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Vintage_Canvas
.275 member

Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa

9.5x57MS on kudu
#369122 - 10/09/22 06:01 AM

At last I was able to use my 9.5 on something bigger than warthog and impala! After 2 frustrating days with heavy winds, rain and a lack of action, day 3 arrive with perfect weather! Windless, sunshine and game everywhere after the previous few days of bad weather...
We spotted this young kudu bull from about 800m going into a valley and start the stalk! After about 2 hours and 3 different approach angles, we finally ran out of cover... the distance about 150yards!
As I was standing on the sticks and the tracker was on the bino's looking for a opportunity, the waiting game begin. The bull decided to keep well inside a bush and only make small movements for about half an hour. Eventually he moved around only enough for me to make out his front quarter, and I took the shot! He collapsed on the spot! Must say a lucky shot!
later that evening all the trackers was joking: "when the 9.5 talks, the kudu's listen"

Terrain. I was taking the shot from the righthand side top of the ridge.

Kudu fell right where it was standing under the bush

Entry of the bullet high on the shoulder. 270gr Hornaday RN at 2250f/s

Happy hunter. Happy tracker

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 1826
Loc: The Redwoods of California

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369123 - 10/09/22 07:25 AM

Quote:

At last I was able to use my 9.5 on something bigger than warthog and impala!...

Entry of the bullet high on the shoulder. 270gr Hornaday RN at 2250f/s

Well done, and with a Take Down Model; no less.

Those Hornady #3715 are rather hard to find here in the U.S., having been out of production for over a decade.

--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation

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93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4202
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Rothhammer1]
#369125 - 10/09/22 08:31 AM

Well done VC!
Perfect spot to hit, anchored thru the spine I'd say!
Would love to see the recovered bullet.
Great trophy.

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Waidmannsheil
.400 member

Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2445
Loc: Melbourne Australia

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: 93x64mm]
#369130 - 10/09/22 10:21 AM

Great to see the 9.5 being used in earnest, good kill shot too. Those Hornady's are just a cup and core projectile but it obviously worked perfectly in this case. Great to see you using the rifle as intended. Well done.

Matt.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39889
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Waidmannsheil]
#369134 - 10/09/22 11:27 AM

Well done VC.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 1826
Loc: The Redwoods of California

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Waidmannsheil]
#369142 - 10/09/22 12:40 PM

Quote:

Great to see the 9.5 being used in earnest, good kill shot too. Those Hornady's are just a cup and core projectile but it obviously worked perfectly in this case. Great to see you using the rifle as intended. Well done.

Matt.

Iron sights as well, 150 yards.

--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation

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Vintage_Canvas
.275 member

Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Rothhammer1]
#369144 - 10/09/22 02:37 PM

Thanks guys!
Brian I thought you might like it, as you have the same rifle! Re the 270gr bullets, managed to lay my hands on 5 boxes of the Hornady 270gr RN bullets over the last couple of years! Whenever I walked into a gunshop, I asked about them and some other obsolute cartridges and bullets!

Matt I won't use them on bluewildebeest or eland, but for anything smaller they worked fine!
I am waiting to get the bullet back to see performance! I did not exit!

Of all my open sight Mannlichers, the 9.5 give the best groups on the range, and I usually don't shoot that far with open sights! Most shots is under 100yards, but we ran out of cover, and the kudu became aware of us! If I had one of the lighter calibres, I would not have taken the shot at that distance!
Will come back with the bullet performance...
Cheers

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369146 - 10/09/22 05:48 PM

Why not the 270 gr RN in the 9.5x57 for eland and wildebeest? Sounds well capable.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Waidmannsheil
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Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2445
Loc: Melbourne Australia

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369177 - 11/09/22 06:36 PM

So what projectile do you use on the other animals?

Matt.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.

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Vintage_Canvas
.275 member

Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Waidmannsheil]
#369189 - 11/09/22 11:27 PM

John my rifle and the components that we have available in SA only get around 2100f/s with the Hornady RN bullets. Kuduae send me a load with Vitha N140 that give him around 2400f/s, but I cant find Vitha N140 anywhere in SA, and we dont have a similar powder! So I have to make use of Somchem S335. If I can get the speed up to 2350-2400f/s I will take eland with my rifle! I use my 9.3x62 and 10.75x68 for eland. If you can remember last year I posted pics of a bluewildebeest that I shot with my Mannlicher 8x60S, but that is with 200gr bullets at 2580f/s!
Maybe I must try a eland cow next time with the 9.5 and the 270gr bullets???

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4202
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369193 - 12/09/22 05:49 AM

VC
Can you only get Somchem powders in SA?
Let us know here if you have any other types, hopefully we can get a bit more zing out of your ol' girl!

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Louis
.375 member

Reged: 13/05/15
Posts: 977
Loc: France

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: 93x64mm]
#369211 - 12/09/22 11:13 PM

VC, congratulations on your hunt and thank you for your great report.
Louis

--------------------
"Everything that doesn't kill me makes me stronger"

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39889
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369214 - 13/09/22 03:20 AM

Quote:

John my rifle and the components that we have available in SA only get around 2100f/s with the Hornady RN bullets. Kuduae send me a load with Vitha N140 that give him around 2400f/s, but I cant find Vitha N140 anywhere in SA, and we dont have a similar powder! So I have to make use of Somchem S335. If I can get the speed up to 2350-2400f/s I will take eland with my rifle! I use my 9.3x62 and 10.75x68 for eland. If you can remember last year I posted pics of a bluewildebeest that I shot with my Mannlicher 8x60S, but that is with 200gr bullets at 2580f/s!
Maybe I must try a eland cow next time with the 9.5 and the 270gr bullets???

I'd give it a go on water buffalo.

My 9.3x74R shooting 287 gr Woodleigh Weldcore at less than 2200 fps and used it on 14 water buffalo. No big bulls though yet. Younger bulls, and cows. Culling. Some took more than one shot e.g. shooting maybe four or five at once with my double 9.3, bang, bang, a bullet in two. reload, bang, a third, bang, reshoot an earlier one getting up, reload, etc. The PH/property owner was spotting for me. Also a nice big scrub bull.

A .375 270 gr Woodleigh Weldcore at 2100 to 2300 fps should work minimally OK I would think? I'd like some 270 gr RN FMJs in .375 as well, in case of a charge or a fleeing buffalo. I wonder if anyone makes them?

I have only shot one eland bull and one wildebeest bull. Both with a .30-06. 180 gr Nosler Partition for the wildebeest. We shot at the back of the head, neck running away. Wounded. Followed up for over 32 kms. Found the next morning. Switched 200 gr Nosler Partition Semi Pointed as the 180 grs we're failing. These 200 grs worked well. The eland shot to the heart, quartering from rear right. It ran a few steps. Stood there quivering. Running up, a second round to the chest broadside caused it to collapse.

I'd use my 9.5x57 on pigs, deer, sambar, and be happy to use it on scrub bull, other ferals. I'd be reasonably confident on most water buffalo. Choose shots on big bulls. Hopefully will find out one day.

As long as the 9.5x57 with a 270 gr can penetrate adequately, I don't see a problem with careful shots on buffalo and eland, scrub bulls etc.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Marrakai
.416 member

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3592
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: NitroX]
#369226 - 13/09/22 08:26 AM

As with a lot of opportunity on buffalo, and probably scrub bulls (dunno about kudu), it often depends on whether you have been "made" or not during the stalk.
A big bull might look calm, but if he's spotted you he will have done an adrenalin-dump in preparation for fight-or-flight and a marginal calibre can get you into serious trouble.

If a bull is unaware of your presence at the time of the shot, a marginal calibre bullet in the right place can be just as devastating as a big-bore (as VC demonstrates!).

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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degoins
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Reged: 28/02/06
Posts: 435
Loc: SC, USA

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Marrakai]
#369236 - 13/09/22 11:14 PM

Nice......congrats!!!

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Vintage_Canvas
.275 member

Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: degoins]
#369361 - 19/09/22 03:02 AM

9.3x64, We do get Vithavouri, Norma, Hogdon, IMR and the odd other brands, but in limited number and burn rates. I have Vitha in N540, N550 and N560, but struggle to get N140 and N160. Apparently they dont import those...
John I am part of a local Mannlicher group, and one of the members has shot 2 Cape Buffalo with his MS 9.5x57, using a local monolitic bullet of 270gr, and back up in his magazine is 4 Kynoch solids. The monolitics dont feed well out of the MS but the old Kynochs is like butter, so his 1st shot was with the mono and them back up shots was with the Kynoch solids, also 270gr! I have 10 packs of the old Kynochs, and tested them in my rifle, they feed fine and the load is hot! I chrony them at around 2380f.s and accuracy is very good! Maybe I will go the same route next year when I plan my buffalo hunt. Maybe Woodleigh would be up and running again, so I can get some 270gr bullets from them? Maybe you have info on the developments with Woodleigh??

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Parabola
.224 member

Reged: 09/01/21
Posts: 26
Loc: England

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: 93x64mm]
#369362 - 19/09/22 03:32 AM

Nice rifle and excellent result!

Remember that if you are using fairly soft bullets (like the old Kynoch 9.5 soft points) less can be more.

A bullet arriving at 2,000 fps that expands but holds together is going to be more effective than one at 2,400 fps that fails to penetrate properly.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39889
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369379 - 19/09/22 03:47 PM

Quote:

Maybe Woodleigh would be up and running again, so I can get some 270gr bullets from them? Maybe you have info on the developments with Woodleigh??

I'm sure we will hear when they become available again. Remember with such a range it might take some time, even years before all the obscure projectiles are made again. Hopefully all of them? And some are not dropped. I expect some design changes if the paper drawings and plans were burned. Redesigning from scratch, or from a partitioned bullet. The ammunition makers must be champing at the bit for resupplies. I'm sure there needs will be catered for first. Maybe prepaid orders? We can thank the big ammo makers for urging the rebuilding of Woodleigh.

And of course Geoff and Shirley McDonald for being willing to do it. And actually doing all the work.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (19/09/22 03:49 PM)

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Igorrock
.400 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1649
Loc: Finland

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: NitroX]
#369405 - 20/09/22 06:52 PM

Quote:

We do get Vithavouri, Norma, Hogdon, IMR and the odd other brands

It´s always funny to see how you read and write non-english names; VIHTAVUORI (place in Middle Finland) is the correct way to write, not "Vithavouri". Same with LAHTI (city in Southern Finland) -pistol, not "Lathi".

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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Vintage_Canvas
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Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Igorrock]
#369424 - 21/09/22 04:51 PM

Hi Igorrock
sorry, I actually know the correct spelling, but I think it is the habit of normal english typing that take over in the mind...
Talking of Vihtavuori?? How big is the difference between N140 and N540 as well as N160 and N560? Maybe I can replace them to try and duplicate the N140 and N160 loads the Kuduae has send me...I do have some N540 and N560 in stock.

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Igorrock
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Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
#369450 - 22/09/22 04:40 AM

Quote:

How big is the difference between N140 and N540 as well as N160 and N560? Maybe I can replace them to try and duplicate the N140 and N160 loads the Kuduae has send me...I do have some N540 and N560 in stock.

Maybe this helps you: https://www.vihtavuori.com/reloading-data/rifle-reloading/

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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Kabalas
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Reged: 04/06/22
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Loc: Alberta, Canada

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Igorrock]
#369462 - 22/09/22 03:26 PM

Congratulation!

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DonZ
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Reged: 24/12/12
Posts: 120
Loc: BW

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: Kabalas]
#369474 - 23/09/22 05:35 AM

OK, I will throw this out there, and maybe Kuduae will share:

I have in my safe about a kilo of N160. I also have about 100 Woodleigh 270 grain projectiles.
For my 6.5, I also have some Woodleighs (160 grain) kicking around. VV has recommended N160 as the "correct" powder, but QuickLoad is telling me it is so slow burning that unburned powder will exit the barrel with the round. VV cannot give me load data, because they haven't actually tested loads for either rifle.

I'm curious about the differences/recommendations between N160 and N560.

Can anyone help with a starting load? I can run some numbers in QuickLoad, but any information will be very much appreciated!

Oh, I forgot to mention: For the 9.5, I have once fired brass from Dorfner, for the 6.5 I have Norma and RWS brass, both once fired and unfired, and I have a lot of CCI primers and access to RWS primers.

--------------------
Honor never grows old, and honor rejoices the heart of age...

Edited by DonZ (23/09/22 05:38 AM)

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JDL
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Reged: 25/12/10
Posts: 252
Loc: Louisiana

Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: DonZ]
#370529 - 21/10/22 03:45 AM

Most excellent Vintage Canvas! Congratulations on a great trophy taken with a magnificent, clssic rifle with iron sights. I wish my vision was like it was 55 years ago when I could use iron sights well.

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DarylS
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Re: 9.5x57MS on kudu [Re: JDL]
#370538 - 21/10/22 01:20 PM

Don, my Vihtavuori loading manual does not have 6.5x54 data, but lists 160gr. data for 6.5x55, 57 and 57R using N160.
The 6.5x55 data shows 2,510fps at only 45,000psi, & 200fps faster than N165 for the Swede in Hornady's own manual.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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