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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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500grains
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Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: DarylS]
      #141925 - 12/09/09 03:41 PM

Will someone please buy Ed a new camera?

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Sarg
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Reged: 20/01/07
Posts: 1365
Loc: Nil
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: 500grains]
      #141953 - 13/09/09 07:10 AM

True , He has one of the most interesting and informative treads , but we loss a bit in the pics LoL ! !

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Sarg]
      #142011 - 14/09/09 02:03 PM

Mathew what chambers are you asking about. Most shotgun
smiths have reamers to deepen chambers. I have reamers
folks can use for my 585,700 wildcats.
Comparing brass cases.I tell everybody who are stepping
up in power from 3.5 plastic, you can get 3.5" brass cases
from Rocky Mtn Cartridge. Here you can see how heavy
and nice they are compared to regular brass cases.
They also make shorter 3" brass cases also.
They fit the chamber tight and are long enough to
get some serious thumping power.And they have a
super strong, thick , solid head, not a weak balloon head
like regular ones on the left in pic.Ed





--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Matthew
.224 member


Reged: 27/08/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Bend, OR
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #142036 - 15/09/09 01:46 AM

Thanks Ed, I was meaning the longer 3.85" chamber I read about. Who made reamers, who has one they are willing to rent or be paid to use etc.

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Matthew]
      #142396 - 20/09/09 01:33 PM

Dave Kiff at PTG makes reamers I understand, for both
the RMC long case and our long case.

Tested my 499HE in a NEF. Loads I didn't have to
full length resize the case, only top 1/4 of case.
325gr at 2600, 500gr at 2150.
In NEF got both weight bullets 300 fps faster,
still extracted very easy.I got reamer. Just run it
in NEF 500 chamber and you got a blaster. And add
a little weight and thick pad to the gun.I have
a barrel ring to hold forearm along with original
bolt, as I added weight there as well as the butt.Ed



--------------------
Ed Hubel

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26513
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #142420 - 21/09/09 01:04 AM

NEF 500 Nitro - interesting! What's the rate of twist on an NEF .500S&W, Ed? I think they have a .500" groove diameter, or maybe .505" - not sure?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Sarg
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Posts: 1365
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Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: DarylS]
      #142438 - 21/09/09 06:47 AM

Daryl , I made a 500NE 3 1/4 on a NEF rifle a few years ago , a bit much in full Nitro loads !

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26513
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Sarg]
      #142462 - 22/09/09 12:12 AM

I'd expect a few pounds of shot in an epoxy matrix set in both fore-end and butt stock would be necessary.
I do remember ow much my .50 3 1/4" Sharps kicked when I ran 450's out at 2,150fps. O'course, the skeleton steel butt didn't help.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: DarylS]
      #142674 - 25/09/09 03:30 PM

You can do a lot of nice big bore ideas with NEF.
Just add weight. The 500 S&W I think is about 18"
twist and .500" groove diameter. Uses all the
.500" diameter bullets out there in bigger supply
than the .510" bullet other 50cal use.Something new.

Finally an 870 with longer 1" muzzle barrel. Barrel
is heavier than most all add on pump gun barrels,
and it is 25.5" long, Something that would really get
it on with the slower powder loads we have.
Rifled barrel is solid mount in receiver, scoperail solid mount.

It is the REM 870 Super Slug Gun.
Nice long heavy barrel, and thumbhole stock for
handling recoil better. Plastic case 3" slug loads of ours that
gets 600gr slugs to 1800-1900 fps, work great in this
Like the ones I load and roll crimp in second picture
that are setting behind the little vise, and the one in the
vise readt to be crimped...Ed





--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Shackleton
.300 member


Reged: 11/08/07
Posts: 203
Loc: Iowa
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #142836 - 29/09/09 01:05 AM

Been meaning to ask-Would the bolt action Marlin slug gun stand up to any of these loads? Haven't seen one in a while but I seem to remember it having a heavier barrel(maybe not heavy enough to use .50 brass as-is though). I noticed the Mossberg 395 mentioned a few times so I got curious about the Marlin.

--------------------
"I do not kill with my gun, he who kills with his gun has forgotten the face of his father. I kill with my heart."--Stephen King

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Shackleton]
      #143090 - 03/10/09 04:43 PM

The Marlin would handle hotter loads than factory, but can't
be opened up in the port for real long cases. The Mossy 395,
495 and 695 can go to 3.5" brass cases, and looks nicer.
The loads I do with the RE17 could be used in Marlin 3 inch,
that I tested above in the Mauser with regular slug barrel.

Here is a novel slug idea, hard plastic support ring on
the front, and a locked base ring/seal. Metal never
touches the bores. Work in great rifled and good in
smooth barrels. These are steel, lead/copper would do
great also.Could be made heavier and different points.
Flat point shown would do great damage to game.
On the net- ammunitiontogo.com
This one is about 500 gr.

Second picture is the 499HE to use in redoing the 500S&W,
shown on the also, in single shots, etc,for those wanting
much more power at 40-50% lower pressures.Ed





--------------------
Ed Hubel

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #143633 - 14/10/09 09:33 AM

So many guys want 12ga sabot type slugs to reload their own.
Here is an interesting combination slug available in Europe
and they are working to get distributors/stores here.
Any interested stores and shops contact them. We need
many sources of saboted slugs for reloading. The sabot
petals discards completely as slug exits muzzle and locked
on base stays with slug, making it nose heavy so it will give
decent accuracy in smooth bores.Will work in rifled barrels
also. Slug is .629" diameter, comes in 570gr, 700gr, 970gr
weights. They're selling these reloader/other loaders only.
It is called the US-S slug, and their site is
europeancartridgeunlimited.com ..Ed



--------------------
Ed Hubel

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #144086 - 21/10/09 08:01 PM

The company kindly gave me few US-S slugs to test at high speeds.
I had helped him test another slug a while back.
He sent me some each of the US-S 570 gr, 700 gr, 970 gr.
I tested the 570 gr so far and in 3.5" plastic case in the 1887
smoothbore 35" barrel and in the NEF rifled 36" barrel at
1900 fps. I got that with 130gr of RE17 with one BPGS
seal under the sabot on the slug. The bottom of the sabot seal
is exactly like a BPGS, so a BPGS added gives double sealing.
Both smooth and rifled gave 3 shot 3" group each at 50 yds with
peep sights and bad eyes. This slug does as good as advertized
in smooth barrels, and smooth accuracy is as good as rifled.
My smooth barrel is tight, measuring 723" at muzzle.
These should be a great deer and hog slug. Folks need to
ask their dealers to work to import these for them
to have what seems a good slug to reload...

On another note we may have found a guy who is gearing up
to make 10 ga rifled barrels. I'll know later this winter
If so I will put one on a bolt action and use the 4.1" long
10GA FH case I made or get some like it from RMC..Ed

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #144401 - 25/10/09 05:08 PM

Here is picture of the US-S slugs in a lineup
with other 12ga slugs I'm testing. Lefteris was
kind enough to send me a few of each weight
to test. They are the 3 in second row on the right.
They are 570gr, 700 gr, 970 gr. I tested 570gr in
3.5" plastic so far. At 1900 in the NEF rifled, and
in the 1887 smooth barrel, got 3" group on both.
With peep sights an bad eyes.So the US-S slug
is great in smoothbores, as good as rifled. My
smoothbore on the 1887 is .723" bore at muzzle,
a nice tight fit for smooth slugs. The smooth
bores Lefteris tested them with are .722" muzzle,
and they've already killed 5 wild boars, one shot
kills with the 570gr slug. Also if anyone wants a
heavy smoothbore new 12ga barrel, .722" muzzle,
1.375" outside diameter to make a great slug
gun with slugs like these, and others like the
Brenekkes, I have spare one. The US-S slugs
are smoothbore accurate in my 87 like the
Brenekke KOs.ED



--------------------
Ed Hubel

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #144631 - 28/10/09 05:02 PM

I got the 700H 3.25 case feeding from the magazine I set
up on the Montana Rifle Co PH action. It is singlestack with
feed lips similiar to 12ga shotgun clip style magazines I
had here. Works great, shown in first picture. Now it is longer
than regular 12ga mags, but same setup would do for feeding
long brass 12GA FH and long MRC 12ga cases. The
700H 3.25 is 3.9 inches overall loaded length. In picture
case is ready to clear the mag lips, then rim pops up under
extracter as bolt is moving forward. Second picture is
the box used that I made out of two PH boxes. That allowed
for extra height and fit for singlestack and riveted together.
Used a Savage 210 12ga follower and spring. ED





--------------------
Ed Hubel

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26513
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #144671 - 29/10/09 03:14 AM

Ed - that is one mean looking round! In ratio, very much like a short .45 bullet loaded in a 2 3/4" case, but when one realizes it's a 12 bore, and much stronger than a .700 Express - WOW!

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: DarylS]
      #145206 - 05/11/09 03:54 PM

The 700gr US-S slug in smoothbore, at 2000
in a 3.5" brass case, got a 2.5" 3 shot group
at 50 yds. Great slugs they have come up with
for smoothbores.
Some of us talking about getting 10 ga rifled
barrels made, here is a picture of my 4.1" long
brass 10ga I made from 50cal Russian by putting
on a rim like the 12GA FH is built.Just a prototype,
third in picture. Later I'll get RMC to make some,
as it is much easier way. First in picture is
16GA FH 3.5" long, 2nd 12GA FH 3.85" long,
3rd 10GA FH 3.1" long, 4th 8GA FH 4.3" long.Ed



--------------------
Ed Hubel

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26513
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #145211 - 05/11/09 05:15 PM

My shoulder aches just looking at those. 'Course, the 16 bore looks pretty good, though.
2.5" is very good indeed for a large bore on a 50 yard target - from a smoothbore yet is just iceing, lots of it.

Daryl

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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hubel458
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Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: DarylS]
      #145517 - 10/11/09 04:09 AM

I now have a variety of 12GA FH test guns including
two Savage 210s in the lineup...SO I'm selling the first
12GA FH that I did on the Savage 210 bolt action.
Its in original Savage stock now, 28" Pacnor rifled barrel.
Stock is weighted and double thick recoil pad.
It is chambered for the original 3.85" long 12GA FH case.
750 plus shipping, included 4 of our long cases and
30 slugs.That is the first 12GA FH built on a Savage
and the second 12GA FH ever built. Pickup here for MI
guys ok also. Savage 210s are now 550 bucks, the heavy
rifled barrel cost me 350 bucks..Ed

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Matthew
.224 member


Reged: 27/08/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Bend, OR
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #145785 - 13/11/09 02:10 PM

Sold, can I buy 12 cases?

PM me please.

Matthew

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Matthew]
      #145801 - 13/11/09 05:35 PM

I PM'd Matthew on other forum, It is his if a local doesn't
show up with money by tomorrow 5pm EST. Which I don't
think he can do. ED

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Matthew
.224 member


Reged: 27/08/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Bend, OR
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #145865 - 14/11/09 06:53 AM

I will send out USPS MO Monday, I am sitting on my money hoping.

Matthew

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hubel458
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Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Matthew]
      #145873 - 14/11/09 10:31 AM

Matthew is lucky guy, it is all his.Ed

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Matthew
.224 member


Reged: 27/08/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Bend, OR
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: hubel458]
      #145909 - 15/11/09 03:45 AM

Lucky and VERY excited.

Matthew

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hubel458
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Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: 12GA From Hell [Re: Matthew]
      #146229 - 19/11/09 06:41 PM

Matthew in Oregon got the 12GA FH Savage.
It is on the way to him.
He is now in the recoil club.

Here is picture of the 12ga belted cases I made to
test a few loads in. I made it from 55cal belted
Boys case. I reduced belt diameter a little and left
the base the same, which is 12ga size.In picture
first is 55cal, second expanded to .620", third
expanded to .660"(16ga), then two 12 ga ones.
Next is our 12GA FH, and then a 12ga 3.5"
plastic case.A little work in long 12ga FH chamber
with a tool for belt step and it chambers. Ed



--------------------
Ed Hubel

Edited by hubel458 (19/11/09 06:44 PM)

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