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AndrewS
.224 member


Reged: 01/10/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Suffolk, UK
Sights on Model 1910...
      #331513 - 21/08/19 11:30 PM

Hello

I am planning to replace the (modified) front and rear sights on my M1910 with what I believe to be some original sights. Before removing the modified ones, could someone post some pictures of the originals please? The ones fitted at the moment work OK, but they look awful and aren't original (which offends me!).

Many thanks

Andrew


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DonZ
.275 member


Reged: 24/12/12
Posts: 74
Loc: BW
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331585 - 23/08/19 04:48 AM

Send me a PM with a good email address and I'll shoot some photos off for you.

--------------------
Honor never grows old, and honor rejoices the heart of age...


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Louis
.333 member


Reged: 13/05/15
Posts: 378
Loc: France
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: DonZ]
      #331608 - 24/08/19 02:47 AM

Andrew

Model 1910 sights are similar on both my stutzen (1920) and detachable stock (1924) models, and similar to those usually encountered on MS rifles:


Rear sights, one fixed leaf for 100 metres and one foldable for 200 metres:




Front sights:


Hope that this will help.

Louis

--------------------
"Everything that doesn't kill me makes me stronger"


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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: Louis]
      #331624 - 24/08/19 09:21 AM

As stated by Louis, the standard sight for the M1910 was typical of the 'pre war' models of M1903, M1905, M1908, M1910. The front is a tapered bead dovetailed into a ramp, the rear is a folding leaf with one standing, one folding. My M1910 takedown model has the 'wide notch' version (see parts 6a and 7a below) and is marked '300'.

There was an optional 'British style' three leaf folding sight available (standard on the later 'High Velocity' offerings).

Images from 1939 Stoeger catalog:




Details from 'Original Mannlicher Schönauer Rifle Parts', '39 Stoeger:





Ebay listings for originals - very pricey, but good images:
Ebay

Ebay

Ebay

Here are new made MS parts from Deutschland:
Mannlich-Schönauer

In this image from Louis' post, one can see the 'wide notch' sight above (on takedown model) and the standard below (on stutzen):


Front sight, typical:


Note that the sight pictured is 'rebated', or set back about one inch from the muzzle. Some are, some aren't. The sight on my M1910 TD is not.

From 1935 Steyr catalog:


Here is an M1910 with 'British Style', or 'express' sights;




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AndrewS
.224 member


Reged: 01/10/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Suffolk, UK
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #331771 - 29/08/19 03:23 AM

@Louis, @Rothhammer (and @DonZ)

Many thanks for your comments, and all the pictures. I am now sufficiently convinced that the sights I have are correct for my M1910, and I'll get them fitted. I might even post some picturs of the "monstrosities" that the previous owner fitted...

Regards

Andrew


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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331781 - 29/08/19 03:40 PM

Quote:

@Louis, @Rothhammer (and @DonZ)

I might even post some picturs of the "monstrosities" that the previous owner fitted...

Regards

Andrew




Do, indeed. Could you also post photos of the parts you're considering having fitted to the MS?

You'll need to use a photo hosting 'site to post photos to NE. Here's a 'how to' using one that's simple and free of charge: Post photos to NE



--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation


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AndrewS
.224 member


Reged: 01/10/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Suffolk, UK
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #331836 - 02/09/19 10:10 PM

As promised (or maybe that should be threatened!) here are a couple of pictures of the sights currently on my M1910, and what I have to replace the with. The current sights do give a nice sight picture, but...

Sorry the image quality isn't up to Louis' standard, but you get theidea!

[image] [/image]


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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331845 - 03/09/19 06:20 PM

An 'educated guess' here, but your sights appear to be modified originals. The rear seems to be a 'wide notch' original (reference the 1935 Steyr catalog image and Louis' photo) that has had the folding leaf swapped out for a 'narrow notch' version (or similar), and the front appears to be the 'stock' ramp with some sort of large block wedged into it.

Your replacements look proper.

I don't know why this didn't occur to me earlier, but here are some scans of the (presumably original) spare sight that was stored in the grip cap storage compartment of my cased M1910 Takedown. They didn't enlarge well, but I wanted to show detail:



The grip cap storage option:




Incidentally (you may already know this), your MS was made between 1924 - 1938 as evidenced by the 'Made in Austria' stamp. If marked 'Osterr. Waffenfabr. Ges - Steyr' on the side, it's 1924 - 1926. If marked 'Steyr Werke', it dates from 1926 - 1938.



--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation


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AndrewS
.224 member


Reged: 01/10/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Suffolk, UK
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #331852 - 03/09/19 10:18 PM

Thanks for that. My belief is that the previous owner of the rifle (who cared for accuracy above originality) had removed the folding leaf of the original sight and attached (either by welding or epoxy or something) a piece of metal and then filed a square notch in it. The single leaf at the left of my first picture is the original (I think). The front sight was fabricated with a square post to match the slot in the rear sight. As I said, it's actually a good sight picture, but it's not right. I'm glad I have a complete original rear sight though, as if I really can't get on with the correct sights I can always change them back.

My MS is also a Takedown, and has the optional spare sight storage compartment, but needless to say, it was empty!

I looked at the markings on my rifle, and it says 'Osterr. Waffenfabr. Ges - Steyr' on the side, so it was made in 1924 - 1926.

Once the sights are done, sorting out ammunition will be the next challenge. As I'm sure you know, Hornady have discontinued the 270gr RNSP bullet so I'll have to use something else. I've been trying some lighter bullets (220gr and 235gr) which show some promise although I'm not sure how well they feed. Then there's paper-patching soft lead bullets, which sounds interesting?

Andrew


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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331873 - 04/09/19 05:29 PM

Quote:

...My MS is also a Takedown, and has the optional spare sight storage compartment, but needless to say, it was empty!

I looked at the markings on my rifle, and it says 'Osterr. Waffenfabr. Ges - Steyr' on the side, so it was made in 1924 - 1926.

...As I'm sure you know, Hornady have discontinued the 270gr RNSP bullet so I'll have to use something else. ...Andrew




From 1939 Stoeger Catalog (US):




As you've noted, these once common little gems are discontinued and seem to have become nearly extinct over the past decade. Woodleigh makes a 270 grain RN of the proper profile, but pricey. Conversely, however, this properly headstamped and formed new brass from Quality Cartridge is now available and reasonably priced:

Qual - Cart brass: Qual-Cart


Reed's Specialties (Oklahoma, US) makes 9.5X57 from fresh Norma brass (9.3 drawn straight, then formed) and Hornady 3715. I believe he does sell the formed brass alone. Reed's

This (fuzzy) scan is of a Reed's 9.5X57, one of my old handloads (.35 Whelen through RCBS dies with Hornady 3715), DWM 531 (circa 1926), once fired brass from one of my old handloads.


Build handloads to this exact profile and they'll always cycle smoothly through the Schönauer magazine:



To get closer to the date of manufacture, 'take down' your rifle and look for the proof date:

The 411.08 on this M1903 (C 6.5) indicates the 411th firearm proofed at the Vienna proof house in 1908.


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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331875 - 04/09/19 06:17 PM

Quote:

... As I'm sure you know, Hornady have discontinued the 270gr RNSP bullet so I'll have to use something else. I've been trying some lighter bullets (220gr and 235gr) which show some promise although I'm not sure how well they feed. Then there's paper-patching soft lead bullets, which sounds interesting?

Andrew




Here is a previous thread from a most informative and worthwhile 'site. Read through the posts for useful load data: NitroExpress 9.5X57

There's more to be found by scrolling through the prior Mannlicher postings here on NE.


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AndrewS
.224 member


Reged: 01/10/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Suffolk, UK
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #331901 - 05/09/19 06:19 AM

Thanks for that, a wealth of information there.

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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 968
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Sights on Model 1910... [Re: AndrewS]
      #331923 - 05/09/19 06:01 PM

Quote:

Thanks for that, a wealth of information there.




You came to the right place. Spread the word!

I have found this 'site to be an excellent place to find information / debunk myth regarding the Mannlicher Schönauer.



--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation


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