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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles

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NitroXAdministrator
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This is a new one ....
      #341222 - 19/05/20 07:32 PM

From the NitroExpress.Group on facebook:

Sanjyot Bhandari Does it fire the same belted 375h&h cartridge

Reply
Chandrakant Deshmukh
Chandrakant Deshmukh Sanjyot Bhandari it can fire a belted rimless as well as flanged cartridge thats the beauty of my rifle. Its dead on 100 yeards with 270 grs bullet

***

CD posted several photos of his sidelock Heym double rifle in .375. One set of barrels in the photos.

He appears to be claiming he can shoot both magnum belted catridges AND flaned/rimmed cartridges in the same rifle .... only way I could think is one barrel for each, crazy ...

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John aka NitroX

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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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MikeRowe
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341239 - 20/05/20 08:21 AM

John, it may be possible to cut a seat for a rim, and still leave enough of a belt seat to headspace the rimless version, all the other cartridge dimensions being equal, of course. The rim is fairly thin.

I'm not real familiar with the 375 - it's a bit modern for me!


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Postman
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: MikeRowe]
      #341240 - 20/05/20 08:43 AM

I suppose you can custom order all manner of configurations. I would not be so sure you should machine a chamber to handle a rim and belted .375.... to me it would seem that there may not be enough chamber wall support for the flanged cartridge head if one machines a countersink to accommodate the belt. I suppose that one might make the extractor/ejector work..... one would necessitate both a pawl for the rimless cartridge and an extractor for the rimmed version.

The easiest is to just chamber one barrel for one, and the other barrel for the other. I went with the flanged for each barrel. I dont want or need to carry two types of ammo for a double. Kinda defeats the purpose....

However, IF the trickery of accommodating both cartridges in BOTH tubes is both possible and reliable, that might be interesting. The pawl may add unwanted drag and friction to the side of the flanged cartridge and make extraction/ejection less positive, and the reliability of positive ejection using only pawls on a rimless cartridge have been discussed to death with no clear answer, but many lean towards distrust of teeny tiny pawls in dusty environments.

Edited by Postman (20/05/20 08:57 AM)


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Waidmannsheil
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: Postman]
      #341241 - 20/05/20 11:28 AM

It should also be remembered that the flanged and belted cases are different lengths and have shoulders in different positions.

Matt.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: Waidmannsheil]
      #341245 - 20/05/20 01:37 PM

He claims the rifle is a 1936 Heym. It looks like a sidelock or sideplates at least.

He is admament that he can load both magnum rimless belted cartridges and also flanged cartridges.

Says he is going to load up a video showing both types of cartridges being used.

I was thinking maybe not true, but will see about the video. Maybe the rifle just has not blown up yet?

I can't see how two quite different cartridge shapes can be used in the same chambers? Unless the chambers have been altered for both somehow, and the flanged cartridge is longer and thinner and extremely fire forms into a wider belted cartridge chamber??? Or vice versa or ???

I will copy the photos and post them here.

I will send jaguar hunter an email and see if he has any clues on this? Before the current ownership time, but if it was ever done, maybe they have heard of it?

BTW if ‎Chandrakant Deshmukh is on NE forums already, pipe in and say hello and tell us about it.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


Edited by NitroX (20/05/20 02:18 PM)


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3DogMike
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341248 - 20/05/20 02:19 PM

He's in India? Firearms ownership and use is awfully regulated there.....hard to imagine a bloke having the official permission to bang away with such a combo.

Has got to be either total BS, or there may be a 2nd set of barrels and an understandable language/cultural divide?

- Mike

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: 3DogMike]
      #341275 - 21/05/20 07:14 PM

Have to have a look again to see where he is located. To make sure.

Also posted photos of a vintage Rigby rifle he owns. He seems to be a real owner, or at the very least, is handling the Rigby in photos.

Will have another look. See if he has answered my queries.

Definitely not a language issue.

I am more than interested of he is as claims shooting flanged rounds in a belted chamber. Or vice versa. Seems totally impossible.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341276 - 21/05/20 07:33 PM

Quote:

Chandrakant Deshmukh John Hahn nowadays i only use belted rimless as you correctly pointed out as flanged cartridges hang fire




--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341277 - 21/05/20 07:39 PM

Quote:

John Hahn With no offence meant to the poster Chandrakant Deshmukh.

Please note, I consider it extremely dangerous to try to shoot both a .375 Flanged and .375 H&H Mag cartridges in the same rifle in the same chambers. The cartridge might be of similar ballistics, but are of considerable different shape.

Please do not do it. If you do it, it is at your own risk.

And definitely no liability accepted by NitroExpress.com.

I don't even understand how it can be done, in different chambers and with different extractors. If the different cartridges were fired in the same cambers, the user is lucky not have had an exploded chamber.

It would be remiss of me not to make this statement.




--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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500Boswell
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341286 - 22/05/20 03:46 PM

There was alot of dodgy gunsmithing went on in India ,Peter Davern had one double rifle from India he worked on ,that had three or four sleeves in the chamber which kept coming loose ,from an effort to make the rifle shoot a more commonly available round in India ,he eventually fixed it in the end ,by removing them all and installing a new one, properly fitted

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Rockdoc
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: 500Boswell]
      #341295 - 23/05/20 10:54 AM

Flanged is longer.....

No way Id do that in mine!


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Jaguarhunter
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: Rockdoc]
      #341665 - 03/06/20 09:18 PM

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=...eater&ifg=1

To "judge" the double in an 100% correct way, I need better pictures, included the stamps.

Heym build severall doubles (boxlock and sidelocks) for India in ca. 1915 - 1940.
There are some, I have some in my archive.

And:
Please make sure, that you use only the correct amo for that rifle.
.375 HH vs. the flanged Version is not the same.
Maybe you can fire them both, maybe it "works" one or two times, but it can be very dangerous.
Please dont do it.


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: Jaguarhunter]
      #341677 - 04/06/20 02:12 AM

Quote:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=...eater&ifg=1

To "judge" the double in an 100% correct way, I need better pictures, included the stamps.

Heym build severall doubles (boxlock and sidelocks) for India in ca. 1915 - 1940.
There are some, I have some in my archive.

And:
Please make sure, that you use only the correct amo for that rifle.
.375 HH vs. the flanged Version is not the same.
Maybe you can fire them both, maybe it "works" one or two times, but it can be very dangerous.
Please dont do it.




Thanks F.

I wrote similar. The owner thought it was amusing.

I find it interesting one can even get both types of cartridge to fire in the same chamber? As the msays he did get some "hangfires" ...

This gentlemen does seem to have some nice firearms. I hope proper ammo is used in them all.

I will ask to see if he can supply more detailed photos. It might be good identify just what the rifle is chambered for, so he can maybe use the right ammo! Hopefully magnum belted cartridges as they would be easier for him to source as loaded ammo. And what I think he is now using.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Jaguarhunter
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Re: This is a new one .... [Re: NitroX]
      #341694 - 04/06/20 08:42 AM

I find it interesting one can even get both types of cartridge to fire in the same chamber?
Yes, it is possible.
Not only in an Heym.
bb


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