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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> 'Classic' Firearms Photos & Archive

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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1376
Loc: QLd, Australia
Re: french connection [Re: lancaster]
      #259043 - 15/01/15 06:49 AM

Quote:

this was the first rifle I have seen



an american soldier bought this in Vietnam from an old french master. looks like there is no serial number




The owner of this rifle removed the serial number in the photo. For some reason people are scared to show serial numbers, but the actual rifle still has its number intact. I will set out a quest to acquire it (the number) for your list.

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lancaster
.416 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: french connection [Re: Ash]
      #259590 - 29/01/15 01:14 AM

10,75x68, SN 491 in auction
http://www.naturabuy.fr/rare-carabine-Mas-10-75-68-item-2401372.html















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Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by lancaster (29/01/15 01:14 AM)


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Old_Glass
.300 member


Reged: 17/03/10
Posts: 113
Loc: BC, Canada
Re: french connection [Re: lancaster]
      #261019 - 23/02/15 04:54 PM

I still kick myself for choosing a Swedish M96 in a trade when I could have had a like-new MAS36. They are reputed to be one of the most accurate military bolt actions due to the horizontally locking lugs. Whether the rear locking lugs play any part in that I don't know.

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lancaster
.416 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: french connection [Re: Old_Glass]
      #261937 - 09/03/15 05:33 AM

a 7x54 by Jean Fournier SN: JF 053









http://www.naturabuy.fr/Vente-carabine-Fournier-7x54-item-2471230.html

again a rifle probably bought by Fournier in parts out of the MAS factory stock. the receiver without SN and caliber designation, the 7x57 Mauser barrel rechambered to 7x54 Fournier and the hole rifle not painted black but only phosphated.


a remarkable detail is the use of the 7x54 Sako (or Lapua ?) in the 7x54 rifles. the 7x54 was a cartridge no rifle exist when it came into production, its a 6,5x55 necked up to 7mm and the base diameter is +/- 0,2mm under the base diameter of the 7x54 Fournier/7,5x54 but it seems nobody care about it.






--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Igorrock
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Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: french connection [Re: lancaster]
      #261973 - 09/03/15 07:10 PM

7x54 was quite popular wild cat caliber in Finland after WWII. You mostly could see it in rebored (original caliber 6,5 Japanese)and civilized Arisaka military rifles. Ordinary twist of barrel is quite low, just good for light 5,1g bullets which are same whose SAKO made for their own caliber 7x33. There is too 7x53R which has necked down 7,62x53R case.

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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
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Re: french connection [Re: Igorrock]
      #261990 - 10/03/15 03:18 AM

loading light bullets on full power rifle cartridges was a finnish speciality in the post war decades. I think your compatriots have use such bullets also on bigger game than fox or wild geese, why not on roe deer also.
my older kemira reloading list is the only one having 308 Winchester loads with the 4,8 gramm bullet for the 7,65 Browning pistol cartridge. the only RWS load I can compare with this was the 6 gramm bullet in the 6,5x57, a cartridge used on anything in the alps.

this here is such a 10 rounds collector ammo box we were talking about lately Igorrock. its for sale but with 50 euro not realy the bargain of week.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Igorrock
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Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: french connection [Re: lancaster]
      #261997 - 10/03/15 06:30 AM

Quote:

loading light bullets on full power rifle cartridges was a finnish speciality in the post war decades.


For good reasons; 5,1g round nose fmj bullet was/is very good killer for such big birds as blackgrouse and capercaillie. I have shot some birds with my 7x53R and noticed that this bullet is very accurate and flat shooter to 100-150 meter distances. Nowadays, when we in due course have some roe deers in Finland, is same bullet with bly nose very usefull. My friend has single shot Arisaka in 7x54 and said itīs very nice caliber for roe deer.

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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 16694
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: french connection [Re: Igorrock]
      #262013 - 10/03/15 12:16 PM

Maybe it's just me, but I find these guns Sooooooo - ugly and clumsy looking.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1376
Loc: QLd, Australia
Re: french connection [Re: Daryl_S]
      #262017 - 10/03/15 02:00 PM

They're very slim, Daryl

Am looking foward to getting mine (10.75x68) and taking it for buffalo. Just waiting on updates from Larcher at the moment.

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lancaster
.416 member


Reged: 06/05/08
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Re: french connection [Re: Daryl_S]
      #262021 - 10/03/15 03:44 PM

Quote:

Maybe it's just me, but I find these guns Sooooooo - ugly and clumsy looking.




looking strange but believe me the handling is exellent

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
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Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263057 - 03/04/15 02:38 AM

got the new-old Mas today back from my gunmaker, its officially now reborn as a 10,75x68.














sometimes life is stranger than fiction



--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Igorrock
.400 member


Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263059 - 03/04/15 03:05 AM

Looks very good. Are you going to use any scope with it ?

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/


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lancaster
.416 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Igorrock]
      #263063 - 03/04/15 04:37 AM

no scope at all, its a fun rifle
remember the day when you send me the link to this rifle igorrock who would have thought that it will end this way?
polishing and blueing starts now but I will make it so you see it have some history and is a honourable working gun.

the guy in the proof house in suhl had grumble a little bit because the chamber dimension were on the upper end of allowable tolerance BUT it is still within and so pass the proof with flying colours.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by lancaster (03/04/15 04:41 AM)


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Igorrock
.400 member


Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263064 - 03/04/15 06:12 AM

Quote:

remember the day when you send me the link to this rifle igorrock who would have thought that it will end this way?


Still at yours service....
Quote:

the guy in the proof house in suhl had grumble a little bit because the chamber dimension were on the upper end of allowable tolerance BUT it is still within and so pass the proof with flying colours.


So you could say yours barrel is just chamfered to SAAMI specs...

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/


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Ash
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Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1376
Loc: QLd, Australia
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263130 - 04/04/15 09:19 PM

I like your floor, Lancaster.

The rifle's come up great! How'd he end up redoing the caliber stampings?
Fired it yet? Bet you're excited

--------------------
.


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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
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Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Ash]
      #263131 - 04/04/15 11:09 PM

"I like your floor, Lancaster."

thanks, its the marble the 3 silesian wars were fight for
quarry for the kings palace but now in my kitchen
no, I did not steal it

did not shoot the rifle, got it thursday, bluing the small parts on friday, the barreled action will be send for blueing after the easter days. I simply dont have a suitable pot to make the blueing of such large parts here.

have some cartridges for a first test but need a die set. need a 6,5x53R and a 8x58RD die set too so its time ch4d get an order.

my tool maker tig welded over the old caliber engraving and I sand and polished the receiver than. the new caliber engraving was done with a common engraving machine.

as we say here " the blind man dont see it and the stupid dont know it"


first impression







with my 10,75x57


the mauser for a much smaller cartridge weighs 3500 gramm, the Mas 3400 gramm


--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by lancaster (05/04/15 12:37 AM)


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Igorrock
.400 member


Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263142 - 05/04/15 04:14 AM

Quote:

the mauser for a much smaller cartridge weighs 3500 gramm, the Mas 3400 gramm




Some bars of lead to right places will make it much more comfortable to shoot. The heavier weight isnīt any problem if balance is right.

--------------------
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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 16694
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Igorrock]
      #263150 - 05/04/15 06:25 AM

They do indeed look, ----- Slim.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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Carpetsahib
.333 member


Reged: 29/04/07
Posts: 348
Loc: Western NC
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: lancaster]
      #263155 - 05/04/15 07:32 AM

What do you think about the placement and shape of the pistol grip? Would it fit better if the grip radius was shorter, in order to place your finger closer to the trigger?

I like what you are doing to that rifle. I am also trying to talk myself out of acquiring one for my personal collection.


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lancaster
.416 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #263167 - 05/04/15 08:29 PM

my hands are comparative small but I dont have any problems with the size of the stock. it fits and is ergonomic without being so awful ugly like modern stuff.

I am happy about anyone looking for more and especially for forgotten stuff to bring it back into the minds of the vintage gun collecting community. my special interest is the 10,75x68 Mauser cartridge and anything about it. knowing this cartridge is not much liked anymore but I dont care.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1376
Loc: QLd, Australia
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #263168 - 05/04/15 09:21 PM

Quote:

I am also trying to talk myself out of acquiring one for my personal collection.




You're in the wrong thread for that, dear Sir!

--------------------
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Carpetsahib
.333 member


Reged: 29/04/07
Posts: 348
Loc: Western NC
Re: rifle in the house, still in the white [Re: Ash]
      #263193 - 06/04/15 11:45 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I am also trying to talk myself out of acquiring one for my personal collection.




You're in the wrong thread for that, dear Sir!


I know, I really should be in some sort of treatment program. Maybe Xausa can provide some therapy...

Or perhaps, we could change the subject and talk about sporterizing Swiss K31s, or maybe Dutch Beaumonts.


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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 4559
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
10,75x68 finished [Re: Carpetsahib]
      #263980 - 22/04/15 04:57 AM

so its done






my teutonic cartridge trio

10,75x68, 9,3x64 and 11,2x60


it feels allways good when a long work comes to its end! ch4d told me the die sets are on the way.

what have we find out?
the Mas 36 as a hunting rifle was made probably between 1946/47 and 1951 as a low budget rifle for the hunter who had lost his rifle in the times of WW2 and was needing an inexpensive replacement.
the rifle was made in 7x57 Mauser, 8x60S and 10,75x68 but there was a problem with the 7x57.
the good old mauser cartridge was actually banned for being a military round but this only in france and not in the colonys and for a short time it was not banned in france also. probably in 1951 Mas stop to made the rifle maybe because the war in indochine became to hot and they need the workforce only for this.
it seems Mas had a large stock of parts and semi manufactured rifles. the 7x57 Mauser rifles were rechambered by the french gunmaker Fournier for his 7x54 Fournier wildcat, a 7,5x54 based cartridge which cut the old 7mm Mauser chamber. it seems Fournier also build new rifles by using old Mas parts. some of his rifles have still Mas serial number but other were made by using an unnumbered receiver and get a new serial number.
another possiblity was to rechamber the rifle after the 7x57 was again outlawed for the 284 Winchester, a cartridge with bigger measurments then 7mm Mauser again. this was done by the french gunmaker Sterna but cant be older than 1963 when the cartridge came on the market. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.284_Winchester

till now I have find
8 rifles in 7x54, ex 7x57
4 rifles in 284 WIN, ex 7x57
4 rifles in 8x60S
2 rifles, another cartridge

9 rifles in 10,75x68

of course the 10,75 is the rifle that interest me the most

original 7x57 Mauser rifles are very rare today and I have only heard of one.


this post will go on so long I see a new example, thank you for your attention

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Igorrock
.400 member


Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: Finland
Re: 10,75x68 finished [Re: lancaster]
      #263995 - 22/04/15 04:24 PM

OK, project done! So next what you need is a bigger gun safe and some more projets....

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/


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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1376
Loc: QLd, Australia
Re: 10,75x68 finished [Re: Igorrock]
      #264001 - 22/04/15 05:43 PM

That 11.2x60 looks a bit shunned now, perhaps it would like to move to Australia?


Congrats on getting it finished, Lancaster! Looks great! Let me know how it shoots

--------------------
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