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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 915
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay
      #329232 - 09/06/19 07:15 PM

Rare original accessory: Ebay

As these are seldom seen outside of the rifle, here are the images from the Ebay listing:




The corrosion is unfortunate. These really are a dandy bit of kit. My M1910 Takedown has one.



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JDL
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Reged: 25/12/10
Posts: 129
Loc: Louisiana
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #329234 - 09/06/19 11:30 PM

I have read that these peep sights were only used to sharpen the focus of the barrel sights not as we use aperture sights today. Thoughts?

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tinker
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Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 3854
Loc: Nevada
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: JDL]
      #329250 - 10/06/19 02:02 PM

Quote:

I have read that these peep sights were only used to sharpen the focus of the barrel sights not as we use aperture sights today. Thoughts?




That's how I have always used tang sights.

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 1581
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: tinker]
      #329268 - 11/06/19 06:26 AM

Dandy piece of kit isn't it!!!

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Vladymere
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Reged: 11/08/15
Posts: 153
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: 93x64mm]
      #329273 - 11/06/19 11:53 AM

"I have read that these peep sights were only used to sharpen the focus of the barrel sights not as we use aperture sights today. Thoughts?"

I believe this to be true. They are diopters for sharpening the focus on iron sights.

You can buy diopter devices that stick on your glasses for target/competition shooting. Available at Brownells https://www.brownells.com/shooting-acces...s-prod8767.aspx

Vlad


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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 915
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: 93x64mm]
      #329277 - 11/06/19 03:17 PM

Quote:

Dandy piece of kit isn't it!!!





'Tis, indeed!

Here's one on a 'Mousie', from the 1939 Stoeger Catalog:



It was a $20 'cost option' for Stoeger imported Mausers, only $12 to add one to a Mannlicher Schönauer:



The 'housing' looks a bit different on the Mauser than on the MS version, but otherwise they seem very similar. Does anyone here own one, or has anyone seen one of these on a Mauser?

It seems they are mostly found on the 'takedown' Mannlicher Schönauer models of M1903 through M1924. The one offered for sale clearly shows the 'lug' that the takedown MS action fits into at the breech end:









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Hoot
.224 member


Reged: 25/01/17
Posts: 33
Loc: MN
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #329288 - 11/06/19 10:55 PM

Here's a couple of Mauser pictures.





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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 1581
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Hoot]
      #329299 - 12/06/19 06:16 AM

I wonder is there any elevation adjustment on these? It certainly would make a very nice touch to an older rifle style like those above, anyone guess at what it would cost to make something like that though?

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Vladymere
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Reged: 11/08/15
Posts: 153
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: 93x64mm]
      #329306 - 12/06/19 11:46 AM

I have a Gew.88 based sporting rifle, possibly made by Haenel, and retailed by Eduard Kettner, whom is still in business today that has iron sights and a tang mounted diopter. The diopter pin hole sized viewing hole is elevation adjustable. This aperture is in a sliding piece, apparently held by friction, that can be moved up and down in a dovetailed notch. This dovetail and sliding aperture piece are on the back side of the diopter so they are not visible unless the diopter assembly is up.

When this tang mounted diopter is up and the bolt cycled the bolt pushes the diopter assembly back into place in the stock. It does not pop back up on it's own.

I currently have no photos of this rifle to show you.

Vlad

Edited by Vladymere (12/06/19 11:58 AM)


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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
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Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Hoot]
      #329310 - 12/06/19 03:50 PM

Quote:

Here's a couple of Mauser pictures.








Notice that the sight in these photos does not have the release button along the right hand side as found on the MS 'folding peep sight' and on the Mauser sight shown in the '39 Stoeger.

I'm starting to wonder how many varieties of these existed and who made them?

Here are a couple of images (swiped from the 'net) of a somewhat different folding peep on a 'Mauser Guild Rifle':



This one's on a .360 Express double rifle:



Here's a different one, on a Merkel double rifle:



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Rothhammer1
.375 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 915
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #329313 - 12/06/19 05:30 PM

Sometimes I really like the internet.

From German Hunting Guns, here is an 1891 German patent application (granted) of Peter Oberhammer for an inset, tang mounted, folding peep sight that shows some similarities to (and a lot of differences from) the ones used on the Mannlicher Schönauer:



Other (and differing) examples are shown in the article: Oberhammer

--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation


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Vladymere
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Reged: 11/08/15
Posts: 153
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #329356 - 14/06/19 03:26 AM

The tang mounted diopter sight on the Mauser rifle posted by Rothammer1 (two postings above this one) is very similar to the one on my Gew.88 based sporting rifle. The primary difference is that mine is engraved with the rest of the rifle embellishments.

You can see on the one posted by Rothammer1 that the diopter aperture elevation is adjustable by sliding the strip of metal that the aperture is in up/down in the dove tailed track that it is mounted in.

I believe the diopter mounted on the Mauser rifle in the photograph is one that will be pushed down when cycling the bolt but will not return upright on it's own.

Vlad


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Rothhammer1
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Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 915
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: Original MS M1903 - M1924 pop up tang sight on Ebay [Re: Vladymere]
      #329396 - 15/06/19 09:42 PM

Here are images from the 1912 Westley Richards catalog that show a folding peep sight identical in appearance to those used on the Mannlicher Schönauer:

"...a peep sight, as illustrated, sunk into the grip can be fitted if desired."

The full page:


They also offered their Mauser based sporter as a 'Lightweight .318 Magazine Rifle', available with the 'flip up peep sight', which used a takedown system very similar to that of the pre WW2 MS:


" Flip up Peep Sight on grip, as illustrated on page 103, at an extra charge of £2 2 0."


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