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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Forum Photos & Archive
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casper50
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Loc: Alaska
Help identify Mauser model please
      #371937 - 02/12/22 05:41 PM

Just bought this at an auction and was wondering if it's a commercial Mauser or gunsmith customized. All help appreciated.

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93x64mm
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #371939 - 02/12/22 06:28 PM

Very nice sporter Casper - sorry Can't help!
Kaudae or Lancaster will chime in - best if you have proof marks etc available for them if possible

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lancaster
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: 93x64mm]
      #371940 - 02/12/22 08:54 PM

very, very likely made in Suhl /Zella Mehlis
if before the great war with a mauser civil action or maybe with a "black" action - stolen somewhere

if post war made with a surplus action from WW 1 production

proof marks will tell

if the rifle is a 8x57 you will likely find out it have the "I" or .318 diameter barrel for the 8x57I.

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kuduae
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: lancaster]
      #371948 - 03/12/22 02:21 AM

I agree with lancaster. For closer identification and dating, please take the rifle apart and post photos of all markings and numbers on underside of barrel and receiver.

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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
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Loc: Alaska
Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: kuduae]
      #371963 - 03/12/22 05:41 AM

Have to get it in hand first. It is a 9x57mm

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372000 - 04/12/22 03:29 AM

Great caliber!

Curl

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YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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lancaster
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372064 - 06/12/22 06:25 AM

Quote:

Just bought this at an auction and was wondering if it's a commercial Mauser or gunsmith customized. All help appreciated.







compare it with this Rasch/Braunschweig pre war mauser I had in the mails today





https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/G.-L.-RASCH-OF-BRAUNSCHWEIG,-GERMANY-PRE-WAR-1442-c-B184CE698C

they were all made by gunmaker in Suhl/Zella Mehlis - youcan smell it

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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themauserkid
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Reged: 21/06/15
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Loc: Texas
Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: lancaster]
      #372299 - 14/12/22 01:23 PM

My best guess from the combination of features on it, is that there is a good chance you bought yourself a 1920’s to early 30’s Simson Mauser. Some of the features on it, while all quite “Suhl” appear specifically in combination on Simsons. So many makers look nearly identical, but some also trend in subtle design variations that you can pick up on, so you’ll have to report back once you find out!

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Huvius
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: CptCurl]
      #372313 - 15/12/22 02:21 AM

Quote:

Great caliber!

Curl



Agree!
I have one that I hope to be working up loads for soon - after the holidays.

We need a 9X57 support group here.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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casper50
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: Huvius]
      #372472 - 20/12/22 07:21 AM

Here's all the marks on the bottom

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casper50
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372473 - 20/12/22 07:24 AM

Here's all the proof marks.

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themauserkid
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372477 - 20/12/22 09:24 AM

Need to see more details/external markings and the serial range might help too.

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casper50
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: themauserkid]
      #372478 - 20/12/22 09:59 AM















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themauserkid
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372479 - 20/12/22 10:37 AM

Not a named Simson, but I still highly suspect it is made by them, for the retailer named on it. The receiver appears to be Simson made, possibly a leftover from the war, the circle/2 marking appears on their wartime production starting about 1917 as far as I can tell. By the mid 20’s proof dates start becoming common, so I suspect it was produced roughly in the 1919-1924 range.

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casper50
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: themauserkid]
      #372480 - 20/12/22 10:38 AM

Thank you themauserkid.

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casper50
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372483 - 20/12/22 08:57 PM

What do the two letters after the serial number mean?

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themauserkid
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372489 - 21/12/22 01:49 AM

That serial is odd and looks to have been applied after the fact?? Not sure quite what to make of that, added by the retailer is my best guess. It could be applied from the retailer Albrecht Kind of Hunstig, that might fit, but that’s just a guess.

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kuduae
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: casper50]
      #372491 - 21/12/22 02:25 AM

I agree with themauserkid as to the dating of the rifle to the early 1920s. It is certainly built on a reworked Gewehr 98 large ring Mauser action left over from the 1915 – 17 “decentralised” Gew 98 infantry rifle production in Suhl. It was retailed by BRAUN & MÜNZEL, Bahnhofstr., Coblenz. As the spelling of Coblenz was changed to Koblenz in 1926, the rifle was most likely sold before. A forgotten quirk of history: Post-WW1 Coblenz was occupied by the US Army until 1922. So the rifle may have been bought by a GI for a few -precious in Germany then- US$$. I know about a drilling sold by B&M too at the same time. The now American owner did not believe the family tale that his grandfather, a WW1 veteran, brought it as a souvenir from Germany, as the Americans did not “liberate” guns then. So this rifle too may have been bought new in Germany and brought to he USA in the 1920s. A further hint: The rifle retains it's original 1920s scope, usually lost on guns liberated post-WW2.
I see no hint to Simson or any other “name” Suhl gunmaker in the photos. Instead, I take the AH behind the serial number as the mark of Albert Heym, Rifle Factory, Hohe Roeder 7, Suhl, one of the many Heyms in the guntrade and a gunmaker to the trade. (Not to be confused with F.W. Heym, the namesake still in business)
The rifle was proofed in Suhl for use of the old pre-WW1 9x57 brush load, a 280 gr steel jacket bullet at 1916 fps.

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themauserkid
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: kuduae]
      #372492 - 21/12/22 03:13 AM

Thanks for the info Axel. The receiver appears to be a Simson at the very least, their wartime production includes the internal factory mark (the circle 2 on the bottom of the receiver ring) it could be that another maker simply used this receiver to assemble the rifle, tough to say though.

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kuduae
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: themauserkid]
      #372493 - 21/12/22 05:31 AM

Quote:

The receiver appears to be a Simson at the very least, their wartime production includes the internal factory mark (the circle 2 on the bottom of the receiver


This mark is found on Simson marked Gew.98 rifles, but not exclusively. Neither Simson nor any other of the Suhl gunmaker involved, Sauer, Haenel or Schilling, made a single receiver! The special machines simply were not available in Suhl. All Suhl gunmakers had to use machined receivers supplied by the state arsenals Spandau, Erfurt and Danzig. Receivers were also supplied to them by Siemens & Halske, Berlin, and H.Pieper, Liege, Belgium. (I suspect Pieper was merely a straw man for FN. Officially FN did not collaborate with the occupying Germans, but the stock majority of FN was held by German DWM and Pieper pre-WW1) The government arsenal Spandau alone had to make 1000 receivers per day to supply the Suhl guntrade. All the Suhl gunmakers subcontracted parts making and swapped parts. So most of the Suhl guntrade was involved in making Gew.98 rifles. Read Dr. Dieter Storz’ book “Rifle & Carbine 98. M 98 Firearms of the German Army 1898 to 1918.” (about 460 pages) Storz, of the Bavarian Army Museum, is the foremost historian of military arms and production up to WW1.

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themauserkid
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Re: Help identify Mauser model please [Re: kuduae]
      #372498 - 21/12/22 08:50 AM

My mistake, I believed it was unique to Simson finished rifles. Storz’s books are excellent, thanks for the info.

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