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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: For Peterb [Re: Peterb]
      #44585 - 22/12/05 05:43 AM

Peterb,

Thanks for replying. However, I’d like to comment on your reply. I’d say there are probably 4 tiers of DR price range:

1: 3-8k : pedersoli, and some over/unders
2: 8-12k : merkel, heym, searcy, etc.
3: 13-50k : vintage British
4: 150k+ : new British

Quality is very subjective term as it can mean many things to many people. However, in a $12,000 DR there are some objective tangible attributes of quality that are immutable, those being: high grade materials, close tolerances, excellent fit and finish, absolute reliability and most importantly, near perfect regulation. The subjective non-tangible attributes will be balance and feel.

In closely examining and shooting several DRs in the past year, personally I don’t think one can get better quality for the price than tier2 if you look at it objectively. Certainly, in form, some rifles are prettier than others, but not better quality.

I’ll agree that the Chapuis and Heym are priced on the high-end, but not by much. The bottom line is that you are not going to find a big bore double for less than 10k, regardless of its quality. Let’s face it, all the rifles in tier2 are mass produced, but you will get a real DR that will shoot a sub 3” group for the price of an used Ford and that is alright in my book.


--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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new_guy
Sponsor


Reged: 10/08/04
Posts: 581
Loc: Texas
Re: For Peterb [Re: bonanza]
      #44597 - 22/12/05 06:21 AM

I think you'll have to move Heym up one grade based on price.

The latest price for their basic 470 I've seen was right at $17K.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: For Peterb [Re: new_guy]
      #44603 - 22/12/05 07:19 AM

I'm not argueing with your conclusions but pointing out that you left off a probably two catagories of Eropean makers. These would be Francotte, Thys, Dumoulin, Beretta WRT their 455, Peruguini/Visini and others on the upper end and the German makers and guild guns, I'd say split upper and middle market.

Thoughts?

JPK

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bonanza
.400 member


Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: For Peterb [Re: JPK]
      #44607 - 22/12/05 08:39 AM

I agree. I totally forgot the boutique makers that are in the 20-50k range. I also deliberately ignored embellishments as that can really jack-up the price of a rifle without improving quality.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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Grizzly
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Reged: 05/12/05
Posts: 359
Loc: Dallas, Texas, USA
Re: For Peterb [Re: bonanza]
      #44624 - 22/12/05 11:58 AM

Just my my opinion.

Yes, price range is near and dear to our hearts.

But I have been on a quest for functionality versus price. The exican Rigby" will be at least 20% more than the others. What is the sense in buying a name unless you can make a nice profit on it.

The ideal double has chopper lump barrels. Most of the newer versions are mono bloc. Many great rifles in mono bloc, but not the same fit as chopper lump.

Searcy makes all mono bloc, and chopper is a $4000 upgrade. That's right, $4000.

An "anti-doubling" device is a great feature. No two barrells at once. I don't mean to pick on Searcy, but that is an extra over $1000.

And a "Greener" lock is extra as well. The Greener provides a third "bite" on a double. And based on my research a third point of contact on a double is cheap insurance.

With all of that said, Searcy makes probably the best double righ now. It may be too heavy heavy, too ugly, or too American, but it is a shooter.

If you want a double that stays in the safe, there are a whole bunch of pretty double makers. If you want a shooter, do a functional comparison, and listen to people that use it in the field.

You will get many pros and cons. Common sense prevails. Think for yourself, and you will never be dissappointed.



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bulldog563
.400 member


Reged: 21/10/05
Posts: 1153
Loc: California
Re: For Peterb [Re: Grizzly]
      #44638 - 22/12/05 02:20 PM

Does the Greener Cross Bolt come standard on the higher level Searcy's (deluxe, sidelock, underlever etc.) or do you have to ask for it? If so how much extra? I assume you are talking about the PH because of the intercepting sears comment. Do you need the Greener Cross Bolt when you already have double purdey bolting?

--------------------
Join the National Rifle Association:
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Peterb
.333 member


Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 288
Re: For Peterb [Re: bulldog563]
      #44646 - 22/12/05 04:17 PM

I would add guns like the Fanzoi and H&W to the top list, but I don't know if there is any difference between these maybe $40k guns from the Purdey/H&H guns at much higher. I still consider it a single group but don't care if others consider one or more groups. The Heym and Rigby are in the upper middle group in price. I really do not think the Rigby deserves being there. The Heym is rather high price in comparison to Merkel and Searcy, but it IS a very nice gun. A bit blocky but nice quality. My Russian friend who is very wise on the Euro guns says the Merkel quality has dropped over the last 5 years. I cannot comment on them other than I trust his judgement.

I really cannot understand the extra cocking mechanisms on the Blaser and Krieghoff. It is hard to imagine anything so dumb on a dgr.

On the comment that the Searcy is overly heavy...my 470 PH is 9 1/2 pounds. So that comment has no merit.

The Vegas show should provide a good example of many different doubles to examine.

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500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: For Peterb [Re: Peterb]
      #44650 - 22/12/05 04:50 PM

The Fanzoj I have seen are nicer than current H&H IMO.

And that, like any other opinion, is likely to rankle someone.

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