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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

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cable
.224 member

Reged: 01/12/06
Posts: 5
Loc: alaska United States

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361542 - 05/02/22 03:31 PM

i have a german 28 ga combo that has a 5.6x35R rifle barrel [ not quite the same as 22 hornet ] very light andd elegant little gun:

not sure what it is particularly good for [ especially here in alaska ] but it is a neat little toy !

my first attempted handload for the rife shoots dead on at 25 yds with center hold.

Edited by NitroX (05/02/22 07:52 PM)

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26499
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361545 - 05/02/22 03:46 PM

That's nice. I had to copy paste the urls to a different window to see. Nice engraving, too.
.22 Hornet, I assume.

Looks like a good grouse/tarmigan gun, but a little light to be the only thing carried, perhaps?

Lucky for you, you can pack a decent handgun.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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260rem
.375 member

Reged: 16/04/06
Posts: 757
Loc: NSW Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: DarylS]
#361548 - 05/02/22 03:56 PM

Same, definitely a nice gun and something I'd be happy to own. I would guess in Alaska it would be great for squirrels, birds ect and even beaver.
It would make an ideal gun for calling in foxes too.

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Igorrock
.400 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1641
Loc: Finland

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: 260rem]
#361575 - 06/02/22 06:51 AM

5,6x35R has been called in Europe as .22 Vierling, not Hornet. This caliber bases to old black powder .22 WCF and it´s bullet caliber is a tad smaller than Hornets.

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3986
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: Igorrock]
#361577 - 06/02/22 07:23 AM

Lovely little shooter Cable!
Have you tried the 28g in it yet?

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260rem
.375 member

Reged: 16/04/06
Posts: 757
Loc: NSW Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: Igorrock]
#361580 - 06/02/22 10:31 AM

Quote:

5,6x35R has been called in Europe as .22 Vierling, not Hornet. This caliber bases to old black powder .22 WCF and it´s bullet caliber is a tad smaller than Hornets.

Would it then be like the original 22 hornet with a 223 diameter bullet not a 224 one?
But the 5.6x35R was otherwise another name for the hornet used in Europe from everything I've read.
But they did come in both bullet sizes, I have both size dies here actually.

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26499
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: 260rem]
#361585 - 06/02/22 12:05 PM

The original .22 WCF used a .228" cast or swaged bullet with it's black powder charge.

The original .22 Hornet used a .223" groove diameter barrel and bullet.

Hornady and Speer both make .223" and .224" bullets for Hornets.

The original rate of twist was 1-16", same with the first .220 Swifts all the same rate of twist as the standard .22 Long Rifle rim fire.

CZ .22 Hornet's also have or had 1-16" twists. Mine had a .224" throat tightening to .223" at the muzzle.
It and the my second CZ Hornet were both very accurate with both .223" and .224" bullets, it didn't care.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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260rem
.375 member

Reged: 16/04/06
Posts: 757
Loc: NSW Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: DarylS]
#361592 - 06/02/22 04:03 PM

My K95 is also a 1:16 twist which is my only downside to it, I really wish it had a, 1:14 or even 1:12 so I could shoot 55gn pills in it.
But because 22 hornets were originally made from 22lr rifes that pesky 1:16 became the standard twist in hornets.
But luckily a few gun makers use a faster twist in them.

That 1:16 caused me some real headaches trying to develop a subsonic squib load for shooting around camp with, if I could have used heavier 55gn bullets it would have been much easier.
I was actually thinking about giving black powder a go as a mouse fart load with a 40gn HP.

I know I can just take a 22 away which is what I usually do, but it's nice just to have to take a 2nd scope away and still be able to plink around camp.

--------------------
One shot is all you need.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39237
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361597 - 06/02/22 08:10 PM

Quote:

i have a german 28 ga combo that has a 5.6x35R rifle barrel [ not quite the same as 22 hornet ] very light andd elegant little gun:

not sure what it is particularly good for [ especially here in alaska ] but it is a neat little toy !

my first attempted handload for the rife shoots dead on at 25 yds with center hold.

Unusual, to me at least, full wood combination. Quite elegant. Please post more pictures!

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8725
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: NitroX]
#361598 - 06/02/22 08:46 PM

the 5,6x35R Vierling was a german/austrian development from the 22WCF with a nitro load and jacketed bullet. it predate the hornet by maybe 40 years. you get the vierling in a hornet chamber but not reverse.
vierling barrels are tighter but I have heard "vierling barrels rechambered for the hornet shoot very fine because of the oversized bullet".

I would load vierling cartridges.

interesting pic

22 WCH
5,6 Francotte
5,6x35R Vierling
22 Hornet

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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260rem
.375 member

Reged: 16/04/06
Posts: 757
Loc: NSW Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: lancaster]
#361604 - 06/02/22 11:21 PM

That is interesting, I can honestly say I can't see the difference between the two.
I'm sure if I picked up a verling I'd stick it in my hornet without a 2nd thought.

--------------------
One shot is all you need.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39237
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: 260rem]
#361607 - 07/02/22 01:10 AM

Quote:

That is interesting, I can honestly say I can't see the difference between the two.
I'm sure if I picked up a verling I'd stick it in my hornet without a 2nd thought.

Shoulder looks slightly different?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8725
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: NitroX]
#361614 - 07/02/22 02:43 AM

ok, you want it, you got it

https://bobp.cip-bobp.org/en/tdcc_public?page=4&cartridge_type_id=2

I think you had to grind of a 22 hornet die to get the should deeper for the 5,6 Vierling

max. bullet diameter for the vierling is .2216", a common .223 bullet will work or not

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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Marrakai
.416 member

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361625 - 07/02/22 10:11 AM

Nice looking firearm, cable.
Very interesting 'teutonic' style!
...but I do like the full-wood stock.
Quite unusual on a combo I suspect.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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cable
.224 member

Reged: 01/12/06
Posts: 5
Loc: alaska United States

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: Marrakai]
#361926 - 13/02/22 11:16 AM

the 22 hornet wont chamber, and the rim is too thick. but i used 22 wcf brass [ formed] that i get from buffalo arms. the bore is about .222 ad graf and sons had .222 bullets [ if think they are from Prvi Partizan ] and they shoot dead center and all in one hole at 25 yds.

the 28 gauge is 2.5" chamber,full choke of course, and i found some shells [ i believe RST had them ] and it patterns well with the pattern centered at point of aim.

i found this little gun in an auction [ on proxibid ] and couldnet resist it....like a lot of my accumulation [ cant call it a collection, that implies a pattern or plan ] i just found it very appealing. doesnt even weigh 5 lbs.

hopefully i will take it out to the remote mine and at least shoot grouse or ptarmigan.

i am in montana right now, when i get back to alaska, i will take some more pictures.

--------------------
cable

Edited by cable (13/02/22 11:18 AM)

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cable
.224 member

Reged: 01/12/06
Posts: 5
Loc: alaska United States

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361927 - 13/02/22 11:29 AM

did find a few more pictures:

i believe the gun dates to 1925

the 'sight rail' on top, should allow a removal scope, but it tapers a bit from front to rear so haven yet found a mount that would work [ 74 year old eyes would appreciate a small scope ]

the condition of this gun suggests it has had very little use ever. bores are perfect.

--------------------
cable

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26499
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361930 - 13/02/22 11:53 AM

Quote:

the 22 hornet wont chamber, and the rim is too thick. but i used 22 wcf brass [ formed] that i get from buffalo arms. the bore is about .222 ad graf and sons had .222 bullets [ if think they are from Prvi Partizan ] and they shoot dead center and all in one hole at 25 yds.

the 28 gauge is 2.5" chamber,full choke of course, and i found some shells [ i believe RST had them ] and it patterns well with the pattern centered at point of aim.

i found this little gun in an auction [ on proxibid ] and couldnet resist it....like a lot of my accumulation [ cant call it a collection, that implies a pattern or plan ] i just found it very appealing. doesnt even weigh 5 lbs.

hopefully i will take it out to the remote mine and at least shoot grouse or ptarmigan.

i am in montana right now, when i get back to Alaska, i will take some more pictures.

I think you mean the groove diameter is .222", not the bore.
If a .223" bullet will fit in a fired case, then you can also use .223" bullets - by Speer and Hornady.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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cable
.224 member

Reged: 01/12/06
Posts: 5
Loc: alaska United States

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: DarylS]
#361932 - 13/02/22 12:22 PM

yes, you are right... meant to say groove diameter. i suspect 223 would work fine, though some folks on double gun forum claim that they have had best results with the 222 and grafs had a sale on them so i got a large supply [ ordered twice by accident. should do me for my life time !! ]

--------------------
cable

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26499
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#361937 - 13/02/22 01:11 PM

Sounds good. Was thinking that the .223 would work, as my CZ's shot well with both .223" and .224" bullets - identically, actually.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Conor_90
.224 member

Reged: 12/01/18
Posts: 45
Loc: Canada

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: cable]
#374028 - 11/02/23 06:13 AM

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-f...un_id=102173758

Found one; if only it was in a big game calibre

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26499
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: Conor_90]
#374034 - 11/02/23 10:40 AM

Hornady makes 45gr. .223" - maybe 40gr. as well.
Seems to me, Speer makes or made a 35gr. or 33gr. in .222" for the .22 Jet.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8725
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: 28 Gauge Combo Guns [Re: Conor_90]
#374040 - 11/02/23 11:03 PM

Quote:

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-f...un_id=102173758

Found one; if only it was in a big game calibre

this would be hard, such little combination were build for ligth weight with a small shotgun caliber and similar small rifle caliber. they were taken when being in the hunting ground out of the season to react on smaller pest or when hunting only on small game.
the closed season is the "Schonzeit" so this was called sometimes "Schonzeitgewehr" - closed season gun.

here is a newer typical example, voere combination gun in .410 3" and 22 hornet
https://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=19017169

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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