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Hunting >> Hunting in Africa & hunting dangerous game

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Safari Camps
#31879 - 24/05/05 01:01 PM

How important is a first class Safari Camp? Do you care about insuite bathrooms etc? Would you rather have a more spartan, but comfortable camp for less money?

I have stayed in some pretty fancy camps. Some would rival a first class Hotel. I have also stayed in a fly camps with no servants etc the PH and a tracker. These were closer to drop camps in Alaska.

I think my favourite Camp was in Zambia in Mulabesi with John Knowles. It was a tent camp that was taken down at the end of the season and moved occasionally during the season. You had to walk to the long drop and the hot water was heated 5 gallons at a time. The company was outstanding and the hunting was extrodinary.

I dislike the South African and Farm operations custom of staying in, what amounts to, an expensive motel room. If on a Farm I would just as soon stay in the house with the inlaws.

What do you guys think?

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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AdamTayler
.375 member

Reged: 22/03/04
Posts: 688
Loc: B.C.

Re: Safari Camps [Re: mickey]
#31881 - 24/05/05 01:23 PM

Mickey

Because I hunt at home with dome tents and wall tents, I think I would like to have the same type of camp when I go to Africa. I have gone on trips where I had a solid roof over my head and a fireplace to lounge by with a nice glass of whatever, and yes, that was really comfortable. However, I would rather take the "saved" money and apply it to the cost of the safari so I could go earlier or put it towards an additional trophy fee. Maybe when I get longer in the tooth my mind will change.

--------------------
It's the journey, not the destination.

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500grains
.416 member

Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA

Re: Safari Camps [Re: mickey]
#31885 - 24/05/05 01:45 PM

Screw the camp. I would just as soon bring a tent and stay in it close to the game. Sometimes you have to leave camp at 3:30 a.m. to be at a hunting spot by first light at 5:30. Personally I would rather sleep on the ground with a rock jabbing into my back and get another 2 hours rest.

However, it is nice to have a bucket or water or a garden hose to get the b.o. off.

Other things I can live without:

coffee/tea/soda
beer/booze
electricity (a candle or a campfire works fine)
dessert

The bottom line is that my U.S. hunts are far more primitive than what I have been exposed to in Africa.

However, by the time most guys can afford to hunt Africa, they are old, fat, lazy and pampered, so the safari companies cater to the lowest common denominator. And PHs have to live in camp for at least 6 months of the year, so they do not mind a little luxury if available.

And then there are the wives. Perhaps I will skip that topic.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39881
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Safari Camps [Re: 500grains]
#31889 - 24/05/05 02:11 PM

I actually don't mind the luxury camps. Perhaps I am fat, lazy and pampered?

At home the camps are always rough. Often just a swag under the sky (because I can't be bother to erect a tent). A shower is either a besa concrete block, a solar heated bag or a bucket. The toilet is a bush. Still make nice meals, often have cold drinks, fresh meat and luxuries such as butter and milk thanks to a portable engel fridge. That is one thing I do not like to go without. If hunting in hot weather a cold drink is a great thing. Used to use evaporation hessian waterbags for this.

Other 'camps' at home are dirty dusty windy cold dark station shearers quarters type accomodation. Sometimes you need to sweep the bird and rat shit away and thank God the 'kitchen' areas are usually a bit cleaner.

I quite like the permanent chalet style camps with stone, cement, wood or tiled floors, deep double beds and ensuites. I do not like hotel/motel type camps at all, eg all the rooms in a block with a corridor. Yuck. Tented camps in a great setting can be really nice and a walk to an outside toilet/shower doesn't hurt anyone. I don't have any preference for a tented camp like some, but I do like a thatched roof in preference to tiles or tin. A thatched ceiling in Africa is a work of art and even if above a tent makes it much cooler.

A nice dining area is pleasant and is easy to do, so why not?

A ring of camp chairs around an open fire is a good way to finish. That was something I missed at Gan Gan in the NT, we all finished just in the mozzie netted dining area. It lacks the ambiance of the campfire.

I feel IF I am PAYING for it anyway, why not?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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EricD
.416 member

Reged: 27/02/04
Posts: 4636

Re: Safari Camps [Re: NitroX]
#31902 - 24/05/05 05:15 PM

I'm with 500grains on this one. While in africa, both hunting and not, we've stayed in luxury tented camps, stone chalets, in a farm house, and in far from luxurious fly camps. Not to mention sleeping in a small rooftop tent for a year with zero luxuries.

Although I am very glad that I've experianced high end tented camps with servants and ensuite bathrooms, I would generally rather save some money and live more primitive.

Erik

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Mpofu
.300 member

Reged: 02/01/03
Posts: 141

Re: Safari Camps [Re: mickey]
#31904 - 24/05/05 05:52 PM

The first class safari camps tend to lose the 'Africa' feel to them. I too love the fly camp, as long as you get your basics.
I had the experience of 'roughing' it when we were after leopard, and needed to be in the blind by 4am. It was a brilliant experience,sleeping rough, digging holes in the dry river bed for cool clear water, and eating sudsa and African stew every night. However, at the end of a few days in the bush,I do recall the absolute luxury of being able to get into a tent, having a shave, hot bath,clean sheets and a creaky bed .
Even being able to get a bit of milk in one's mug of tea was greatly appreciated.
The camp run by John Knowles sounds very interesting, as Zambia will almost certainly be my next hunting destination.
Any details on his outfit would be appreciated.(Ideally with an account of your trip).
M

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wynwood1
.224 member

Reged: 04/05/05
Posts: 26
Loc: AK1/2 yr, Pa 1/2 yr in the Lan...

Re: Safari Camps [Re: Mpofu]
#31911 - 24/05/05 08:22 PM

I've stayed in both styles, I prefer a "Quality" tent camp over the posh more modern camps. I've even gone as far as to have a good tent camp arranged for when the accomodations of a 4 star lodge was included.
Some tent camps I've been in were every bit as posh as those lodges anyway.

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foxfire
.375 member

Reged: 25/11/04
Posts: 511
Loc: Long Island N.Y.,

Re: Safari Camps [Re: wynwood1]
#31913 - 24/05/05 09:08 PM

Sign me up with the fat and lazy. Give me all the ammenities and then add some more. Four stars ain't enough. I grown to comfortable to having bathrooms, hot showers and service with a smile. If it can be done when hunting I want it. If it can't then we go it alone.

--------------------
No good deed goes unpunished

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AspenHill
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Reged: 08/01/03
Posts: 1528
Loc: Vermont, USA

Re: Safari Camps [Re: foxfire]
#31918 - 24/05/05 11:14 PM

I've done them all, I don't mind a tent, rough built shack or lux rondaval, as long as I am not sleeping on a rock. Nope, I want a real bed. Especially after the airplane ride, my back gets pretty kinked up.

Personally, since I do travel alone I find the en suite shower/toilet a real nice bonus when they are available. I really don't like a middle of the night walk in the dark to take care of business. Especially in hippo and ele country where they are often night time visitors in camp.

--------------------
~Ann

Everyday spent outdoors is the best day of my life.

Aspen Hill Adventures

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: Safari Camps [Re: Mpofu]
#31924 - 24/05/05 11:49 PM

In reply to:

The camp run by John Knowles sounds very interesting, as Zambia will almost certainly be my next hunting destination.
Any details on his outfit would be appreciated.(Ideally with an account of your trip).

Mpofu

As this was 25 years ago it has all changed. I know Mulebesi is only a shadow of what it once was. I am not even sure if John is still hunting, although his stated goal was to be the oldest PH in Africa.

You will rarely hear his name but John is/was one of the very best PHs in Africa. One of a small group that doesn't advertise or attend SCI. He was usually booked out about 4-5 years with a very loyal clientele.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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Plains99
.300 member

Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 225
Loc: Dodge City, Kansas, USA

Re: Safari Camps [Re: mickey]
#31942 - 25/05/05 05:46 AM

I've done the primitive hunting thing in North America and always enjoyed it. In RSA we stayed in a glorified motel but it was fun and a necessary compromise for wives and such. I've never gotten sick or seriously hurt on any hunt but I can appreciate where a "glorified motel" would be awfully nice in a tight situation. I've gone on a couple of primitive hunts where all some of the guys did was bitch about being too hot, too cold, too old, too wet, too dry, too bug bitten, too overlooked, and too neglected. I'd have just as soon they were in a "glorified motel" and happier some where else; if that could have been realistically possible. My best primitive hunts have been with just a guide or by myself where I didn't have to listen to the complaining. As one outfitter once said to me after listening to a hunter's line of crap: "People say they want it rough, but they really don't want it too rough." Frankly, I think he's right and there are very few that I would consider being on a primitive hunt with. It takes a special sort of person.

Edited by Plains99 (25/05/05 05:50 AM)

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39881
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Safari Camps [Re: Plains99]
#31970 - 25/05/05 02:21 PM

I forgot, I have slept pretty rough in Africa after all. Just on a ground sheet, mattress roll and a mosquito net. This was in Tanzania, Malawi and Zambia in 1988. Without the filmsy tent walls it does make you think what sort of animals are roaming at night especially hyaeana.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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AspenHill
Sponsor

Reged: 08/01/03
Posts: 1528
Loc: Vermont, USA

Re: Safari Camps [Re: Plains99]
#31990 - 25/05/05 11:10 PM

Plains99,

Your post reminded me of some helpless boyfriends I've had in the past.

Totally useless in tented hunting camps here in NA. All it takes is one hunt like that to see how capable someone really is or isn't. Always a real eye opener!

--------------------
~Ann

Everyday spent outdoors is the best day of my life.

Aspen Hill Adventures

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Plains99
.300 member

Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 225
Loc: Dodge City, Kansas, USA

Re: Safari Camps [Re: AspenHill]
#32096 - 26/05/05 11:46 PM

Yeah, we were in Colorado on an elk hunt in what amounted to a really nice outfitter's tent. Wood floor, nice stove, decent folding cots and a good cook. It snowed, perhaps a foot the third night and we had a couple of guys go into a real panic. Absolutely no reason for such a reaction as we were in no danger AT ALL. Its like they just couldn't see past the immediate situation or get out of the panic mentality. And of course the snow was the outfitter's fault! I'd have hated to have had them with me in a really tight situation like someone being sick or seriously hurt. Its then that you really have to empathise with a professional guide's circumstances and the patience it must require.

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new_guy
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Reged: 10/08/04
Posts: 581
Loc: Texas

Re: Safari Camps [Re: mickey]
#32102 - 27/05/05 01:03 AM

The only thing really, really, really, important to me is a hot shower, which it seems is easily provided by any camp even with the most sparse accommodations.

Location is important too. I want to feel like I’m hunting in a remote area. I don’t want to feel like I’m leaving someone’s house near the edge of town to go out and hunt on their “property” or “ranch.”

Beyond that, African camps seem to be good at making lemonade out of lemons. I’m amazed at - that with such meager supplies - the quality of food and accommodations they are able to provide.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

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