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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Rifles

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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
.375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express
      #5120 - 23/11/03 11:13 AM

Anybody shooting and/or reloading this cartridge?

I picked up a Martini Henry in this caliber. I have my dies and brass, what should I load?


--------------------
DD, Ret.


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5206 - 27/11/03 11:19 AM

Hey DD,

I'll second this request.

John

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5218 - 27/11/03 07:08 PM


Guys,

The loads below are from my Double Rifle but are not high pressure. They were also my Starting loads - I ended up
loading a few grains more. I was using Woodleigh Bullets (being a double).

Fed 210 ADI 2208 45 270gr WB RN
Fed 210 ADI 2208 44 235gr WB PP

Good luck. Email me direct if any queries.

500 Nitro


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: 500Nitro]
      #5227 - 27/11/03 10:28 PM

Thank you Mr. 500 Nitro,

(anybody called 500 Nitro is a Sir or MR!)

Do you have any idea how those Australian powders relate to U.S. powders?



--------------------
DD, Ret.


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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5304 - 30/11/03 05:36 PM


DoubleD,

I'll work out what relates to what (Australia to US Powders) and repost in the next 24 hours.

And drop the Sir !!! I had enough of being called that in the military.

However I do agree that a 500+ Nitro Double does command a certain
amount of authority - they certainly look it when you see the 2 x 1/2 inch holes !!!

I'll try to post a photo.

500 Nitro


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: 500Nitro]
      #5307 - 01/12/03 03:07 AM

Well, "Sir" was a form of submission also, admitting my lower station , as I only shoot singles and Martini's at that, and try to never hunt game that hunts back...DD

--------------------
DD, Ret.

Edited by DoubleD (02/12/03 01:58 AM)


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39212
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5331 - 02/12/03 12:55 AM

http://www.adi-limited.com/handloaders-guide/equivalents.html

This link might help.


--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: NitroX]
      #5354 - 03/12/03 12:13 AM

Yes Sir, handy link indeed. I've saved it to my favorites.



--------------------
DD, Ret.


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5373 - 04/12/03 12:24 AM

I'm interested in the .375 2 1/2" in a Martini Henry. Is this the "standard" Martini Henry .577/.450 action rebarrelled to a .375 2 1/2"? Does it produce similar or acceptable pressures in that action?

Any one who knows. Thats.

Sounds like a very useful cartridge combined with a M-H.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: NitroX]
      #5407 - 05/12/03 03:16 AM

I recently bought a Martini Henry MK IV that had been converted to .375 2 1/2 Flanged NE. I have only fired three rounds through it so far to center the sights at 50 yards in anticipation of hunting deer. The rifle was very pleasant to shoot and seemed reasonably accurate as well.

The rifle was constructed for the gentleman from whom I purchased it for shooting High power rifle competition. This sport is dominated by U.S. military service rifles.



Instead of the standard 33.06 inch bbl or 33.187 inch bbl of the MK IV this rifle this rifle has a 30 3/4 inch bbl. The forend was shortened the appropriate amount. A sight ramp was installed and a Lyman globe sight installed.



For a rear sight a series two BSA Martini Cadet sight has been installed. This is the one that has both windage and elevation in it. It is a great design!



The barrel that is installed is a Shilen barrel that the gunsmith contoured. Instead trying to copy the nocks form, the gunsmith turned a ring similar to that found on the Winchester M-70. Of course he then chambered it in 375 21/2 flanged Nitro Express.



Now when I went to buy the rifle I knew it was in military configuration. It was my intention to cut the rifle down into a sporting rifle, restock and reform the lever into a commercial style lever for a pistol grip stock and add a barrel to the end of the lever, like this Hollis rifle.



When I saw the rifle and shot it I changed my mind. This is a nicely built target rifle and I won't change it.



Instead what I intend to do is build a .375 2 1/2 Flanged Nitro Express on this rifle...It's a Westley Richards!



The Martini is a very strong action. Don’t get me wrong you should not run out get a 300 Rum put on one, even if you can get to fit. It will take most moderate pressure rimmed cartridges. This may be changing as a company here in the U.S. is getting tooled up to build Martini’s using modern steels.

The real limit to the various Martini actions is the length of cartridge than can be made to fit. The angle of the breech block limits the length of the cartridge, Short Fat bottle neck cartridges will fit where long skinny won’t.

Of course another limitation is the position of the trigger. That doesn’t limit the cartridges, just the shooters who want to put up with the awkward location. Pistol gripping helps just not much. You have to want one.

A Martini doesn’t have the grace of a nice double but they still are a symbol of a glorious bygone era and I would not be without one. When I went on my “once in a lifetime hunt’ to South Africa last year, I took two rifles and picked up a third over there. I took a bolt gun and a Martini and picked up another Martini over there.

I used my big Martini to take a Kudu…


…my little Martini to take a steenbok


I may never be able to go after dangerous game or own a double rifle, but if (when) I go back to Africa it will be with a Martini and it will be chambered in .375 2 ½ flange Nitro Express!!! For back up I will carry a Martini in Westley Richards No. 2 Musket!




--------------------
DD, Ret.


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39212
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5410 - 05/12/03 10:50 AM

DoubleD

Thanks for posting all those photographs and the informative post.

Looking between the lines, you have at least four Martini-Henry's ? I really like these Martini's myself but only have the one, a Rozier sporting rifle in the original .450 and must admit have not had the time to play with it yet. But they are nice and light and reasonably balanced.

I think the .375 2 1/2" sounds like a great cartridge to marry with one for a hunting rifle. May have to find myself a second one while there are some still around.

BTW Nice kudu.


--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: NitroX]
      #5412 - 05/12/03 11:45 AM

Yes I have at least 4 Martini's...more like 12, just don't tell the wife.

If you have pictures of your Sporting rifle, I sure would like to see them. Especially the forearm. The Hollis in the picture is missing a forearm and I am collecting sporting Martini pictures so I can reproduce a forearm.

Here is a close up of the little Martini



It is a .218 Mashburn Bee.

I do like the my Kudu, but the little Steenbuck was more challenging to hunt. It took almost a week to get him. My PH and I noticed that he liked to hang around with the cows and when the cows started moving away from people so would he, in high gear. But cows just moving like cows didn't bother him.

We spotted him way across a flat one morning in the wide open. We saw some cattle lined out, head across the flat following a cow trail that went right by the Steenbok. We just got in behind the cattle so they were between him and use and started following. When we got where we thought I would be in shooting range we stopped. The cattle kept going and when they passed the little steenbok, he was standing up watching the cattle about 60 yards away. I don't think he relaize we were there.


--------------------
DD, Ret.


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DPhillips
.375 member


Reged: 09/10/03
Posts: 819
Loc: Alaska
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5441 - 06/12/03 09:19 AM

Twin D,
That is a beautiful rifle (the Hollis). Can you give us anymore information about its manufacture (when it was made, how you came upon it, cost, are they still being made, etc...). Would that action size work for something like the 32-20 or 25-20?


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39212
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: DoubleD]
      #5452 - 06/12/03 02:33 PM

Here is a link to some photos of the Rozier Martini-Henry.

Martini-Henry sporting rifle

I will see if I can get some better photos of the forend for you.




--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2392
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: .375 Flanged 2 1/2 Nitro Express [Re: NitroX]
      #5462 - 07/12/03 01:46 AM

Nice rifle, well almost...the butt pad....The rest is nice, very nice. Old Greener style action. English style stocking, you have my email let me know when it's available.

I have two Hollis rifles.



The little one pictured in the previous post and a big one that I saved from a sentence of destruction in South Africa. Barrel wasn't registered so it was scheduled to be destroyed. I was able to rescue it by having the barrel threads cut off and the riflling drilled out. I intend to reline the bore and build a new barrel tenon and put the rifle back in action! It's a .450 Westley Richards No.2 Musket.

The little Martini is a .218 Mashburn Bee. The action body is engraved I.Hollis and sons. I believe it started out as some sort of rook rifle. Later probably after the 1940's somebody rebuilt it to a .218 Bee. I bought it from Jansa's a few years ago for a little over $400USD when the Australian dollar was about .52 to USD. Who ever rebuilt the rifle did an okay job. They just didn't restock it back in the English style of the original. They could have made a better forearm escutceon. The made a clever false nocks form, by milling a flat across the top of the barrel cylinder.

Both little Hollis and the big Hollis are Greener style Martini actions. All the parts are pinned to the action body .



The Francotte style Martini cadet is more common and has all the internal parts attached to the trigger group and drops out the bottom. Here is a picture of my Wife's .22K Hornet with the little Hollis and you can see the difference.

As you can see this is a working rifle!










--------------------
DD, Ret.


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