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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mannlicher Discussion forum & Archive
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JDL
.333 member


Reged: 25/12/10
Posts: 252
Loc: Louisiana
I need help with this one
      #318820 - 05/08/18 11:28 PM

Gentlemen, I was offered a very nice rifle made by Otto Bock on what I believe is a Haenel action. It has a half round, half octagon barrel with full length rib. It has what looks to be a Mannlicher action with DST and a large gas shield at the cocking piece. The magazine is of the staggered type that has the release button at the bottom left and the spring and follower is retracted to the floor plate when opened. It has quick detachable mounts for an aluminum tube 4x scope with the German post type reticule. The scope was clear but, I wasn't familiar with the brand. The stock had a small oval cheek rest and a schnabel tipped fore end. Over all, I would rate it at least 95% condition. Now, here is an oddity, the caliber is .25 Remington Rimless!
He also has brass and dies for reloading it. I don't know what I would hunt with it but, it should be a fun little rifle just to shoot. Can anyone help me to know what this little beauty is and it's value? Thanks

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kuduae
.400 member


Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1792
Loc: middle of Germany
Re: I need help with this one [Re: JDL]
      #318821 - 06/08/18 01:00 AM

Yes, your description fits the Haenel Schonzeitbüchse = off season/ varmint rifle model 1909. This model was indeed made in .25 Remington, though Haenel called it 25/35 randlos = rimless. The .25-35 aka 6.5x52R was well known in Germany, while "Remington" was most associated with outmoded blackpowder single shots and cheap plinking actions. DWM up to the 1930s offered both cartrridges with the same loads: 6.5x52R aka .25-35 Win, DWM case number 519, and 6.5x52 aka .25 Rem, case number 519A. Here is a scan from the 1909 Haenel catalog.

Translation:
Page 11, VII Closed season repeating rifles = "closed-season rifle" = Varmint/small game rifles
six shots,for Winchester-cartridges 25/35 rimless.Action and Magazine like

Haenel model 1909 System.
Magazine can be hand filled from top or bottom.
Sch.R.Nr. 1:Sch.R.Nr.1 Repeating stalking rifle system Haenel model 1909. Bolt with gas shield, bolt handle bent down and flat, barrel of modern steel by the Krupp steelworks, rear octagonal and round from foreend tip, integral rib on top, with long silver bead frontsight inserted from the front into the rib, standing rear sight with folding leaf; with good set trigger; sighting plane matted; walnut halfstock with cheekpiece and checkered pistolgrip; sling swivels; all parts case hardened and bolt pickled grey; for Winchester cartridge Cal. 25/35 rimless………….Mark 135.- each.
Length overall 104 cm = 41", weight 2.9 kg = 6.4 pounds.
Sch.R,Nr. 2: Same, but full stock with divided foreend to avoid tension on barrel, horn foreend tip Mk. 145.-
Optional on all rifles: Fold down peepsight , drift adjustable Mk. 7.50, screw adj. Mk. 10.- more
Cartridge magazine in buttstock with hinged lid: simple Mk6.-, better 10.-

These Haenel Schonzeitbüchsen are the rarest of the rare Haenel m 1900 and 1909 rifles. The rifle was merely retailed by Otto Bock. As the scope is light alloy, it was mounted later, post-1935.

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JDL
.333 member


Reged: 25/12/10
Posts: 252
Loc: Louisiana
Re: I need help with this one [Re: kuduae]
      #318828 - 06/08/18 04:05 AM

Thank you Kuduae! I am going tomorrow morning with money in hand and hope to give it a new home.

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kuduae
.400 member


Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1792
Loc: middle of Germany
Re: I need help with this one [Re: JDL]
      #318832 - 06/08/18 05:51 AM

I have encountered just two such Haenel Schonzeitbüchsen until now. One of them was rechambered to 6.5x57 by some idiot post-WW2, the other one had the barrel set back and rechambered to .250-3000 in the USA. There was another .25 Rem rifle by Otto Bock, but on a Mauser 98 K = short action. Another, indirekt hint to the use of the .25 Rem in Germany: somewhere I have a "drawer find", a W-W box of .25 Rem loads, most American, but 4 or 5 by DWM. The .25-35 Win aka 6.5x52R was a popular varmint/ small game, up to roebuck number here in Germany before WW2. The .25 Rem aka 6.5x52 found the same use, but such specialised bolt action rifles were real odd.
If you can take the rifle home, please post photos of the rifle and scope. Maybe I can tell you something about the make and age of the scope too.

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JDL
.333 member


Reged: 25/12/10
Posts: 252
Loc: Louisiana
Re: I need help with this one [Re: kuduae]
      #318835 - 06/08/18 09:04 AM

I am definitely looking forward to being able to post pics of it later this week!

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Rothhammer1
.400 member


Reged: 06/01/17
Posts: 1826
Loc: The Redwoods of California
Re: I need help with this one [Re: kuduae]
      #318842 - 06/08/18 05:15 PM

Quote:

The .25-35 aka 6.5x52R was well known in Germany, while "Remington" was most associated with outmoded blackpowder single shots and cheap plinking actions. DWM up to the 1930s offered both cartrridges with the same loads: 6.5x52R aka .25-35 Win, DWM case number 519, and 6.5x52 aka .25 Rem, case number 519A. ed later, post-1935.



Aus dem katalog, Stoeger (USA) 1939:









--------------------
Citizen of the Cherokee Nation

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Vladymere
.300 member


Reged: 11/08/15
Posts: 187
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Re: I need help with this one [Re: Rothhammer1]
      #318851 - 07/08/18 06:57 AM

I look forward to photos. That rifle is special.

Vlad

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