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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles

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DUGABOY1
.400 member


Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: luv2safari]
      #7409 - 25/01/04 04:27 AM

In reply to:

I have, and use a wide variety of the Valmet System guns and barrels. Tikka did make a double trigger receiver; I have one. I used in Tanz with 9,3 o/u barrels and 320 gr Woodleighs to take a decent buffalo. I just told the game scout it was a 375 Flanged. He didn't know the difference. Neither did the buff...ran off 30 yards and gurgled loudly...died. My 416 Rigby doesn't kill'em any deader.





Luv2safari, did the 320 gr Woodliegh bullets, in your Tikka 9.3X74R, require much change in the regulation adjustment? I've been thinking of working up a load for this bullet in my Merkel S/S, but it doesn't have adjustable regulation, so it may be a real deal getting a load that will shoot to the regulation of my rifle! If your rifle did not require a great amount of change, the load should be fairly easy! Woodliegh Bullets are expensive here in the States, so I don't want to waste any more than I have to, working up a load!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"


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DUGABOY1
.400 member


Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: 4seventy]
      #7410 - 25/01/04 05:14 AM

In reply to:

You have just described how your SxS method of loading both the O/U chambers does not work very well, true?

Part of my original statement was.......

" perhaps you should try a different loading technique".

My point being that it may not be a fault of the O/U but really a fault with the technique used to load the O/U!

Perhaps if you don't want to take my advice on doubles you may prefer to take some of your own.

Like regarding SxS & O/U chamber loading......

"Loading technique can,almost always, be improved on"
and
"If one needs improveing, they usually both do"!

Good advice indeed!




4seventy you have made quite a few comments on your loading technique being a better system, but you don't give any details! I for one would like to hear how this system works! If you have a better system to load both barrels similtaineously, than the one I described, on the S/S I would be particularly interested! I can think of no way to load both barrels at the same time with an O/U. My system works beautifully for the S/S for me, and the two rounds between the fingers was not invented by either of the people you have credited with it. It was practiced by Tayler, and many before him. Not only with double rifles, but with shotguns as well, and came origenally from the bird fields on Engalnd, Scotland, and Ireland!

I will have to follow my own advice, as you say, now as my left hand doesn't work so well after all the nerve damage done by the cancer, and the resulting surgery!

It makes little difference what is done, when loading one barrel at a time, all that has to do is, be conventient to YOU, but the butstock, or regular belt shell holders only works for one barrel at a time loading! I have always loaded with my left hand,both barrels at a time, keeping my right hand on the pistol grip of my rifle!

for the second reload, I use a little gadgit called
"DOUBLE DUTY" sold by TRADER RICK, and made by GALCO. It holds two rounds held by a little flap & post. When it is flipped open it unfolds on a henge, and drops two round into the left hand, primers down in the palm, bullets up like your fingers, giveing you control for the second two barrel reload.

With the two in the barrels, two between the finger, and two in the DOUBLE DUTY, you have six of the most convenient shells for quick reloading, and that system has worked very well for me for fourty years, except for the DOUBLE DUTY, which only came out about ten years ago, but is seldom needed in the field.

It seems, now, that may have to change my way of reload, because of hand problem!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"


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luv2safari
.400 member


Reged: 09/11/03
Posts: 1401
Loc: United States
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #7411 - 25/01/04 06:11 AM

Dugaboy1

The regulation of the Tikka barrels was a bit costly. The Woodleigh's were purchased from Midway Shooters Supply at a far better price than from Cabela's or Huntington's, by the way.

Bearing in mind that I was using an O/U with adjustable barrels, the regulation was somewhat simple.

The bottom barrel shot 3" high at 80 yards, and the top was 7" high. I moved the wedge so the barrels would converge. I was lucky enough that I got the top to shoot 1" higher than the bottom barrel. This put the barrels in absolute parallel with each other and allows me to use a scope that I sighted in at 175 yards. The open sight was now 3" high with the bottom and 4" at the top barrel. I made a new front blade sight and filed it until I was back dead on with the bottom at 80 yards...top now 1" high.

The windage didn't change in the O/U configuration. What you may be up against is a movement upward at 45 degrees, however, since yours is a SXS double rifle. The elevations of both barrels will probably change in relatively the same manner, which can be changed by simply adding to the height of the front sight blade. The big problem will be widening of the shots, which requires resoldering the barrels to regulate...not a real option without spending BIG BUCKS and a year or so at a good gunsmith, familiar with double rifles.

You also have to work up a load that seems to "tame" your particular gun. This might just fall into place or take a kings ransom in bullets and powder...time...

If you have some IMR 4831 around and buy a box of 320 Woodleighs, have a go at it. Let me know what results you have, and WATCH THE PRESSURES! I would try the protected point or soft point round nose. The solids are just too rigid a bullet to use in regulating a SXS rifle. If you can get the RN real close, the solids should shoot in close proximity.

Sometimes playing with velocities and different powders will work wonders. If you don't have a chronograph, buy one! Since the only 320's I know of are the Woodleighs, you don't have a change in bullet option.

--------------------
Hunt with Class and Classics


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4seventy
Sponsor


Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: NitroX]
      #7414 - 25/01/04 09:23 AM

In reply to:

Like blood from a stone!

You've hinted at it several times, TELL US!




Nitro,
I seem to remember a long long time ago someone on the forum tantalizing us with a post called "Hellfire and Double Rifles"!
Two can play this game ya know!


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DUGABOY1
.400 member


Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: luv2safari]
      #7418 - 25/01/04 02:37 PM

Luv2safari, I understand the process of working up loads for double rifles, both O/U, and S/S. That is why I saked if you had to do much adjusting for that bullet, if so, It might not be worth my time. I handload for nine double rifles right now, and have owned many, many doubles over the last 46 years, and have handloaded for all of them.

This rifle shoots to the sights with the loads I have now, so I don't think it will be a problem to get it to shoot bullets that were the right weight for the 9.3X74R, but the 320 was designed for the 9.3X64 rimless cartridge. I wouldn't re-regulate this rifle, simply to be able to use the 320 gr bullets, but if I can work up a load for them that will shoot to the regulation without spending the price of a Rolls Royce.


Considering you didn't have that much trouble adjusting for the 320 gr, I think I can work up a load for it quite easily.

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"


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luv2safari
.400 member


Reged: 09/11/03
Posts: 1401
Loc: United States
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #7423 - 25/01/04 04:57 PM

The 320 gr 9,3 was used in the 360 No. 2 Nitro, and has now been adopted by the 9,3x62 and x64 shooters. I am happy it works well in my Tikka.

I tried some 320 gr loads in the Merkel today. (I have a 175 yd range out my bedroom window...advantage of desert living) The Merkel shoots about 2 1/2" at 4 o'clock with Norma 286 Oryx factories. It shot 2 1/2" at 2 o'clock with my 320's at 80 yards. I'll take that any day from an older double. I'll just pop that rear sight over a tad and be content.

Sometimes these cheaper guns just work out. I like shooting the Tikka much better than this 204E Merkel, circa 1930, that I just got in a multi gun trade. I love Merkels and was happy as a clam to get this gun & two barrels. I may make someone else happy to own it, however. The rear trigger pull is so hard that I check to make sure I released the safety.
The Merkel is so much lighter and nicer feeling, and L. Smeets scratched some of the finest engraving I have ever seen onto the receiver. Maybe my smith can fix that awful rear trigger?

--------------------
Hunt with Class and Classics


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: Valmet 412 and Tikka 512 Double rifles [Re: 4seventy]
      #377629 - 28/06/23 01:36 AM

Quote:

Quote:


You've hinted at it several times, TELL US!




Nitro, all in good time ol'mate, all in good time!
Or as Sir Humphrey would say, "In the fullness of time Minister"!





Wrist ammo holder?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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