AM

I took a little time this morning and made a frame by frame video so you could really get and idea of what kind of recoil this thing has.

Here's a link to it: http://s269.photobucket.com/albums/jj75/...xFrame2Bore.flv

It's really quite impressive when you slow it down and see what is actually happening.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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CowboyCS
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Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
2 Bore Accoutrements Case [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141760 - 09/09/09 02:09 AM

This is my first attempt at case making, I need to be honest here and say that case building is clearly a skilled form that is well worth the money spent on a professional case maker. This was quite possibly one of the hardest parts of this build. Fitting and lining even this little accoutrements box took me several frustrating days to do, and the results are clearly not as nicely done as a professional case builder would be able to do. So my hats off to them, they certainly have my respect for their talents.

The Front:


The Back:


The Inside:


The Box was built from Walnut, Claro for the top and bottom, and Black for the sides. All the hardware is brass. It has a similar finish to the rifle.

I haven't decided how I am going to case the rifle yet, I'm having difficulty finding walnut of the sizes I need. White Oak is an option, but I'm not sure that is the way I want to go yet. I have also considered buying an Aluminum Flight case, and then lining it with a fitted liner.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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degoins
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Reged: 28/02/06
Posts: 427
Loc: SC, USA
Re: 2 Bore Accoutrements Case [Re: CowboyCS]
      #141773 - 09/09/09 07:51 AM

Looks very nice to me. As for the rifle case, I have seen black walnut plywood that looked pretty good. That might be an option.

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CowboyCS
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Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: degoins]
      #142077 - 16/09/09 12:30 AM

The rifle case is finally finished and this is now a completed set. All I'm lacking is the handle for the center of the case, I just haven't found what I am looking for yet. There are brass handles on each end of the case though, so it is easy enough to pick up and move around.

The Final details:
2 Bore
24" Smoothbore barrel
Weight 24 pounds
Full Top rib with integrated quarter rib and front ramp.
Full under rib with pipes and sling stud.
Black Walnut Stock with ebony tip.
Oil Finished.
Single leaf English express sights.
Rust Blued, with moderate coverage engraving.
16 LPI Semi-Flattop Checkering.
Both the rifle case and the accoutrements case are walnut, with a similar finish to the rifle.











I hope you enjoyed this build.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

Edited by CowboyCS (16/09/09 01:05 AM)

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450_366
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Reged: 17/01/07
Posts: 1068
Loc: Sweden, west-coast.
Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: CowboyCS]
      #142085 - 16/09/09 04:11 AM

Awsome build thats for sure, well done in both cases and rifle.

--------------------
Andreas

"Yeas it kicks like a mule he said, but always remember that its much worse standing on the other end"

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: 450_366]
      #142092 - 16/09/09 06:41 AM

Nice case - the recoil doesn't look to bad - not much worse than my 14 bore as to 'appearance', however it is evident theer is more 'push' to your rifle - good thing yours weighs almost 3 times what mine weighs. Here's a picture of before and after. The right shoulder being driven down is what pulls the comb away from the face.



--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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degoins
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Reged: 28/02/06
Posts: 427
Loc: SC, USA
Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: DarylS]
      #142093 - 16/09/09 07:39 AM

Excellent work all the way around. Thanks for sharing.

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CowboyCS
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Reged: 05/10/07
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Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: degoins]
      #142127 - 16/09/09 09:56 PM

Thank you for the compliments.

Properly built with the right stock architecture makes a lot of difference in how much felt recoil there is, my opinion anyways.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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bigdog
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: CowboyCS]
      #142714 - 26/09/09 06:27 PM

Very nice looking gun and cases. You should be proud of it. Any idea how long it actually took to build the gun and both cases. Total number of hours?? thanks Ken again Great work!!

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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CowboyCS
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Reged: 05/10/07
Posts: 386
Loc: Kansas u.S.A.
Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: bigdog]
      #142718 - 26/09/09 10:01 PM

I didn't keep exact count of the hours, it was something I worked on in between other projects. But it took about 10 months, and if I had to guess I would say probably around 700-750 hours for the full set maybe a little more.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

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bigdog
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: CowboyCS]
      #142725 - 27/09/09 02:31 AM

Time well spent is all I can say. I love shooting them, but have no talent to make such a gun.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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mehulkamdar
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: CowboyCS]
      #142767 - 27/09/09 04:56 PM

Lovely rifle, Colin. I saw Steve's writeup and review of it.

Simply beautiful work!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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bigdog
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #142771 - 27/09/09 05:32 PM

Colin, I measured my 2 bore balls, and the balls themselves are 1.309" in diameter. I have to use a fairly thin patch at about .08" thickness to get it to fit in the 1.325" bore. The round balls weigh right at 3340 grains a piece. The regular pillow ticking that is used a lot for patches is way too thick. The material I use is almost like a really thin cloth sheet. Do you use any kind of card between your lubed patch and the powder? I use a simple index card cut round to fit.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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CowboyCS
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: bigdog]
      #142783 - 27/09/09 11:26 PM

Thank You mehulkambar, I presume you are referring to Steve over on The Firearms Blog, he's pretty generous to me, this is the second rifle of mine he has wrote about.

Bigdog, the bore on mine measures 1.275" and the balls cast 1.255" I used standard pillow ticking from Walmart, lubed with Crisco. I haven't weighed any of the balls to find out what they actually weigh, but I know they are less than yours because they are not only smaller in diameter but I cast mine from wheel weights, so they are a lighter alloy as well. The calculator says they should weigh about 2868 grains. I found that a rubber mallet makes a very nice short starter, cut the patch at the muzzle, tap it in with the rubber, then flip it over and use the handle for a short starter. Then I used a 1" hardwood dowel for a range rod, it makes for a lot to grab hold of and push the ball down, but it wasn't a tough fit since mine is smoothbore they rammed right down and seated easily.

I tried some 1/2" thick felt wads that were a little over bore size, but I didn't notice any difference in accuracy or performance, so other than adding another step to the loading I'm not sure what they would accomplish. Since this is a smoothbore having more lube on a wad is really no benefit for fouling.

Colin

--------------------
The Bill of Rights- Void were prohibited by law
Stolzer & Son's Gunsmithing

Edited by CowboyCS (27/09/09 11:33 PM)

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bigdog
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Re: 2 Bore Finished Cased Set [Re: CowboyCS]
      #142786 - 28/09/09 12:44 AM

Colin,
thanks for you loading information. Ken

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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