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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
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Loc: Whitetail Country
I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller
      #382925 - 28/02/24 03:45 AM

Hello All

I have posted this to warn others about this fraudulent seller on Gun Broker.

here is the original listing ... https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1034173843

A thoughtful wife bought this rifle for her husband as a Valentine's Day gift. But, she didn't know that you can't trust a seller on Gunbroker with an A+(585) rating. She didn't know to check the feedback to see that the seller had over 34 Negatives. (4 Negatives in the last 3 weeks) She didn't now that when the seller says MAGNUM in 3 places in the listing that he may be lying.

Even though many of us know guns, and that we know that Mauser did make Model A Magnum action rifles, we can't see in pictures the 5/15" difference in length between a Standard length action, and a Magnum length action. We look to the description.

After the sale, I had a chance to review the rifle in hand ... Here is what I found along with observations that were confirmed from Axel E., a World Renowned Expert on Mauser rifles.

This is a real type A Mauser Commercial rifle, built 1930 – 31 for retail by Manton, Calcutta. But, it is NOT a rare Oberndorf “Magnum” action rifle. It is a 10.75x68 rifle on a common standard length action.

In addition, the rifle was severely altered, which was not disclosed by the seller. Alterations that have totally destroyed its collector value. These include:

The rear receiver bridge was ground down, removing the clip guide ears, the front and rear receiver were drilled and tapped for a scope mount base. The bolt handle is a new low profile handle welded on in place of the original, and a low profile Buehler safety was installed to clear a scope.

These mutilations have totally destroyed collector value, even though it was a rare model A Mauser in 10.75x68 caliber. Original Mauser, Oberndorf Commercial rifles in 10.75x68 caliber are rare since most of them are of the B type. Only about 15% of the small number of these rifles are type A. But with the alterations, and its not being a rare Magnum, the value is only about HALF of what the lady paid.

As I said, the lady buyer didn't know about rifles, and she bought it as a gift for her husband, and went by the description. Only later was it found NOT to be a Magnum. We can't fault her for believing the seller, and trying to surprise her husband with a special gift.

The husband has now filed a complaint with the Credit Card Co. and received a temporary charge-back, but it will be months before all the back-and-forth arguments are settled, because the seller has stated that the listing says that he doesn't accept returns, and the buyer should have relied on the pictures.

The husband hasn't pushed the issue and told her that she was defrauded, because after all it was a Valentine's Day Present and she meant well. But unfortunately she got taken by a crooked dealer. Lets just hope it all gets settled, and the rifle gets sent back to the dealer, so he can try to stick it to someone else.

Beware this seller - page through and read all his Negatives.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1113
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #383224 - 08/03/24 06:06 AM

WELL ... LOOKS LIKE THEIR ACCOUNT WAS SUSPENDED BY GUNBROKER .... ITS ABOUT TIME !

UPDATE .... THE SUSPENSION WAS SHORT LIVED .... 4 HOURS LATER HE'S BACK IN BUSINESS ... GUN BROKER PUT HIM BACK IN BUSINESS .... THEY MUST HAVE LIKED THE FEES THEY WERE COLLECTING .... ? ? ?

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #383237 - 08/03/24 03:22 PM

Quote:


UPDATE .... THE SUSPENSION WAS SHORT LIVED .... 4 HOURS LATER HE'S BACK IN BUSINESS ... GUN BROKER PUT HIM BACK IN BUSINESS .... THEY MUST HAVE LIKED THE FEES THEY WERE COLLECTING .... ? ? ?




Pity the selling site hasn't followed through. It can be hard for a selling site to work out who is telling the truth. The number of negative reports might be evidence.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1113
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: NitroX]
      #383246 - 09/03/24 01:50 AM

Yes, I see that gunbroker keeps their account active because of the thousands of dollars they make in commissions, even from a fraudulent seller with over 40 negatives ... eight of which are for being a "non-paying bidder."

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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Huvius
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Reged: 04/11/07
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #383248 - 09/03/24 02:51 AM

https://support.gunbroker.com/hc/en-us/articles/224766967-Buyer-s-Protection-Program

The item is most certainly “materially different than the description” so I’d think that the buyer has some recourse.

I realize that the buyer is not too knowledgeable about Mauser, but the photos clearly show that this is not a magnum action and also show the modifications that it had suffered.
Although the action length isn’t ll that easy to discern, one can see that it does not have a straddle floorplate, which all magnums have.
Another help in determining the difference is where the front action screw is in relation to the receiver ring.
The screw threads into the lug on the bottom of the receiver ring. On standard actions, this lug is just forward of the vertical midline of the receiver ring. On a magnum length action, the lug is behind the midline of the receiver ring.
It is easier to tell when the rifle has a crossbolt in the stock because the crossbolt is directly behind the lug (where it does its job dissipating recoil). On a standard action, the crossbolt is close to centered under the receiver ring. On a magnum, the crossbolt will be very close to centered under the rear edge of the receiver ring just in front of the magazine.

I’m pretty sure we discussed all of this at length here on Nitro Express some years ago.

All of that said, this seller is epithet a crook, an idiot, or that special combination of both.

Here’s the ad:

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1034173843

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1113
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: Huvius]
      #383251 - 09/03/24 04:44 AM

Hello Huvius,

Unfortunately the buyer protection link you posted is of no help to the buyer. I shows $500 maximum coverage with a $100 deductible ... so the seller could get $400, which is useless on a $5600 purchase ... fact is this is absolutely a crooked dealer with over 40 negatives over 3 years .. 8 of which are for being a "non-paying bidder" ... which screwed 8 sellers out of their sales ... no way to justify that history.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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Huvius
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Reged: 04/11/07
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Loc: Colorado
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #383259 - 09/03/24 11:23 AM

That’s too bad.
All of it.
I just hope that the buyer didn’t stretch too far financially to buy it.
I can’t imagine my own wife buying a vintage rifle for me.
She deserves applause for the effort alone.

I know you can help out if you have a direct line to the buyer but if they indeed get stuck with the rifle, I can supply some brass to get started.
Honestly, taking the rifle putting into the hands of a reputable smith and adding proper scope bases and rings could make it quite usable although not the exceptional firearm it was purported to be.
Sometimes one has to make the most of a bad situation.

Keep us apprised of any developments.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #383264 - 09/03/24 03:34 PM

Quote:

Hello Huvius,

Unfortunately the buyer protection link you posted is of no help to the buyer. I shows $500 maximum coverage with a $100 deductible ... so the seller could get $400, which is useless on a $5600 purchase ... fact is this is absolutely a crooked dealer with over 40 negatives over 3 years .. 8 of which are for being a "non-paying bidder" ... which screwed 8 sellers out of their sales ... no way to justify that history.




Doesn't say much about that platform that they are allowing the account to stay active.

$5600 is a lot of money for a so so Mauser 98.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


Edited by NitroX (09/03/24 03:42 PM)


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: NitroX]
      #383265 - 09/03/24 03:41 PM

I noted on an Aussie selling site they advise do not pay until a firearm is delivered into the hands of the transfering dealer. A requirement in Australia is a firearm must be transferred via a dealer or another authorised licensee eg club, police officer, depending on the state.

That's a new recommendation.

I'm guessing frauds have occurred.

The legal requirement to transfer through a dealer probably doesn't exist in much or any of the USA.

I always wondered how people trusted strangers so much to just send them lots of $$$ for a sight unseen item bought online. The correctly or not described product, condition aside, some might never send any product at all.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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LRF
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Reged: 28/03/11
Posts: 309
Loc: minnesota ,usa
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: NitroX]
      #383274 - 09/03/24 10:17 PM

Quote:

...... A requirement in Australia is a firearm must be transferred via a dealer or another authorised licensee eg club, police officer, depending on the state.
........
The legal requirement to transfer through a dealer probably doesn't exist in much or any of the USA.
........




From the Gun Broker auction, "Firearms may only be shipped to a licensed dealer (FFL Holder)."
That applies if the gun was shipped. Not knowing the location of the seller or the buyer but if over statelines the gun would have required for a FFL to be involved. Now the buyer could be the license holder.


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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3987
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: Huvius]
      #383290 - 10/03/24 07:20 AM

Quote:

That’s too bad.
All of it.
I just hope that the buyer didn’t stretch too far financially to buy it.
I can’t imagine my own wife buying a vintage rifle for me.
She deserves applause for the effort alone.

I know you can help out if you have a direct line to the buyer but if they indeed get stuck with the rifle, I can supply some brass to get started.
Honestly, taking the rifle putting into the hands of a reputable smith and adding proper scope bases and rings could make it quite usable although not the exceptional firearm it was purported to be.
Sometimes one has to make the most of a bad situation.

Keep us apprised of any developments.




Certainly sad to hear your mate getting ripped off Buckstix, put on top of all this, having a wonderful wife buying him a bit of a Frankenstein! A loving deed gone horribly wrong.
We can only hope that this individual behind all this gets what's coming to him!
I'm with Huvius, if he's stuck with the rifle, hopefully he can remake it back to what it could be rather than what it was reported to be.


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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1113
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: 93x64mm]
      #384344 - 20/04/24 11:29 PM

Well, the fraudulent seller just got another NEGATIVE from a guy that paid about $3,500 for a Luger that was faked.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1042425415

But the fraudulent seller is still selling on Gunbroker. Gunbroker has done nothing to stop him.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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85lc
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #384357 - 21/04/24 02:45 AM

Wow, in the past 12 months, this seller has 21 negative feedbacks.

--------------------
RB


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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1113
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: 85lc]
      #384358 - 21/04/24 02:49 AM

Quote:

Wow, in the past 12 months, this seller has 21 negative feedbacks.


If you look back in his selling and buying history, he has 43 NEGATIVES.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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Rule303
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: buckstix]
      #384367 - 21/04/24 09:42 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Wow, in the past 12 months, this seller has 21 negative feedbacks.


If you look back in his selling and buying history, he has 43 NEGATIVES.




I do not know commercial law over there but the following may be worth a try. Write to Gunbroker and point out all the negative things this bloke has done. Then point out all your efforts to get them to delist this advertiser. Then suggest you are going to get the police to investigate them as they are knowingly aiding and abetting a crook unless they delist the person and stop allowing him to advertise, no matter what name he uses. maybe mention getting the FBI involved as the adds go US wide not just one state. Point out that with the current anti gun climate they will most likely jump at this. They are always looking for ways to close down firearm sales.

Don't necessarily put the complaint to police/FBI just make the mention of your intent.


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DarylS
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: Rule303]
      #384369 - 21/04/24 09:53 AM

That might work, Rule303.
But then, might they see this as helping/protecting the firearms community?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: DarylS]
      #384378 - 21/04/24 03:12 PM

Quote:

That might work, Rule303.
But then, might they see this as helping/protecting the firearms community?




Shouldn't be necessary. Large numbers of negatives and if serious negatives should be enough to shut down an advertiser allegedly purposely committing frauds.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: I have posted this to warn all about this fraudulent seller [Re: NitroX]
      #384389 - 22/04/24 12:01 AM

There must not have been too many people fooled by this scam. The high bid is less than half the value of this Luger rig if genuine.

A buyer must at least do the due diligence of reviewing a seller's feedback.

Curly

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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