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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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9.3x57
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.416 Taylor: Who's got One???
      #81660 - 02/07/07 02:54 PM

Who has one?

Who built it?

What does it weigh?

What was it built on {caliber of original rifle action}?

Any feed problems?

Actual chronographed velocities?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #81680 - 02/07/07 09:20 PM

My hand is in the air.....!

It's a basic custom job built for me by Vic Pedersen in Darwin. Vic did the metal, I did the wood. It was built on a 1942 CZ M-98 using a Walther barrel, finished-up at 24 inches. Express sights. Ten pounds even.

The .416 Taylor is the most practical, sensible, trouble-free and capable medium-bore bolt-rifle chambering, period!
Well, I think so anyway...!

My favourite buffalo load is 70gr AR2208 (Varget) beneath a 410gr Woodleigh for around 2250 fps. Achieving 2400 fps is a snap if you want to, but traditional British ballistics are well-proven IMO.

The load I use for plinking or non-DG is the same charge under a 400gr Taipan for 2280 fps. The Taipan is soft lead with a very thin jacket and these bullets are literally hand grenades on pigs and donks etc.

I carry it on work trips where a double would be inappropriate, but these days it sees quite a bit of use as a buffalo-capable loaner for friends and visitors.

There have been a few threads on the Taylor before, a search will probably turn up some more info.

Here's mine:


Here's a nice bull it killed with a single shot to the shoulder last dry season:


...and the results of a session of big-bore varminting in the VRD with Taipan bullets!


--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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9.3x57
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: Marrakai]
      #81686 - 02/07/07 11:37 PM

There you go again...

A friend swears by this cartridge, saying it combines the killing power of the .458 with an ease of shooting unlike the larger bore. It makes no sense to say so, but to my eye, the .416 T just LOOKS efficient and balanced.

Ballistics look much like the .425 WR which I guess is a compliment.

Same friend builds big bore rifles and he says getting a .416 Taylor to feed is generally easier than some of the others also which is a big deal.

What work was necessary on your CZ action? I assume it was an 8x57 to start with?

What cases do you use to make up your ammo?

Great pic's, as always. Those of us who don't have your opportunities for hunting buff and larger varmints, etc can still enjoy your experiences vicariously!

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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JLS
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #81716 - 03/07/07 03:33 AM

...I've got two. Both built on pre-64 M-70 short mag actions. One has a Douglas barrel, the other a Kreiger barrel. Barrel length 25" Best accuracy load: 72.2gr IMR 4320=2385fps (Across the screens @15' from muzzle, and corrected to same.)400gr bullets, only.

No feed problems with either rifle. Weight 9.5# with 1.5x5 Leupold scope. The Douglas is 1/4# heavier than the Kreiger due to barrel contour.

First rifle built by Frank Wells, Tucson, Az. in 1988
Second rifle built by Gene Simillion, Gunnison, Co. 1994

Great caliber for big game, either North American, or African.

JLS

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Marrakai
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: JLS]
      #81774 - 04/07/07 12:27 AM

Mmmm, two pre-64 M-70s, just plain greedy!

9ThreeXFifty7:
I neck-up .338 cases, rather than neck down .458s. Thin necks last longer between annealing than thick necks in my experience. My Peter Davern Custom dies have a long tapered neck-expander which pops them up in one pass, I've never lost a single case during forming. After necking-up, they are ready to shoot, no fire-forming loads necessary.

Modifying a military Mauser is pretty easy, just open-up the bolt-face and grind a bit out under the feed-rails, polish, and you're done. I think Vic might have modified the follower slightly for the fatter case, too. ...and bevel the follower to close the bolt on an empty mag, which goes without saying.

Another pic for you, 9ThreeXFifty7. My eldest daughter with her last Taylor buff, another one shot kill:


--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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BFaucett
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #81783 - 04/07/07 04:52 AM

9ThreeXFifty7,

An article that you may enjoy (if you haven't already seen it):



The .416 Taylor Revisited
So maybe there is room for just one more big .416
from Guns & Ammo, October 2006
by Craig Boddington
http://www.gunsandammomag.com/gun_columns/notes/0610/

Cheers!
-Bob F.

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: BFaucett]
      #81789 - 04/07/07 06:53 AM

Quote:

9ThreeXFifty7,

An article that you may enjoy (if you haven't already seen it):

The .416 Taylor Revisited
So maybe there is room for just one more big .416
from Guns & Ammo, October 2006
by Craig Boddington
http://www.gunsandammomag.com/gun_columns/notes/0610/

Cheers!
-Bob F.



Thanks gents!!

BFaucett: Are you by any chance a Librarian?? THANKS!!

Marrakai, it is becoming all too obvious to me that you have entirely too many of those buff hanging around. Overgrazing and damage to the sensitive ecology is obviously about to occur.

I think you need my help to thin them out a bit...

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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BFaucett
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #81801 - 04/07/07 08:20 AM

Quote:

9ThreeXFifty7,

BFaucett: Are you by any chance a Librarian?? THANKS!!


I'm not a Librarian, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn last night!

-Bob F.

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szihn
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: BFaucett]
      #82099 - 09/07/07 02:17 PM

I do, and I have made several in the past.
The 416 Taylor is my favorite 416 of all. I can make a nicer rifle of higher value in the Taylor than any other 416, for a given price. I can use a Standard length Mauser instead of a longer and more expensive action. Brass is cheaper. Performance on game is the same as far as I can tell. I know.......some others are faster, but I have never seen the extra speed make any difference at all on any animal.
If I need more power, I would go right to a 505 Gibbs and forget the rest.
(just my openion. Yours may be different)
I love 416 Taylor. I have owned 458s and 460s in the past, but I have given them all up for my 416 Taylor, my 404 Jeffery and my 375 H&H.

Truth be told, I use my 270 Winchester more than any of them.

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ALAN_MCKENZIE
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #82109 - 09/07/07 09:27 PM

I've got one built on a Parker Hale action,24inch barrel,same loads as Marrakai.
Mine was originally a model 1200 in 243.
Doug Barnes fitted a Sprinter barrel,open sights and barrel band.
It weighs about 8 pounds which makes it a good carry rifle
for long strolls around flood plains.

I also own a 375 CT built on a Husky action.

--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

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jimatcat
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Reged: 04/04/06
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Loc: victoria texas, usa... 125 mil...
Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: ALAN_MCKENZIE]
      #82841 - 22/07/07 11:33 AM

i'm looking forward to mine... tip burns is build mine on an eddystone enfield... shilen #5 countour bbl, necg front and rear sights, timney trigger... parkerized finish... with a boyd pepper laminate stock...

--------------------
go big or go home

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allenday
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #82948 - 24/07/07 12:09 AM

I have a 416 Rem. Mag., and I really can't see any logical reason whatsoever to go with the 416 Taylor. Logistically, the Taylor just doesn't make sense........

AD

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3706
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: allenday]
      #82950 - 24/07/07 12:21 AM

allen:
Most of us already had a decade or two of Taylor-acquired buffalo steaks in our freezers before Remington finally woke up to themselves and 'invented' their version!

Now, let's see.... Which would I prefer? A custom rifle on a Mauser 98, or a Remington... Hmmm. Only takes a milli-second to make that decision!!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: allenday]
      #83013 - 25/07/07 01:50 AM

Quote:

I have a 416 Rem. Mag., and I really can't see any logical reason whatsoever to go with the 416 Taylor. Logistically, the Taylor just doesn't make sense........

AD



Another way to look at it is to question the logic of the long Remington .416.

A round that can be chambered in standard-length actions AND produce .416 Rigby performance appears to me to be far more desireable {and logical} than a round that requires long actions or modified standard-length actions to do the exact same thing {or even a little better}.

Having said that, Remington had the long action to work with and as in the case of the 8mm Remington, chose to use a case that made use of the whole thing. Naturally they don't care about the custom market.

I once owned a Remington 700 and while I'll admit it is a very strong action, I did not like it one bit. The brazed-on bolt handle, tiny dirt-magnet extractor, stamped and fabricated trigger assembly just did not appeal to me at all. The 700's are accurate guns in-general and have served our military for years so accusations that they are flimsy have over the years been pretty well debunked. I guess it is a personal preference issue for me in that there is just something about a Remington 700 that reeks of manufacturing methods and materials more desireable in the production of toaster ovens and dishwashers than shootin' irons.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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Ripp
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #83038 - 25/07/07 10:58 AM

Quote:

Quote:

I have a 416 Rem. Mag., and I really can't see any logical reason whatsoever to go with the 416 Taylor. Logistically, the Taylor just doesn't make sense........

AD




I guess it is a personal preference issue for me in that there is just something about a Remington 700 that reeks of manufacturing methods and materials more desireable in the production of toaster ovens and dishwashers than shootin' irons.




Those who don't/won't understand often criticize

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: Ripp]
      #83042 - 25/07/07 12:42 PM

Quote:

Those who don't/won't understand often criticize

Ripp



Oops!

Feelings hurt.

Sorry 'bout that.

I don't like Remingtons. Some do. Like I said, they have their plusses. I like Mausers and some don't. I've heard them called obsolete, less safe, clubby, wobbly-bolted, less accurate, have long firing pin travel, are crude, etc. Some of that I can't argue with. I still like them. As stated, I guess it boils down to personal preference.

I guess I understand both sides of it.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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fivebigbores
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Reged: 20/07/07
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: Ripp]
      #83043 - 25/07/07 12:49 PM

I have two- one right hand custom mauser by the gun doctor the other a converted ruger m 77 II in left hand we have here in the shooting school a 577 double 510 wells express 500 ne double 470 double 460 wby 458 lott 458 wm 416 wby 416 rem [the taylors] 378 wby 375 40^ imp 375 H&H 375 flange double BY FAR I FAVOR THOSE TAYLORS BIGBORE PREFORMANCE SMALL BORE RECOIL

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Ripp
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #83055 - 25/07/07 11:10 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Those who don't/won't understand often criticize

Ripp



Oops!

Feelings hurt.

Sorry 'bout that.

I don't like Remingtons. Some do. Like I said, they have their plusses. I like Mausers and some don't. I've heard them called obsolete, less safe, clubby, wobbly-bolted, less accurate, have long firing pin travel, are crude, etc. Some of that I can't argue with. I still like them. As stated, I guess it boils down to personal preference.

I guess I understand both sides of it.




No feelings hurt--merely stated what I felt--

I have no problems with mauser actions--as I also have no problem with Remingtons--have had both and the Remingtons have ALWAYS been the most accurate and that is what I am after--Remington was smart enough to provide a weapon that the average Joe could afford that provided more than the competition could or would provide. Fortunately they did not go the way of Ruger and put $18. barrels on their rifles for a higher profit margin or the absolutly deplorable work done by Winchester in the last years--unfortunately the Remingtons of the last few years have started the downward spiral as well--IMHO... Kenny Jarret along with many, many custom gun makers use the Remington action for their customs guns because of the inherit accuracy of the Remington action however as I understand it, sadly Jarret is no longer using them as he feels Remington's machinery is worn out and the actions are no longer what the once were..

I personally have had a half dozen custom rifles built on 1970's and 1980's actions--without exception they will all have 1/2 or less groups at 100 yards if I do my part--

All the actions have their place, and depending on what you feel comfortable with that is what you should use--personally I'll take a Remington over a Ruger or Winchester any day of the week--by hey, that's just me...
Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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9.3x57
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: Ripp]
      #83059 - 25/07/07 11:37 PM

Quote:

No feelings hurt--merely stated what I felt--

Fortunately they did not go the way of Ruger and put $18. barrels on their rifles for a higher profit margin

personally I'll take a Remington over a Ruger or Winchester any day of the week--by hey, that's just me...
Ripp



Oh my, now my little feelings are hurt!! Whaaa! Whaa!

Rugers have problems????

Oh, no!

Can it be??

I have several we use around here for killing deer and elk. Years ago I heard they were junk by so many folks my cantankerousness got the best of me and I started buying them and now they are real favorites of mine. They also are one of the more popular makes we see here but discount that because we are rubes and have no idea what a good rifle is, just one that goes bang once in a while and forces our wives to make new room in the freezer!

Here's my secret: I use the "Rule of Three" when buying a Ruger...I send it back to Ruger 3x's and I have a great rifle!

Here's another secret...: I UNLOAD and degrease a new Ruger action and work the bolt and safety several hundred times {uncounted, but the number you can cycle it quickly during a rerun episode of the Rockford Files...} and then when it gets a blast of G96, TriFlow or WD40 it feels like a Krag. {I'm lying...more like a Mannlicher-Schönauer}.

I honestly do like the MKII actions and they can be bought cheap, too, which brings me back to the topic... In rebarreling a Ruger from 7mm Remington or .300 Win to the obviously worthless, redundant and embarassing .416 Taylor, has anybody found any major hurdles regarding feeding reliability?

I am getting more and more interested in a illogical .416 Taylor and I would like to know any experiences along these lines. I've never seen a bullet bounce off a big game animal but I think that .416 C-T would be the best place to start to see this curious phenomenon.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #83060 - 25/07/07 11:50 PM

Quote:

Quote:

No feelings hurt--merely stated what I felt--

I am getting more and more interested in a illogical .416 Taylor and I would like to know any experiences along these lines. I've never seen a bullet bounce off a big game animal but I think that .416 C-T would be the best place to start to see this curious phenomenon.




SO sorry I offended you..

Not sure if you are being serious or not about the .416 Taylor--but I have done some research on it as well as I really like the .416 Remington cartridge and have used it for quite some time with great results..ironically enough, I recorded "Tracks Across Africa" and watched it last evening when I got home from work--there was Boddington using a Ruger with a custom barrel in .416 Taylor hunting buffalo in Mozambique--seemed to work really well--Boddington stated he has used this cartridge for quite some time --stating he necks down .458 cases--

No matter what form of .416 you choose, I don't think you will be disappointed--its a great round--good luck--

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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9.3x57
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: Ripp]
      #83066 - 26/07/07 02:29 AM

Don't worry, Ripp.

Maybe someday I'll get over it...

...OK, I'm over it!

I wanna know all I can about building a .416 T on a Ruger .300 or 7mm Mag...

Any takers?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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DoubleD
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #83067 - 26/07/07 02:43 AM

Quote:



In rebarreling a Ruger from 7mm Remington or .300 Win to the obviously worthless, redundant and embarassing .416 Taylor, has anybody found any major hurdles regarding feeding reliability?




Okay I get redundant, but why or how is it worthless or embarassing? I don't get that part.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

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9.3x57
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: DoubleD]
      #83077 - 26/07/07 06:41 AM

Quote:

Quote:



In rebarreling a Ruger from 7mm Remington or .300 Win to the obviously worthless, redundant and embarassing .416 Taylor, has anybody found any major hurdles regarding feeding reliability?




Okay I get redundant, but why or how is it worthless or embarassing? I don't get that part.



It's not.

I think it is a great cartridge in all ways. The above was merely my lame attempt at humor, to toy with those who might be inclined to turn the post into a "Why the .416 Taylor is worse than the Uniform Tax Code" or some such tangent...

As for me, I think it is a great round and if Marrakai ever wanted to part with his {obviously in order to step up to a real cartridge like the .416 Remington } I hope I would be at the head of the queue with enough dough to make him happy!

Oops, dang it, there I go again. It appears I am my post's worst enemy.

Sorry again!

I guess I'm just chockfull of sorries lately.

Dragging this thing kicking and screaming back to the question, anybody ever built one on a Ruger? That is, what "heads ups" are in order?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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szihn
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Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #83081 - 26/07/07 07:42 AM

Anyone wanna buy one?
I am thinking about selling mine. Just don't use it enough, even though I love the rifle.
I will just keep my 375 and my 404.

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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: .416 Taylor: Who's got One??? [Re: szihn]
      #83094 - 26/07/07 12:36 PM

FYI---

I sent you a private message--thx

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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