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85lc
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Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 938
Loc: Georgia, USA
Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction
      #373627 - 30/01/23 12:10 PM

The double rifle appears to be a 9.3x72 from the seller's descriptopn. It has nice engraving. The seller's description are somewhat limited and are as follows:

This is a Guss Stahl Krupt Essen W. Weisgerber Prima SxS Double Rifle, with a 24” barrel. I’m not sure what this really is. Any info anyone has would be appreciated. I cannot figure the caliber of this rifle. Trying different bullets, chamber is bigger than 223 but smaller than 308. Barrel bore in very good condition. Bluing is probably about 90% with minor small marks visible in the pics. Top of barrel is stamped W. Weisgerber/St. Wendel. Monte Carlo fine wood stocks are very good with age appropriate minor handling marks. Stock has ammo storage compartment. Receiver has some real nice engraving. Other internal barrel stampings are: 2,7 gGBP, 118/35. This is a quality double rifle. Gun has not been test fired. Pictures show the condition of this gun. Estate sale. AS IS NO REFUNDS. Ask questions before bidding. SN 5255 Store Stock #16807

I would post pictures but never figured out how that is done. I need a 10 year old to show me.

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RB


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casper50
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: 85lc]
      #373629 - 30/01/23 12:19 PM

post where the auction is?

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85lc
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Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 938
Loc: Georgia, USA
Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: casper50]
      #373647 - 31/01/23 02:38 AM

Casper50 et al,
Sorry I forgot to post the auction address. It is https://www.gunbroker.com/item/967656345.

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RB


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LRF
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Reged: 28/03/11
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Loc: minnesota ,usa
Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: 85lc]
      #373655 - 31/01/23 08:27 AM

Link doesn't work and also Gunbroker the auction #doesn't recognized

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: LRF]
      #373657 - 31/01/23 08:30 AM

An Error Has Occurred
The system encountered an unrecoverable error. This event has been logged and the system administrator has been notified.

Please click here to return to the GunBroker.com home page.

https://www.gunbroker.com/

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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85lc
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Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 938
Loc: Georgia, USA
Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: DarylS]
      #373663 - 31/01/23 11:59 AM

That is crazy. I am not sure why it shows an error message??

Try copying and pasting the address: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/967656345

I just die and it worked for me.

If not, search for Guss Stahl Krupt Essen W. Weisgerber SxS Double Rifle being sold by Duelin Tom

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RB


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DarylS
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: 85lc]
      #373667 - 31/01/23 12:57 PM

Odd - clicked on it and it came on this time.
Nicely fitted and great piece of wood attached, too.
Appears quite inexpensive, so far.

Tried the original link you posted at the start of this thread and it comes up bad again.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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lancaster
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: DarylS]
      #373671 - 31/01/23 07:32 PM

allways laugh until dead when reading krupp laufstahl essen ...

simply the brand of the barrel maker. its a nice suhl/ zella mehlis made double rifle with fine engraving + krupp stahl barrels. sold by someone with the name weisgerber, in sankt wendel 40 km from the french border were it was "liberated" in 1945.

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Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
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bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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kuduae
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Reged: 13/01/10
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: lancaster]
      #373672 - 31/01/23 09:21 PM

Waffen - Weisgerber in St. Wendel is one of the oldest gunshops in Germany. The family business was founded in 1814 and still exists after 209 years, now run by Dieter Weisgerber, see https://waffen-weisgerber.business.site/

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93x64mm
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: kuduae]
      #373673 - 31/01/23 10:22 PM

Nice looking piece!
Shame they never had the flats photographed, would be able to tell what it really is.
Hopefully a 9.3x74mm, looks too modern, scope mounts etc.
The 9.3x72 was a BP round only wasn't it????


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85lc
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Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 938
Loc: Georgia, USA
Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: 93x64mm]
      #373677 - 01/02/23 03:11 AM

kuduae, I think you earlier identified that type of scope bases is a very old scope mounting system.

I was thinking 9,3x72r because I didn't see the words Nitro and seller said cartridge smaller than 308 which I think has a similar head diametyert to the 9.3x74 (0.469 - 0.470") but I could be wroing.

--------------------
RB


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kuduae
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: 85lc]
      #373678 - 01/02/23 03:39 AM

The quoted proofmarks point to a 9.3x72 R. 118,35 is the old gauge number for a barrel with a bore/land (not groove or bullet!) diameter up to .350”. so the gun was proofed pre-1912. It was proofed for a service charge of 2.7 gramm = 42 gr GBP = smokeless rifle flake powder. This was the contemporary smokeless load for the 9.3x72R with a 196 gr copper jacket bullet at 2020 fps. The 9.3x74R charge would be 3.5g = 54 gr. The case diameter, larger than .223 but smaller than .308, speaks for the x72R too. The scope mount bases, Albert Wilhelm Triebel’s variation of a claw mount, were added in the 1920s – 30s.

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CJF
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: kuduae]
      #373913 - 07/02/23 06:39 AM

Hi All. I'll post pictures when it arrives!

The nitro proof mark was on the side of the barrels, not the flats, best seen in the pictures showing the sides of the receiver. The "N" is to the left of the "2.7 g G.B.R" over St m G (Stahl Mantel Geschoss or Steel Jacked Bullet). This is different than the mark for copper jacketed bullets, K m G for Kupfermantelgeschoss.

Kuduae, does this sound correct re steel vs copper jackets?

I am hoping for either 9.3x72r or 9.3x74r.

I was initially confused by the 118/35 stamp, thinking it was an odd date stamp (118 days into 1935?) but then read more about gauge markings. Wikipedia has the formula for converting gauge into bore (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_(firearms)) 118/35 translates into 0.340 bore diameter (not groove diameter.)

I am glad to hear this was proofed pre-1912 as the engraving had an Art Nouveau feel to it and that period ended pre WW1.

There is currently a newer pre-WW2 Weisgerber-retailed Merkel double on Guns International. Nicer than the rifle we're discussing. Has been for sale there since 2018. (https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/rifles/merkel-rifles/merkel-model-132-pre-ww2-double-rifle-8-x-57-jr.cfm?gun_id=101787360) Beautiful but $10,000 more than the rifle I just won.

This was an unusually hasty decision for me as I didn't see the listing to the day before it closed. Hopefully I won't regret it.

Regards,
Chris

Edited by CJF (07/02/23 12:36 PM)


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CJF
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: CJF]
      #374359 - 22/02/23 01:40 PM

I picked up the rifle today. Quite nice condition. Action is very smooth. Both triggers have adjustments for pull. Haven't cast chambers but fiddling with a dowel and looking for the depth of the chamber makes me think this is a 9.3x72r. That said, I am surprised at how light weight the rifle is...only 7.5lbs. Definitely nitro proofed.

I'll post a new thread on the doubles sub-forum once I get some of my own pictures taken.


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: CJF]
      #374360 - 22/02/23 02:00 PM

Original smokeless load, not bad. Almost as powerful as the .35 Rem.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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tinker
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Re: Interesting, engraved Ger double rifle fat auction [Re: CJF]
      #374365 - 22/02/23 03:12 PM

Quote:

... Both triggers have adjustments for pull.




Those are "single set triggers"

Simply pull as a normal trigger for a standard weight trigger pull of four or five or whatever pounds

Push either one *forward* and you have set the trigger for a pull of a few or more *ounces* instead of pounds

That's a very distinctive feature

Those little screws finely adjust the let-off of those triggers
Careful with them, and careful with setting the final let-off weight

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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