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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> 'Classic' Firearms Photos & Archive

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine
#355856 - 09/08/21 03:02 AM

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-f...un_id=101705620

System v.Mannlicher, never see it before
the Berlin address must be the seller

shots a short 9,3 mm cartridge, think I see something like this ( 9,3x50??)in Fuhrmanns collection

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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Marrakai
.416 member

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: lancaster]
#355861 - 09/08/21 09:01 AM

Wow, very interesting thing!
First time for me too.

Will you save the stock? Marvelous classic lines.

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
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www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 326
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: Marrakai]
#355891 - 09/08/21 08:23 PM

9,3x38, we discussed this a while ago.
There were 3 or 4 different different rifles floating around the net, all with the same action but different stocks.
This one, with the splintered forend was one of them. Must be advertised for years now!

All the best, fuhrmann

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93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3975
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#355892 - 09/08/21 10:25 PM

Boy you come up with some rare birds Lancaster!
Amazing piece, would be interesting to see it in action!

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#355901 - 10/08/21 04:06 AM

Quote:

9,3x38, we discussed this a while ago.
There were 3 or 4 different different rifles floating around the net, all with the same action but different stocks.
This one, with the splintered forend was one of them. Must be advertised for years now!

All the best, fuhrmann

no wonder, it did not sell for 12500$ till now
it must go to an excellent gunsmith for complete and correct restoration before, imho

did you show me the pics then? can't remember. beside of the system v. mannlicher engraving I would say its made in Suhl.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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Igorrock
.400 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1636
Loc: Finland

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: lancaster]
#355902 - 10/08/21 04:36 AM

If I understand correct, this rifle is a special item. The text on actions side says that it has been fabricated for military fair in Berlin.

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http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: Igorrock]
#355911 - 10/08/21 02:00 PM

"August Lok Sons Stock Company for Military Equipment Berlin"

I would say it was the seller then.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 326
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: lancaster]
#355914 - 10/08/21 03:25 PM

Lars, this is August Loh Söhne.
Our last discussion about this was about a year ago.
These guns were obviously made / marketed after Mannlichers death in 1904.
Somebody, you or Axel suggested that Haenel would be a candidate for production.

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JHeath
.224 member

Reged: 26/07/21
Posts: 30
Loc: British Columbia and Washingto...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#356029 - 14/08/21 03:53 AM

The magazine looks modified for a different caliber. It looks like someone used a grinder to open up the cartridge slots.

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: JHeath]
#356051 - 14/08/21 04:24 PM

yes, it looks so
not a good idea to mess around with a schönauer magazine. will not help to make it reliable.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#356052 - 14/08/21 04:41 PM

Quote:

Lars, this is August Loh Söhne.
Our last discussion about this was about a year ago.
These guns were obviously made / marketed after Mannlichers death in 1904.
Somebody, you or Axel suggested that Haenel would be a candidate for production.

I would say August Loh was a wholesaler because of the "Zu beziehen durch alle größeren Waffenhandlungen" to obtain by all bigger gun shops.
hard to say with the Mannlicher self loading carbine if this was the Dreyse or the OEWG Steyr made gun. funny they wrote "Guter Ersatz für Doppelbüchsen" good replacement for double rifles if this use the 7,63 Mannlicher which is the same like 7,63 Borchardt with a higher muzzle velocity but less than 7,63 mm Mauser. there was also a 7,63 x33 for the Mannlicher carbine maybe similar to the later 30 carbine but also not a real double rifle cartridge.

the haenel roth self loader was also for me the first thing that came to mind http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=319418&an=0&page=1#Post319418

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 326
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: lancaster]
#356091 - 16/08/21 01:10 AM

See the cartridge on the right.
The bullet appears to be the flat-nosed TESCO bullet as used e.g. for the 9,3x72R.
Headstamp is "R.W.S. / N"
Edit: case head dimensions same as 6,5x54 M-S

Edited by fuhrmann (16/08/21 02:28 PM)

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JHeath
.224 member

Reged: 26/07/21
Posts: 30
Loc: British Columbia and Washingto...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#356109 - 17/08/21 04:11 AM

Wow, the 9.3 x 38 in that rifle is like a proto intermediate caliber for a proto assault rifle. Like the 7.92x33.

I'm still curious about the grinding on the magazine. I would make a cerrosafe chamber casting on this rifle to see if the chamber matches the magazine.

Edited by JHeath (17/08/21 04:13 AM)

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 326
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: JHeath]
#356127 - 17/08/21 06:17 PM

About a year ago I was contacted by a gentleman who owned a very similar rifle.
He had done a chamber cast and dimensions matched very well.

Yes, this cartridge predates all the short cartridges for assault rifles.#
But the bullet clearly was intended for hunting.
Now I found this rather new Russian cartridge
https://modernfirearms.net/en/cartridge/366-tkm-2/
Not clear to me if it uses .366 or .375 bullets.
But otherwise a full circle back to where it started

Here is a link to an earlier thread in the Nitro Express forum. So we discussed this gun serial no. 1 already in 2019, and it was on GunsInternational back then.
http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=326646&an=0&page=4#Post326646

In this discussion a link to a third rifle came up
https://vintagesemiautorifle.proboards.c...nauer-automatic

Interesting situation, I know of 3 rifles but only one cartridge.

fuhrmann

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8716
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Mannlicher 1905 Sporting Carbine [Re: fuhrmann]
#356133 - 18/08/21 05:05 AM

seems to be I becoming older, forget it completely

remarkable:

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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