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DarylSModerator
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Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting
      #50411 - 21/02/06 03:32 AM

Lately, I've been doing some testing im my .45 FlintLock with my bro and his .60 Jaeger Flinter.
; I've settled on a 50:50 mix of Murphy's oil soap and (Sig) Castor Oil bought for mixing my own RC airplane fuel.
; It is mixed cold, then shaken and applied to patches. If left for a period of time, it might separate, but just shake the bottle and it's mixed again. This mix forms a creamy white viscous liquid, that once applied to patches, leaves them pliable in freezing weather. So far, the mix provides great accuracy and consistancy, with no wiping required between shots for an entire day's shooting.
: Bro has a 50:50 mix of Murphy Oil Soap and Neetsfoot OIL (not compound) that, for him, works just as well in the Jaeger.
: I have also found that LehighValley lube (TOW) shoots extremely well from my rifle, but it is said it needs a very slick barrel to work well. In mine, it is superb, but more expensive than the Castor Murph's mix. Other's say it lacks lubricity in their barrels. The thicker Murph's and Castor mix is slicker than LehighValley lube.
; I thought this might help some guys with a cold weather lube. I've been searching for many years for an accurate, multishot cold weather lube, and have now found it in the noted mix. Until now, for over 30 years, I've sworn by spit lubed patches for target work, but the Murph and Castor shoots as well or even better. I'll not use spit again.

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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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BlainSmipy
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: DarylS]
      #50430 - 21/02/06 05:53 AM

I've found thus far that TC butterbore is useless below about 40 degrees F. It becomes to hard to squeeze out the tube. So I tried a solution of Murphys oil soap and Butterbore warmed together and soaked into patches that are in a old RB container. This worked pretty good, and the fouling was minimized. I don't have any castor-oil or I would try that. Maybe I'll pick some up this week and give your potion a try.

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DarylSModerator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #50514 - 22/02/06 05:40 AM

You can also use Olive Oil instead of Castor, which level of virginity may not be important. We also tried a Murphy's:olive Ol: windshielf washer antifreeze lube that worked quite well too. These were common iongredients many people have at hand. I like the Olive Oil as that comes out of my wife's budget, along with the Murphy's.
: I like the castor as it's a very high temp lubricant, but it is relatviely expensive.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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JohnTheGreek
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: DarylS]
      #50523 - 22/02/06 08:13 AM

I mix 1/2 olive oil and 1/2 beeswax and then add murphys oil soap until the proper consistency is achieved given the temperature.

Best,

John

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tinker
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: JohnTheGreek]
      #86710 - 07/10/07 01:58 AM

Daryl-

I like your accounting metrics here...

'...I like the Olive Oil as that comes out of my wife's budget...'

I'll try that murphy's and castor or olive oil patch lube in my .54
Murphy's, olive oil, *and* castor oil are all solidly accounted for in my wife's end of the budget!!

I'll be cooking up a batch of beeswax and crisco this evening too. I'm only held to account for the beeswax in that formula, and the wife knows that if there's vegetable shortening around here, I'll keep making her pies and other baked crusty treats...


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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DarylSModerator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: tinker]
      #87033 - 13/10/07 12:22 AM

Please note, that some guys feel they get some brown residue resulting from the castor oil when it burns. In my bores and my bro's barrels as well, this hasn't happened.
: Although it is more costly, LehighValley lube as sold at www.trackofthewolf.com and other places, is the very best of any lubes I've used in 35 years of shooting muzzleloaders. Pathces lubed and stored in sealed containers remain ready for use over several months, however, if not air tight, the lube will evapourate, requiring replenishing. I find this a small price to pay for a superior product.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Tatume
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #87041 - 13/10/07 05:38 AM

Quote:

I've found thus far that TC butterbore is useless below about 40 degrees F. It becomes to hard to squeeze out the tube.



I use T/C 1000+ Bore Butter extensively. At one time I found a case of it at a going-out-of-business sale, and have since used the entire case. I watch for it on sale in every shop I visit.

I've never tried to use it from the tube in freezing temperatures, as I cut and lube my patches in advance. The cut patches are placed on a tray made of doubled aluminum foil. A generous dollop of Bore Butter is placed on them, and the tray warmed in a 200 F oven. Once the lube has melted, fold the tray closed and compress between the hands to more evenly distribute the lube. If they are kept in a warm home overnight, they will be found to be uniformly lubed the next day. The aluminum foil serves as a storage container as they are used.

I’ve used patches so lubed in temperatures as low as 0 F, and have had no problems whatsoever. I can’t say that T/C 1000+ Bore Butter is the best of the muzzle-loading patch and cleaning lubricants, as I have not used all the rest to compare them. It has worked perfectly for so many years that I see no need to try another.

Take care, Tom

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: Tatume]
      #87413 - 19/10/07 10:07 AM

Does anybody use bear grease (which is really a light oil)?

I rendered several quarts of it last year, but haven't tried it yet. Legend says it was the standard by which all others were judged.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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DarylSModerator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: CptCurl]
      #87440 - 20/10/07 12:41 AM

Curl- I used bear 'grease' back in the 70's. I mistakenly rendered down the fat from the outside of the animal, instead of the interior oil. The outside fat is more of a shortening than an oil, however oil did form on top of the shortening in the can. This was poured off and used as an all-temperature patch lube. For shooting, it was inferior to what I use now, LeHighValley lube.
; The bear oil did allow several shots before fouling built up, enough for big game hunting, of course where only 1 or 2 shots are taken.
: For squirrel or rabit hunting where many mroe shots are taken, a better lube is required if one doesn't want to have to 'wipe' the bore. I don't clena until all the day's shooting is done, so I had to search for a better lube.
; Marmot oil is superior to bear's oil, btw. Those I took to test this, were shot at the top of Hudson's Bay Mountain in Smither's B.C., before that was made illegal. The marmot oil was very much better than bear's oil and also made a tremendous leather boot waterproofer - better than Sno-Seal or Dubbin. It would allow up to 5 or 6 shots with heavy loads, but not as good as lehighValley lube. I've yet to find anything that's as good as that stuff. In my match .40 barrel, LehighValley even oustshoots spit - both cleaner shooting and more accurate and I've never had to wipe at any time using spit. The commercial stuff is simpley superior in my barrels & my bros guns too.
: For me, it's worth it to use all the time, even though I have to order it from the States. We're due to order another case right away as I just ran out.
: BTW- mink oil(sold by Track) was about as good as bear's oil.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

Edited by Daryl_S (20/10/07 12:42 AM)

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BillfromOregon
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: DarylS]
      #87441 - 20/10/07 01:21 AM

Daryl: Very interesting about the marmot oil. We have them east of the Cascades in Oregon, where they are called rockchucks. I've never shot them, but many do, and leave the carcasses for the coyotes although I have heard marmot can be good eating. Didn't know they had useful fat.

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: BillfromOregon]
      #87809 - 26/10/07 06:18 AM

Daryl,

My brother-in-law killed a bear last fall. I asked him to bring me some of the fat, which he did. I rendered the oil from the raw fat and still have it. The oil I rendered is very light and looks almost like olive oil. It does have a yellow-brown tint. I canned it in Mason jars, but haven't done anything with it to date. I guess I should give it a try.

By the way, do you live in Smithers? I was there in May 2005 on the way to the Stikine River for a bear hunt. We spent the night there on the way in and had a beautiful view of Hudson's Bay Mountain right out of our motel window.

Curl

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DarylSModerator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: CptCurl]
      #87904 - 28/10/07 07:59 AM

Curl - I lived in Smithers back in the 70's and presently my Daughter lives there. I live 230 miles East, in Prince George. BTW - if any of you BP shooters are travelling by vehicle to this region, do let me know.
; H.B. Mountain is beautiful any time of year, but especially when it's got some snow on it. Back in the 70's that was 12 months of the year. The Bulkley River which runs through Smithers, has a great Summer run of Steelhead for flyfishing in the fall, Oct. and Nov., not to mention the various runs of salmon from July through August.
; As with bear, taking the fat from the interior of the animal renders out a more pure oil than the fat from the outside.
: Marmot's make fairly good eating, even the smaller rock-chuck variety. I've even eaten eastern woodchuck, same family. The larger speciments tend toward toughness no matter which species.
; I have fond memories of using bear's oil and marmot oil for patch lube. The Marmot oil remained semi-liquid, even in -30 weather, too cold for me to hunt nowadays, but back then. My bear's oil had to much shortening in it and got quite hard in those temps. The pure oil that separated to the top of the can didn't freeze.
; I've since found LehighValley lube to be superior to anything I've ever used prior, including bear or marmot oil and just yesterday ordered 5 bottles of it from Track. Shipping is a bummer, but then, nothing matches L.H. Valley lube for clean shooting and accuracy - better than spit for target shooting in my guns an that says a lot. It's worth the price. I suspect my final per bottle price is around $15.00 after taxes, etc. It lasts well, for a lot of shooting, that is. It will evapourate from a non-air tight container though and pre-lubed patches need replenishing with lube every week or so. It's an easy matter to put any pre-lubed patches in a tight container to 'save' the lube.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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tinker
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: DarylS]
      #88254 - 05/11/07 02:12 PM

Daryl, Curl-

I spent this lazy sunday at home rendering oil from the fat of the bear I took home from my last hunt.
I have over a gallon of it here in jars, in my meat locker at ~-11c or ~11f most of it is staying in the liquid state. The first two half-pint jars were from exterior fat and the rest of it from the luscious butterball fat from around the animal's muscles.

Having read around the web looking for a proper rendering process, I ended up trying three different methods -- chunks of fat tossed in a big kettle of boiling water on the stove..., chunks of fat tossed into a big hot kettle (no water) on the stove..., and a big roaster in the oven, set to ~250f
I like the oven roaster method the best. I got the best yield with the least fuss and the oil I got from that method was much more clear from the start.
I gave up on the stovetop methods very quickly.

I'm thinking of taking a quart of it to the lab and running it in a centrifuge or putting it through a vacuum filter rig to seperate what little solids are left in the clear light amber oil (I have the equipment there, might as well use it on my bear oil...)
Can you guys think of a good reason not to take filtration to such a high level of purity?
Cheesecloth can only do so much after all.



--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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Marrakai
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: tinker]
      #88277 - 06/11/07 12:29 AM

Hi Tinker:
Man, you seem to be going to a lot of trouble. Here in Australia, we done a real good thing: we buy our bear oil at the local shop in a little glass jar...



This is much simpler than slaving over a hot stove!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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DarylSModerator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: Marrakai]
      #88278 - 06/11/07 12:46 AM

Tinker - way to go on that bears oil. I've found the oil derived from fat taken from the gut, around the stomach, intestines, etc, is the best 'oil'.
: Most people use too much heat in the rendering process. Too much heat renders too many solids, making more of a shortening than an oil.
: The oil that remains liquid at -12 or so, if poured off, will make the best lube for hunting during the cold winter months.
; I hadn't thought of the oven method - way to go for that titbit of information.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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tinker
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: Marrakai]
      #88305 - 06/11/07 08:42 AM

Marrakai-

You know that Eucalyptus oil isn't the same thing as Bear oil, don't you?

Does anyone actually use eucalyptus oil as a patch lubricant?
I never thought of eucalyptus oil as a lubricant, I've always used it as a topical antiseptic.

Does the company who offers the oil in the image you linked also offer bear oil?

For all it's worth, I can buy bear oil here in the states too for about $7.50usd/fluid ounce.
I worked the oil from my bear to maximize the value out of my work getting the animal (in oil alone that's nearly a grand right there), and to honor the life of the animal as much as I could.


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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bonanza
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: tinker]
      #88311 - 06/11/07 11:08 AM

Hyperlube.

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Marrakai
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: bonanza]
      #88334 - 06/11/07 04:26 PM

Tinker:
You've taken me way too seriously, my friend!
Did you miss the little picture of the Aussie Bear (Koala) on the label! They eat only gum-leaves, so I'm sure that rendering down their body-fats would produce a fair quantity of eucalyptus oil!
They are totally protected wildlife of course.

Yes, eucalyptus oil makes a fine antiseptic, and isn't half bad for cleaning back a dark oil finished stock.

As a patch lube it would be a disaster I'm sure!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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tinker
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: Marrakai]
      #88341 - 06/11/07 05:58 PM

Ok, so...

Duh.



--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: tinker]
      #88727 - 12/11/07 12:44 AM

Tinker,

If you have the equipment to spin down your oil and filter it that sounds like a winner.

My oil, having set on a shelf for more than a year, has settled some light solids to the bottom. I was thinking it would be nice to further purify the product; for what, I don't know.

Here's what mine looks like today:

I think I might pop the jar in my freezer and see what happens. Will report.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: CptCurl]
      #89455 - 21/11/07 10:57 PM

Well, I put it in the freezer, also with a thermometer to know what temperature I had.

The thermometer read 3 degrees Farenheit. The bear oil solidified and looked about like Crisco. I didn't open the jar to feel how stiff it was because I didn't want to introduce any bacterial to the oil.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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Dphariss
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Re: Lubricants for Patched round ball shooting [Re: CptCurl]
      #89551 - 23/11/07 07:25 AM

Quote:

Does anybody use bear grease (which is really a light oil)?

I rendered several quarts of it last year, but haven't tried it yet. Legend says it was the standard by which all others were judged.

Curl



I use bear oil, sperm whale oil and neatfoot oil and they will all work.
I got a bottle of sperm whale oil from a friend who got some from one of his friends who had a bunch he had come across someplace years past.
My 16 bore with .008" deep grooves loads very nicely with this stuff using a .662 ball and a .012" linen patch. It is a little different color than my almost gone other Sperm oil. But the guy swears that its Sperm whale oil. I have no way to test and don't really care if it works well.
Bear oil is good and more solids can be removed by putting a couple of lead balls in the container. I used one in about a cup of oil in a glass jar and quite a bit of "bear lard" formed on it.
I don't use water based lubes at all. Water is a poor lubricant.
Some rifles shoot better with a greased patch, lube rubbed just on the barrel side. I use SPG bullet lube and my 54 likes it but I only use it for serious target work and use oil for hunting. Too much oil (or any liquid) in the patch will contaminate the powder for a distance back from the ball if so I wipe them pretty dry for the first loading. In the field with a fouled barrel I leave them a little wetter but not dripping by any means. Over powder wad of some sort may eliminate the problem.

Dan

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