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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Building Double Rifles & Gunsmithing

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ducmarc
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Reged: 14/07/14
Posts: 743
Loc: fla
Baikal revisited
      #291212 - 01/12/16 12:48 PM

Has any tried the limits of the Russian steel?they are reasonable thought of reaming one out to 45-120 packing it with 2f and tying a tire.and see what happens.

--------------------
Tarzan know where Tarzan go


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Wayne59
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Reged: 20/06/15
Posts: 488
Loc: Lagrange Ga. USA
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: ducmarc]
      #291215 - 01/12/16 01:34 PM

It will kick the snot out of you. Not much else.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Wayne59]
      #291224 - 01/12/16 03:27 PM

I wouldn't bother. Enjoy it as a cheap ass .45/70 double rifle.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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ducmarc
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Reged: 14/07/14
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: NitroX]
      #291253 - 01/12/16 11:36 PM

When I got my first 45-70 which I still have was for my 16th birthday was wanting one for a few years and my dad succumbed to it and bought me a navy arms rolling block.as a teen I reloaded that thing (wonder it never blew up) cast the biggest bullets I could make and would take it out in the everglades with friends to cut down trees.I have it a trapdoor and the highwall in 120 the highwall is the most fun stuff it full of black powder and let it rip.but its so light 8.5lba it knocks u around a bit. Thinking a cheap Russian would be fun .might get one anyway

--------------------
Tarzan know where Tarzan go


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Birdhunter50
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Reged: 03/06/07
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: ducmarc]
      #291254 - 02/12/16 12:32 AM

Ducmarc,
Here is something you can do to decide if you really want to risk rechambering a Russian Baikal to a 45-120. Find a used one for sale and ask to measure the barrel diameters back in front of the breech. If you ask enough sellers you will eventually find one who will pull off the forearm for you to do the measuring. Be sure to take along a dial caliper and a pencil and paper with you to write down the numbers.

Next, subtract the bullet diameter from each barrel diameter and divide by two and that will give you the barrel wall thickness at the breech end of each barrel. Then you need to consider that you are going to be moving the case mouths forward by over an inch, this may put them into and area where the barrels are even thinner.

Finally, you need to be honest with yourself and ask yourself if you really want to risk death and dismemberment just so that you can stuff a longer cartridge into a gun that may already be near the limits of what it can take. If you need more power, buy a gun that will take longer shells, but I would not recommend hotrodding a 45-70 in a Russian Baikal too much.

Don't misunderstand my intent here, I have nothing against the Baikal's, in fact I own a 30-06 over under made by them. Whatever they are using for barrel steel is really strong and tough stuff. That being said, I wouldn't want to push it without knowing what they say about the upper limits of what they can stand. Possibly a dealer could get that information for you, but I doubt that they will tell you what kind of steel they use or what the expected limits of it are. Be Safe and Best Wishes.
Bob


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Wayne59
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Reged: 20/06/15
Posts: 488
Loc: Lagrange Ga. USA
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Birdhunter50]
      #291274 - 02/12/16 10:24 AM

He is talking about going from a smokeless powder 45/70 to burning Black powder in a 45/120. I don't think preasure will be much of a problem. JMHO

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Daryl_S
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Wayne59]
      #291278 - 02/12/16 11:37 AM

The most pressure you will get from a 3 1/4" .45 or .50 burning black powder, is about 30,000PSI - according to AA's old manual.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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ducmarc
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Reged: 14/07/14
Posts: 743
Loc: fla
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Daryl_S]
      #291288 - 02/12/16 01:22 PM

Barrel taper maybe a real factor I can't rechamber one of my p17 Enfields to 300 h&h because the rapid taper passed the orgianal chamber.at least the was the suggestion.the only way the 120 shines is in black powder.otherwise the powder gets lost in the case.but there are a lot of 45-70/90 "express loads" out there.didnt know if anyone has tried to lean on the action.they don't seem worried about pre20th century steel or some Italian crap the probably has pin holes inside of it.

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Tarzan know where Tarzan go


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Birdhunter50
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Reged: 03/06/07
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Wayne59]
      #291310 - 03/12/16 12:26 AM

Wayne59,
The main reason for the longer case is so that you can send heavier bullets down range at a decent speed. The British used Black powder to do many of their proof loads, they may still be doing it for all I know. Black generates More pressure in cartridges than in muzzle loaders because it is a better sealed system.
These Russian guns have extremely small barrel diameters for their calibers, and extending the chambers in one might prove to be catastrophic if you don't know the yield strength of the steel you are working with. I am encouraging this fellow to use some caution for safety sake. I feel that encouraging anyone to extend the chambers on a gun with minimum barrel diameters is like playing Russian roulette with someones life. Bob


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Wayne59
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Reged: 20/06/15
Posts: 488
Loc: Lagrange Ga. USA
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Birdhunter50]
      #291338 - 03/12/16 08:37 AM

My first post wasn't to encourage him to do it rather to discourage him. There is no practical benefits to it. As to the space issue there may not be enough room to undertake the project.

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Daryl_S
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Wayne59]
      #291341 - 03/12/16 10:16 AM

In that rifle, the BP loads produce about the same pressure as Baikal's suggested maximum pressure for the .45/70 and smokeless loads, seems to me - ie: 30,000PSI.

There may be a real danger of thin barrel probelms due to normal barrel taper, as noted above.

Did someone here not do this already - as in re-chambering to .450 3 1/4 Express?

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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Wayne59
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Reged: 20/06/15
Posts: 488
Loc: Lagrange Ga. USA
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Daryl_S]
      #291353 - 03/12/16 01:44 PM

I have read a post some where on the net of someone doing a 45/120 but you have to take some of this with a grain of salt. I think I will do a search.

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Rich
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Reged: 07/12/06
Posts: 25
Loc: Fayette county Pa.
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Wayne59]
      #291912 - 13/12/16 11:06 AM

Hope this helps https://sportingbookworm.wordpress.com/2016/07/12/interview-with-rich-show-double-rifle-maker/

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Sportingbookworm
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Reged: 10/05/17
Posts: 6
Loc: Samara, Russia
Re: Baikal revisited [Re: Rich]
      #300336 - 11/05/17 04:32 PM

The barrel steel brand is either 50PA; or 32XPA I can look up their characteristics if it's still relevant.

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https://sportingbookworm.wordpress.com/


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