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Lee440
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Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Texas
R.B. Rodda - Shotguns?
      #51786 - 08/03/06 01:37 PM

I recently purchased a Rodda boxlock 450/400 3" and have been trying to research it. I have picked up some info on this site and a few others and realize Rodda was a retailer, kind of like Army&Navy, and all their guns were subbed out, mostly to the Birmingham Trade. One source alluded to the fact that Rodda did only rifles and not shotguns, Is this true? It would seem hard to believe that anyone who retailed guns for as many years as them, would not have sold shotguns. I frequent many of the sites of sellers of used English shotguns and cannot remember ever seeing a Rodda shotgun. I would like to purchase one to pair with my rifle. Can anyone shed any light on this subject? Also, does anyone know any books or other sources of info about Rodda? Also, how would I identify who made my rifle? By what the proof book says, I believe that it was made between 1904-25. It has a Greener-style crossbolt, 24" barrels with Birmingham proofs and are also marked on the underside with J.A in a circle and H.R out to the side. Were these the men who struck or fitted the barrels? This is a good solid working gun with border engraving, it shoots 400 gr. Woodleighs with R-15 well. I am curious as how to identify the maker and any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Lee.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51791 - 08/03/06 02:26 PM


Post a photo of the action sides, bottom and top
+ a profile of the whole gun.

We can often tell who made it by looking at these
types of pictures - or at least narrow it down.

500 Nitro

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Lee440
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Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Texas
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #51797 - 08/03/06 02:55 PM

500 Nitro, Have you ever seen any Rodda-marked shotguns in OZ? I know lots of Indian guns ended up there, I feel sure this rifle probably originally was sold in India. Thanks for the help! I just remembered that the identical twin to my Rodda is another Rodda 450/400 that is on Westley Richards(www.westleyrichards.com) site. It is identical down to the border engraved pattern. The only difference that I can see in the pictures is that mine does not have an initial shield in the buttstock. Thanks! Lee.

Edited by Lee440 (08/03/06 04:04 PM)

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51831 - 09/03/06 07:43 AM

The Rodda company still exists on paper in Calcutta - they have a license to retail firearms but don't. Yes, they were retailers who sold a lot of guns from different sources including W&C Scott, Winchester etc. There is a dating service for British guns here and you could post and ask them to help find records of your guns. Check out their historical records as well.

Please do post pictures here - they are always greatly appreciated by everyone.

Thanks and good hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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500Nitro
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Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51833 - 09/03/06 08:07 AM

Lee440

No, I can't remeber seeing a Rodda shotgun in OZ - or anywhere for that matter
but I am sure they exist somewhere.

I have owned / do own a couple of Rodda DR's, one a 450/400 with more
engraving than your by your description.

Some really high grade Rodda's were made but also some guns had the
makers name on the side - ie Westley Richards - but Rodda's name on the
barrels as well indicating an order placed through Rodda in India.

500 Nitro

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Raff
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Reged: 12/01/04
Posts: 182
Loc: Texas
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51834 - 09/03/06 08:08 AM

Lee;
Sounds like you found a keeper. Rodda's are nice
rifles. I have owned, at times, 4 of them. Still have one.
Here is some info. to get started on;
www.internetgunclub.com has a good bit of info. on Rodda.
You will have to register, if you aren't already, to get
the info.
An ebay seller; cornell military pubs has a reprint
of a 1929-30 Rodda catalog for $15.00 or so. I have seen
a copy and there is not much new info.
Lewis Drake has a Rodda catalog reprint for sale for
$17 that is from the early 1900's. I have not seen this
one, but a copy is on the way so whenever it shows up I'll
let you know if there is anything new in it. You might also
do a search on gunshop.com forums. a couple of years ago
there was a long thread on Rodda, the surviving family
and some good info. on who made some of their rifles.
As far as shotguns go, I have never seen a double
breechloader, just a SxS 14 bore muzzleloader from about
1855 or so.
Good Luck
Raff

--------------------
.

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bobc
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Reged: 18/05/05
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Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Raff]
      #51839 - 09/03/06 08:45 AM

Yep, try ebay. I got a Rigby catlog from them when I was lookig at a Rigby pre-Hollis. I found this link. Bob
http://cgi.ebay.com/R-B-Rodda-Co-Calcutta-India-Gun-Catalogue-1929-30_W0QQitemZ7222040948QQcategoryZ7309QQcmdZViewItem

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51875 - 09/03/06 03:02 PM

Lee 440,

If it is Rodda catalogues you are looking for, the owner of the site I told you about is descended from the last British Rodda owners. He has several catalogues and could e-mail them to you if you wanted them. Just contact him.

Cheers!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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Lee440
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Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Texas
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #51878 - 09/03/06 03:25 PM

Thanks for the replies! Did anyone go to the Westley Richards site and see those pictures? I am in the process of evaluating digital cameras, but do not have one yet. The Rodda on W.R. is a duplicate of mine and the picture quality is probably better than I could do if I had a good camera!
Mehul, I will check out that site, I would love to get some catalog reprints. Thanks! Lee.

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3489
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #51990 - 10/03/06 12:19 PM

Lee440:
I had an idea that someone had answered this for you already, if so please disregard my post.

The JA in a circle indicates that Joseph Asbury made the barrel group. He was primarily a barrel-striker, but may have been an action-filer as well, my own library is unclear on this. Perhaps Asbury made the barrels and 'HR' built the action.

As an example, my Manton .470 was built by John Wilkes, however Josh Asbury struck the barrels. The gun retains a shadow of Wilkes' name in the case-colours on the flats (the original stamped name was struck-off prior to case-hardening, but the bruised metal coloured differently), and Asbury's 'JA' in a circle is present on the barrel-group.

Now to concentrate on 'HR'!

Fascinating stuff!



(edited to change Asprey ot Asbury, and delete references to Asprey double rifle thread)


--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Edited by Marrakai (10/03/06 04:33 PM)

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Lee440
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Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Texas
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Marrakai]
      #52000 - 10/03/06 01:32 PM

Marrakai, thanks for the info! Researching this gun is getting interesting. Could you go to the Westley Richards site, look at the 400 Rodda and give me your impressions as to who might have made the action? I really don't know enough to know if there are any distinctive features that may give a hint, but I appreciate your input! Thanks again, Lee.

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400NitroExpress
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Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
Loc: Lone Star State
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Marrakai]
      #52015 - 10/03/06 02:13 PM

Marrakai:

I think you've gotten a bit confused on this one. This rifle is a Rodda and was built in Birmingham, not London, between 1904 and 1925. I think you probably meant Joseph Asbury, a Birmingham barrel maker and barrel filer (formerly an action maker) who was active in this period and is known to have used "J.A" as his signature. He was in Lench Street during this period, while Rodda was in Whittall Street. He is almost certainly our man.

The rifles in the string mentioned are those of Asprey Plc, London. Asprey's is an old firm, started as a calico printer, that became known for accessories. In late years, they became famous as jewelers and flateware makers. They didn't enter the firearms business until 1983, and did not become gunamkers until 1989. There were no Aspreys previously listed in the Birmingham, or London, gun trades.
-----------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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Marrakai
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Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #52024 - 10/03/06 03:07 PM

Well spotted 400NE, I stand corrected. Joseph Asbury is indeed the man in question. Apologies for the confusion.

I'm away from my library at the moment, running on memory alone (!): always a risk!

For Lee440's sake, I'll edit my earlier post.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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400NitroExpress
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Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
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Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Marrakai]
      #52029 - 10/03/06 03:31 PM

Marrakai:

I know what you mean! It's bad enough not being able to find the reference when you need it. Being away from the library is a real challenge.
-----------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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Marrakai
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Posts: 3489
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #52038 - 10/03/06 04:48 PM

Lee:
I had a look at the gun on WR when you first posted the link, but it doesn't ring any loud bells with me. The cross-bolt kinda rules-out WR, Wilkes, Webley, and a stack of other makers, who tended to use their own distinctive rib-extensions, although with Brit double guns, the rules are "there are no rules"!

Its probably stating the obvious, but even WW Greener shouldn't be discounted, though I've always assumed they usually put their own name on their wares. That bolstering at the breech-end of the barrels is probably going to mean something to someone here. I take it your DR has them too, Lee?

Nice hardware BTW, the epitome of a good solid working double. Bravo!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Lee440
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Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Texas
Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Marrakai]
      #52110 - 11/03/06 10:35 AM

O.K., now I show my ignorance! What you are referring to as reinforcement on the breech end, I figured was normal. I have been told that this rifle has "shoe lumps" and I took it to mean that the lumps were part of that piece and was brazed onto the barrels. That reinforcement is like a saddle that the barrels are laid onto and brazed and of course, the bottom of this saddle has the lumps. None of my reference books show the differences although I know how to ID chopper lumps and mine does not have them! Curiouser and curiouser! Lee.

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400NitroExpress
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Re: R.B. Rodda - Shotguns? [Re: Lee440]
      #52123 - 11/03/06 12:55 PM

I agree with Marrakai. It doesn't look like the work of any of the makers he mentioned.

The flanges to the barrels are part of the shoe-lump construction and are brazed on. The presense of these doesn't automatically mean that the barrels are shoe-lump though. Some chopper-lump guns have them as well. On the chopper-lump guns, the flanges are integral and are just filed up that way from the blanks. On three otherwise identical A. Hollis & Son .450/.400 rifles, all with chopper-lump barrels, Rusty's, and I think Bobc's, have those. Mine, the latest of the three, doesn't. I have no idea why they did it that way on the chopper-lump guns.
-----------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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