PatagonHunter
.333 member
Reged: 20/01/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Bariloche, Patagonia Argentina
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Hello,
A few days ago I got some old 25 bullet boxes of 9,3 mm 258 gr H-Mantel. By the way, RWS always made only one weight H-Mantel in the calibers they offered this bullet.
I have used, a lot, the 7 mm H-Mantel version, 173 gr, with almost unmatched performance in wild boars and Red Deer from 7x57 and 7x64 rifles.
Have any of you used this 258 9,3 mm H-Mantel? Y don´t think it would differ in performance in the same, or bigger, game animals. Will try them in the 9,3x62 the next coming Red Deer rutting season!
PH
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lancaster
.470 member
Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 9534
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
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you will use them exactly what they were made for.
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Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
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bringing civilisation to the barbarians
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93x64mm
.416 member
Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4427
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
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PH, I read an article many years ago of these being used in a 8mm Remington Magnum on big boars.
They certainly did a good job on them by the way & they weren't small porkers either!
Very good design & lethal - especially deer from memory of the old RWS cartridge charts
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PatagonHunter
.333 member
Reged: 20/01/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Bariloche, Patagonia Argentina
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Thank you! I hope to be able to test them next month.
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NitroX
.700 member
Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 40680
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
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The Nosler Partitions were based on the older RWS H-Mantel design with a solid cross section shank in the partition. I believe the H Mantel has the middle of the cross section of the H with a gap? And a hollower tip with the cap on top.
I haven't used them. Would if they were still available and price competitive.
I would have any problem in a 9.3 mm using them on all deer, including red, sambar, elk and moose, big boars, even bears. Probably not buffalo, but they probably would work reasonably well.
I imagine the front half will either mushroom or blow off and the rear shank penetration.
I would like to see the results when you use them, and hopefully see mushroomed bullets.
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John aka NitroX
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Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"
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eagle27
.400 member
Reged: 24/01/09
Posts: 1215
Loc: Rolleston, Christchurch, New Z...
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I had a few of the 7mm copper capped and lead nosed H-Mantle bullets, didn't get to try them so gave them away to a colleague who had made up a 7x57 stalker rifle and used heavier bullets. Had sectioned one of the copper caped bullets years ago just to see what they were like inside.
The H-Mantle construction is more like a Hornady interlock or Remington corelokt and not a Nosler partition where the base essentially becomes a solid once the nose portion has sloughed off.
I imagine the H-Mantle would continue with some expansion past the crimped jacket if hitting at a higher velocity in solid muscle or bone. The early H-Mantles such as that in the image below had a homogenous lead core whereas the later H-Mantles had a dual core, possible done to stop expansion past the jacket crimp.
Pre-80's 173gr 7mm H-Mantle
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HeymSR20
.300 member
Reged: 23/11/11
Posts: 249
Loc: Scotland
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German friends use H-mantles in 9.3x62 or 74r and they work just like the 173 h-mantles do in 7mm, except just a bit bigger with a bit more energy. They absolutely flatten big wild boar, and they are used they both penetrate very well and then cause big damage to all the internal heart and lungs. The heart and lungs look they have been liquidised. They like them on driven hunts because they kill very quickly, and a boar is not going very far even if shot placement is not perfect.
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93mouse
.375 member
Reged: 17/08/07
Posts: 745
Loc: Slovenia
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Quote:
I imagine the front half will either mushroom or blow off and the rear shank penetration.
I would like to see the results when you use them, and hopefully see mushroomed bullets.
Front part disintegrates, the rest is only cylinder shaped - but good luck in finding one - usually they exit without exemption.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27723
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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The jacket below the "crimp" is quite a bit thicker (2X), so the action would be similar to the Partitions, most likely.
The sharp shoulder cuts a beautiful hole in paper & possibly hide as well, so bleeding out the entrance would be better than a slit or smaller hole.
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Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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PatagonHunter
.333 member
Reged: 20/01/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Bariloche, Patagonia Argentina
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Hello,
As I said, I use the 7 mm H-Mantel, 173 grs, since 1980. Back then, just before to move from Córdoba to Bariloche, Northern Patagonia, I bought 6 boxes of ten cartridges RWS with these bullets. They were imported here in the early 70´s. They are the last version, better, the pre-last version of the H-Mantel: semi round nose but steel jacket. The last version is the gilding metal jacket. In the early 80´s the same importer brought an extensive line of RWS bullets, still in the cilindrical 25 bullets boxes. So I bought some 7mm 173 H-Mantel and 162 Cone point or KS (Kegelspitz). A few years ago I found 2 boxes of ten 7 mm 173 H-Mantel cartridges of the old, pointed, style, still Berdan primed. So, I can assure this earliest post II War version end at around 1970.
In those years my only big game rifle was the DWM 1893 7x57 Original Sportin rifle from my great grand father. Still in my possession. And my main hunting cartrige-bullet were that RWS ones.
As 93mouse said, I NEVER found or recovered the rear part of that 7mm H-Mantel. NEVER. Period. The exit hole was, always, a cilindrical one well defined.
But until today I couldn´t find other bullet in the 7x57, and 7x64 as well, with better record of one shot instant kill with a well placed shot than the H-Mantel. I, friends using my rifles and sons for their first big game hunts. Used them in wild boars and big Red Deer. I didn´t use the older pointed version to hunt. Spend only 2 rounds of them to check velocity. The same as the newer ones, around 2500 f/s in my rifles with 60 cm barrel. By the way, I loaded the bullets at 2600 f/s and 2700 f/s in the 7x57 and the 7x64 rifles. Both with R22 powder.
Here are pictures of that older and newer green ten cartridges boxes.
And one of my sons, 2011, with his very strange Red Deer shot with that 7mm H-Mantel reload.
PH
[url=https://postimg.cc/CdSfPyDY]
[/url]
Edited by PatagonHunter (02/03/21 12:41 PM)
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27723
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Good post. Strange "rack" indeed.
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Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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93mouse
.375 member
Reged: 17/08/07
Posts: 745
Loc: Slovenia
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Eish PatagonHunter that is one top trophy. I am not aware of your local trophy shapes and sizes, however a trophy like that in my parts would probably mean a very old stag - probably 15 years old or even more.
Any Idea on how old it was?
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PatagonHunter
.333 member
Reged: 20/01/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Bariloche, Patagonia Argentina
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Hello 93mouse,
I did not keep the lower jaw but I remember this animal was not too old. At first sight I thought the same but after a closer look it was evident the deer was of a middle age. Had one of the hoof deformed but was in very good nutritional condition. And with a good harem...!
The hoof picture:
Another thing, here in Bariloche there is a very well known and respected Slovenian community. Most of their members arrived just before and after the II War. I have many Slovenian friends here. They are in close contact with their relatives in Slovenia. Good people!
PH
Edited by PatagonHunter (03/03/21 12:29 AM)
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93mouse
.375 member
Reged: 17/08/07
Posts: 745
Loc: Slovenia
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We are off topic but great stuff PH - I filmed a clip of stag antlers growth from 8th - 15th year and at the ned it gets similar to yours:
https://youtu.be/WN-womtWZEM
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PatagonHunter
.333 member
Reged: 20/01/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Bariloche, Patagonia Argentina
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Hello 93mouse,
Yes, very similar. Great heads, indeed!
Best Regards
PH
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