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NitroXAdministrator
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10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor
      #371453 - 15/11/22 03:45 AM

10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor

If you love the idea of .26-inch bullet diameter but hate the 6.5 Creedmoor, here are 10 cartridges of the same, well, caliber

By Richard Mann | Updated Oct 29, 2021 2:02 PM

https://www.fieldandstream.com/outdoor-gear/best-6-5-cartridges/

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: NitroX]
      #371466 - 15/11/22 08:17 AM

Good summation.

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kuduae
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #371467 - 15/11/22 09:45 AM

Quote:

Good summation.


But far from complete imho. Some other important 6.5mm hunting cartridges:
6.5x53R Mannlicher: Saw much use both in the Scottish Highlands and in Africa. The first small bore widely used for hunting.
The developed famous 6.5x54 Mannlicher – Schoenauer was used worldwide by famous big game hunters. It can be loaded to equal the Creedmare.
The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x57R are very popular in central Europe. Only recently replaced in part by the 6.4x55 SE.
The 6.5x68 does the same as all the 6.5mm “Magnum” cartridges mentioned though it predates them by decades.

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sharps4590
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: kuduae]
      #371475 - 15/11/22 01:06 PM

I agree, he sure left out some dandies that precede most mentioned.

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: kuduae]
      #371481 - 15/11/22 06:31 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Good summation.


But far from complete imho. Some other important 6.5mm hunting cartridges:
6.5x53R Mannlicher: Saw much use both in the Scottish Highlands and in Africa. The first small bore widely used for hunting.
The developed famous 6.5x54 Mannlicher – Schoenauer was used worldwide by famous big game hunters. It can be loaded to equal the Creedmare.
The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x57R are very popular in central Europe. Only recently replaced in part by the 6.4x55 SE.
The 6.5x68 does the same as all the 6.5mm “Magnum” cartridges mentioned though it predates them by decades.



100% misses. Missed the real ones except for the 6.5x55. Alright some mentioned are mentionable. But many were flaccid marketing attempts that never rose. Hot air never succeeded. The European successful cartridges already existed.

It's another flaccid Dick Mann article!

I have a 6.5x55, a 6.5x53R, 6.5x54 M-S, and a 6.5x65 RWS. I do need a 6.5x68!

They do need to be used more. I always preferred a 6.5mm to the .243/6mm for Australian hunting.

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: NitroX]
      #371504 - 16/11/22 04:02 AM

The only trouble with the 6.5x68 was the 12" rifling twist in normal factory rifles chambered in that round in years gone buy - unless that has changed in the last few years.

I re-chambered a M96 to 6.5x68. I kept my loads on the low side, with 129's running 3,000fps, not the 3,300fps my buddy was 'getting" in his re-barreled and chambered m1917 Enfield.

The only thing I shot with it, was 2 snowshoe hares - 1 shot. They were 210 and 220yards from me, one directly behind the other, on the Bowran (logging) Road. Pow - 2 bunnies down.

The un-chamber a loaded round, I had to partially pull the bolt.
Gunsmith by the name of Arch chambered up a 6.5x55 to .264 Win, Mag once. Noted in Ackley's #2 book, so I did a similar thing.

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85lc
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #371585 - 19/11/22 04:20 AM

I would add the 256 Newton to the list.

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: 85lc]
      #371586 - 19/11/22 05:39 AM

Ahh yes, the .256 Newton a very slightly shortened 6.5/06.

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bwanabobftw
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #371633 - 20/11/22 08:56 AM

Surprised no one mentioned the 6.5x65R by RWS ? It’s a wonderful “6.5”
Robert

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #371637 - 20/11/22 01:00 PM

Yes, it would be, just as the 6.5/06 is a decent round.

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swm
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #373751 - 02/02/23 01:02 PM

my 6.5-06 is a wonderful cartridge but of course a handloading proposition only. I don't suppose I would use it on elk or eland, but on anything smaller I would feel perfectly comfortable.

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Homer
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: swm]
      #373812 - 04/02/23 06:59 AM

G'Day Fella's,

I agree, the 6.5-06, along with a number of European 6.5mm cartridges, could have easily been included, in this list (but then, this is a US writen article).

FYI. I only recently, had a spare Remington, Model 7 action, rebarreled to 6.5 Rem Mag (as listed in the above article).
Years ago, I had horse traded to get the action (with a .308 Win bolt), and then acquired a new replacement, Pacific Tool and Gauge, (via a good mate, that was working in the US, at the time), one piece bolt, with a H&H size bolt face (and M16 type extractor).
I only recently, had Allan Swan Gunsmithing, supply and fit one of their 24", spiral fluted button rifled barrels, to this M7 action.
I am currently awaiting the delivery, of a High-Tech Specialties synthetic stock order https://www.bansnerandcompany.com/bansner-composite-rifle-stocks/, that includes a stock for this Rem M7 rifle.
Once I have fitted the barreled action, to this new stock, I will Cerakote the lot, and it will be ready for a hunt.

Also FYI. This rifle, will them be my twin, to my Rem, M673 rifle, in .350 Rem Mag.

Avagreatweekendeh!
Homer

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: Homer]
      #373821 - 04/02/23 01:43 PM

Hand Laid Composite - will be quite strong.

Due to your barrel length, Homer, your ballistics should be close to these. You will have to sub. ADI powders for the H varieties.

Hodgdon #21 1970 - the book I used for mine.

Top-loads 6.5 Rem Mag. - bl.length not given

100gr.----4831 - 60.0gr. 3,416fps -- 48,100CUP
-------IMR4895 - 50.0gr. 3,475fps -- 52,800CUP
120gr.----4831 - 59.0gr. 3,286fps -- 51,000CUP
-------IMR4895 - 46.0gr. 3,081fps -- 50.900CUP
129gr.----4931 - 58.0gr. 3,155fps -- 50,800CUP
-------IMR4895 - 44.0gr. 2,936fps -- 49.900CUP
140gr.----4831 - 54.0gr. 2,943fps -- 51,400CUP
----------H450 - 54.0gr. 2,925fps -- 51,700CUP

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Homer
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #373830 - 04/02/23 07:10 PM

G'Day Fella's,

Thank You for that load data DarylS, Very Much Appreciated!

FYI. I have been running-in the new barrel of this rifle, by shooting bullets into the bullet trap, beside my reloading bench.
For this, I have been loading up ammo, using ADI Powder- AR-2213SC (H4831SC equiv), Bertram Cases, and CCI, 250 Mag primers, plugged with a Nosler, 120grn B/Tip bullet.

As is my usual, I have created a Dummy Round, with a bullet seated to the correct OAL, to fit and function/feed from the magazine of this rifle.
I then use 5 other cases, that I use to load up, with increasing powder charges.
Once I run the barrel in (firing shots and cleaning the barrel-for 20 to 30 shots), I use the increasing powder charges, to work up to what I refer to as a, Maximum Safe Working Load (MSWL), of this load combination, in this rifle.

Once this process is completed, I then head to the range, and see what the accuracy and chrongraphed velocities of the combination are. I then make any adjustment (to the bullet seating depth and or powder charge), until I am happy with the outcome, and then go hunting.

Hope that helps

D'oh!
Homer

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: Homer]
      #373834 - 05/02/23 12:35 AM

Barnes published a recipe for working up loads, a long time ago.
Fred, I think it was, noted to load up from starting loads, 1 grain increments to a maximum load in a variety of powders suitable to the ctg. and bullet weight.
Fire each "group" of bullets at a separate target, THEN select the powder for that bullet weight by the smallest group spread. That way, you will have the smallest variation when using powders that vary with temperature and humidity. Of course, today, if using the modern non temperature sensitive powders, this is a moot point, somewhat, but an interesting and thought provoking concept.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #373852 - 05/02/23 12:14 PM

How does a 6.5/06 and a 6.5x65 RWS differ?

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: NitroX]
      #373854 - 05/02/23 12:48 PM

The 6.5/06 pretty much duplicates the ballistics I noted for the 6.5 Rem Mag., perhaps another 100fps in some bullet weights, like the 140gr.
I think the reason for that is due to the short magazine in most rifles chambered for the 6.5 Rem Mag. & the longer allowed bullet seating in the 6.5/06 with normal 3,340" allowance.
The 6.5 Rem Mag usually has short mags which means long bullets have to be seated more deeply, robbing powder space - with 140's etc.
If loaded to the same working pressure level, the long case 6.5's should be virtually identical to the shorter, fatter 6.5 Rem. Mag.
The working pressure for the 6.5/06 ASquare is 65,000PSI - pezio.
I do not have a listing for the 6.5x65RWS.
The 6.5x57, a German ctg., I think, has a working pressure same as the other 57mm ctgs. at 57,000PSI Pezio.
The 6.5Rem Mag is 63,000PSI, 53,000CUP.

It's strange, whereas the .270 Winchester has a working pressure of 65,000psi, the .30/06 limit is 60,000psi, using exactly the same case. Of course part of that perhaps is the older Springfield rifles in .06, but many higher pressure custom rifles are made up on the Springfield action.

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: kuduae]
      #373925 - 07/02/23 01:18 PM

Quote:

Some other important 6.5mm hunting cartridges:
6.5x53R Mannlicher: Saw much use both in the Scottish Highlands and in Africa. The first small bore widely used for hunting.
The developed famous 6.5x54 Mannlicher – Schoenauer was used worldwide by famous big game hunters. It can be loaded to equal the Creedmare.






Ja!

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: kuduae]
      #373932 - 07/02/23 01:41 PM

Quote:


But far from complete imho. Some other important 6.5mm hunting cartridges:
6.5x53R Mannlicher: Saw much use both in the Scottish Highlands and in Africa. The first small bore widely used for hunting.
The developed famous 6.5x54 Mannlicher – Schoenauer was used worldwide by famous big game hunters. It can be loaded to equal the Creedmare.
The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x57R are very popular in central Europe. Only recently replaced in part by the 6.4x55 SE.
The 6.5x68 does the same as all the 6.5mm “Magnum” cartridges mentioned though it predates them by decades.



But old cartridges don't sell new plastic fantastic rifles to guys needing the latest fad!

Interesting point on the 6.5x54 MS being able to match the unmentionable.

All the x53, x54, x55, x57, x64, x65, /06, x68, magnums can equal or exceed that newest fad must have ...

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DarylS
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: NitroX]
      #373952 - 08/02/23 05:08 AM

My buddy Keith ran into a problem with a factory made 6.5x68, in that it had a 12" rate of twist, so was unsuitable for even a 120gr. bullet. It shot fine with an 87gr. or 100gr. HP, though no actual hunting bullets (around here).
He re-barreled to a 9" rate of twist barrel. Seems to me, I re-chambered it for him with his reamer, but that might have been a later, newer barrel yet.
Keith actually loves this round - 129gr. @ 3,200fps. Spotted him shooting an elk with that round - worked just fine.
The 120gr. X bullet (3,350fps) took a cow moose at just over 300yards, hit right beside the white spot, and stopped against her chest hide. Full length. At the impact, she braced her front feet spread apart and refused to take a step - then collapsed.
Good round. 6.5's shine. I have 3, two 6.5x55's and a .260 Rem.

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #373969 - 08/02/23 02:34 PM

I believe the 6.5x68 suffered from having factory barrels with a two slow twist rate. Maybe that 1 in 12 was normal? It was promoted with RWS ammunition of a 93 gr SP at 4,000 fps. For chamois. Also 127 gr KS ammunition.

I think the natural bullet weight range for the 6.5s for medium game lies between 120 grs and 140 grs. With 160 grs being a heavier beast bullet though it was a traditional round. I'd give 90 to 100 grs a go in my 6.5x65 RWS and if I had a x68 for speed. If suitable bullets were available I'd hunt lighter medium game with them. A 120 to 127 gr bullet is more sensible.

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swm
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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: NitroX]
      #374198 - 17/02/23 02:59 PM

I can attest that my 6.5-06 will send a 140 grain Nosler Partition at 3050 fps second and will give complete penetration on a broadside eight point whitetail buck at 30 yards! lol

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: swm]
      #376659 - 12/05/23 12:09 PM

6.5-06 sounds like a great round as is the 264 Win Mag.

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Re: 10 Great 6.5mm Hunting Cartridges That Are Not the Creedmoor [Re: DarylS]
      #376661 - 12/05/23 03:18 PM

Quote:

The 6.5/06 pretty much duplicates the ballistics I noted for the 6.5 Rem Mag., perhaps another 100fps in some bullet weights, like the 140gr.
I think the reason for that is due to the short magazine in most rifles chambered for the 6.5 Rem Mag. & the longer allowed bullet seating in the 6.5/06 with normal 3,340" allowance.
The 6.5 Rem Mag usually has short mags which means long bullets have to be seated more deeply, robbing powder space - with 140's etc.
If loaded to the same working pressure level, the long case 6.5's should be virtually identical to the shorter, fatter 6.5 Rem. Mag.
The working pressure for the 6.5/06 ASquare is 65,000PSI - pezio.
I do not have a listing for the 6.5x65RWS.
The 6.5x57, a German ctg., I think, has a working pressure same as the other 57mm ctgs. at 57,000PSI Pezio.
The 6.5Rem Mag is 63,000PSI, 53,000CUP.

It's strange, whereas the .270 Winchester has a working pressure of 65,000psi, the .30/06 limit is 60,000psi, using exactly the same case. Of course part of that perhaps is the older Springfield rifles in .06, but many higher pressure custom rifles are made up on the Springfield action.



I don't understand these pressure limits on individual cartridges? I understand them for designing a cartridge and maybe proofs. But for practice use, if the same strength action is used, a similar case, eg .270 and .30-06, surely the same pressure is acceptable?

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