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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #287093 - 28/08/16 02:47 PM

someone build a sizing die to make shells for the 0,70" Randschlussspiegel cartridge from 20 ga plastic, notice the step over the rim http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6087006



.22 patent rifle with later made threads on the muzzle, suspect for a silencer what was common before WW 1, no proof so before 1893 and SN not found
http://www.gunvaluesboard.com/fv-dreyse-22-cal-single-shot-358395.html
















double gun in auction http://aukro.cz/pruska-brokovnice-dreyse-plne-funkcni-pred-1890-i6415828579.html
caliber given as 20/20 so probably a 0,70", old style locking spring points to the early 1870s

















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Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #288482 - 30/09/16 04:15 AM

beautyful Lady's rifle in 0,34", SN 9261
thats what they were looking when new http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6125288

























































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Wayne59
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #288500 - 30/09/16 11:41 AM

It looks like they might have drilled right through the old primer also. Interesting.

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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: Wayne59]
      #288590 - 02/10/16 06:04 AM

double rifle, 16mm barrels with 7 grooves, SN 27672
property of prince von salm http://www.hermann-historica.de/db2_de/aktuelle-auktion-2.html





--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #288596 - 02/10/16 06:46 AM

short 15mm needle fire carbine SN 7382 http://www.hermann-historica.de/db2_de/aktuelle-auktion-2.html





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chapmen
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #289182 - 18/10/16 05:48 AM

Early single shot Dreyse's .......

Barrel and System forged and made in one piece:



Interesting action:


--------------------
some fine old guns from germany :
www.jagdwaffensammler.de


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #289629 - 31/10/16 06:33 AM

needle fire "lady's rifle" in 0,34" , SN 12887
http://www.gunstar.co.uk/dreyse-needlefire-carbine-with-octagonal-barrel-single-shot-/rifles/833746







target pistol with patent rifle action, chamber is maybe for the 5,6x33R dreyse
"signed in silver “F. KOERNER SIEGEN”"
http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-fo...un_id=100762730





















two very similar pistols
SN 33976
http://www.horstheld.com/0-Dreyse-target.html





















he identify the cartridge as Brand No.16 whats the 5,7x33 Dreyse rimless so it may be this one



another one SN 32917





Edited by lancaster (31/10/16 06:52 AM)


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #292720 - 28/12/16 07:45 PM

0,34" SN 6762 http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6249003













--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #296080 - 02/03/17 07:58 AM

Dreyse sidelock 16 ga double gun SN 31393
http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/threads/side-by-side-shotgun.168696/#post-1537593













sold by W. Tornau in Halle an der Saale

a modified needle fire gun made after 1883 I was not able to get the serial number now

http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/threads/f-v-dreyse-sommerda-know-anything.165619/#post-1502089




very old v. Dreyse single shot gun SN 2082(suposeably)
http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/threads/dresye-sommerda-shotgun.166556/















unusual break action seems to shoot a paper cartridge in the design of the military round

12ga sidelock, nitro proof, SN 32352
http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=467851&page=2











very unusual 0,70 randschlusssp. double gun with two barrel sets
26 1/4" combination gun barrels with V rear sight and 28 3/4" double gun barrels
Franz von Dreyse http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/threads/german-shotgun-side-break.134599/#post-1206574







it comes clear now what this long iron forearm tip is, just a cover to come easier to the screw that hold the barrels in the action

and finaly more pics of the unknown Dreyse drilling action









--------------------
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.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #296256 - 04/03/17 04:58 PM

more pics for SN 31393











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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #296754 - 11/03/17 02:59 AM

sometimes new possibility's just around the corner, find a gentleman living just 20 km from me. because he is a paper collector only our way's dont meet before but now its just in time.
he send me some prussian paper's and the first thing I see were two patent's for Nicolaus von Dreyse (the second ) given to him on the 3rd of july 1896




-61730 hammerless self cocking Drilling with three trigger's

-61731 hammerless self cocking doublegun

I had two Drilling's here, one clearly N.v.Dreyse, with 3 trigger





and no doubt this is the unknown double gun





N.v.Dreyse SN 36620 so made in 1896
another model is identified, probabyl only made between 1896 and 1900 it must be rare

and the gentleman have a book project about the Teschner - Collath gunmaker family nearly finished too

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #297058 - 15/03/17 12:49 AM

double gun 0,70" Randschlusss. SN 21458
http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6376243













gun was restored but the antique brown is imho wrong

have problems to fill the years between 1897 and 1901 when the guns where marked "Waffen&Munitionsfabrik Soemmerda". so far only three guns were found with this name so ask myself what they do all the time than.
probably only in 1900 the Mannlicher pistol model 1900 was made with the patent from mister Mannlicher beside of the other production in steyr.
like usual in Soemmerda special pistol models got own serial numbers starting with 1

SN 58




http://www.hermann-historica.de/de/mannl...g=1&slide=2

SN 144 is in much better shape







http://www.hungariae.com/Mann00.htm

SN 215 blued and the name is in gold




http://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/51/1758

SN 217 was given as a present to the turkish sultan in 1903


















the box made by H&C SCHULTZE / DUSSELDORF
Düsseldorf is also the head office of rheinmetall so this box and the pistol from Soemmerda were maybe an order from the boss.


this pistol is now engraved on the grip with "RHEINISCHE METALLWARREN U./ MASCHINEN FABRIK ABTEILUNG SOMMERDA/ EHRHARDT WERKE"
the official name after 30.1.1901 but maybe in 1903 tis pistol was out of production and this one was on stock in the white. "Model 1903" was pure fantasy to give the sultan the impression this was a brand new thing. we know that SN 215 have the old name dated it back to the year 1900 so its unlikly number 217 was made 3 years later. was in contakt with Mister Mötz from austria about it and he means it could be the model was made for some time after 1901 with the old name for different reasons. will take a look also on this problem and time will tell.



"This is an exceptionally rare, early production 1900 Mannlicher semi-automatic presentation pistol that has been lavishly factory deep relief chisel engraved and fitted with a beautiful set of walnut grips that have been adorned with various ivory inlays. The pistol itself also carries a factory inscription or presentation which experts attribute to the Sultan of Turkey. This pistol, various accessories and tools are all housed in a hand tooled, gold guilded and dyed, leather bound display case. The 1900 Mannlicher pistol itself is a very early design that was very unique for the time in that it was blow-back operated which fired the 7.65mm Mannlicher automatic cartridge, (similar to the 7.63 Mauser cartridge). The interesting aspect of the pistol is that it uses an internal magazine that is loaded from the top, via stripper clips, which are positioned in the clip guides located on top of the slide, and it has a two-piece barrel. At the time of its development, this pistol was considered very innovative, as well as strong and reliable; it fired a high velocity cartridge, making this a highly desirable and sought after weapon for any country. The pistol, as noted, has been engraved on over 95% of the metal surface, with the only area not engraved being the front grip strap, which carries the inscription and the barrel rib itself. The engraving is an early deep relief, Germanic style that has been executed in a vine and floral pattern with the punch dot background. It is fitted with a set of standard walnut grips that have been inlayed with genuine ivory in very nicely detailed vine and floral pattern that compliments the metal engraving of the pistol. In the center section of each grip panel there is a 1 1/2 inch by 1 inch oval ivory panel, inlayed into the grip which has been beautifully carved with a large sun-burst pattern in the background, over a set of cross-flags that depict the Cross and Crescent symbol of the Ottoman Empire or Sultan of Turkey. Surrounding the flags on both sides are various implements of war, which include, swords, pistols, cannons, lances and pikes etc. etc. The factory inscription is in three lines and reads: "RHEINISCHE METALLWARREN U./ MASCHINEN FABRIK ABTEILUNG SOMMERDA/ EHRHARDT WERKE" A loose translation is "Metalware and Machine Fabricating Department, at Sommerda works, from Ehrhardt". A brief history or connection of this inscription to the pistol and to the company is in order. Heinrich Ehrhardt was a young engineer who in 1889 accepted a subcontract from the large German manufacturing firm of Hörder Bergwerks- und Hüttenverein (HBH), a major ammunition contract for the Imperial German Army. After completion of this contract he developed several new patents and also designed a new rapid firing cannon which he later sold to Norway and eventually Germany. With the proceeds from these contracts and with the help of several venture capitalists in 1891 he formed the new company of Rheinische Metallwaaren- und Maschinenfabrik, near Erfurt. In 1901 he acquired the old Munitions-und Waffenfabrik AG of "Sömmerda" in Thuringia, previously known as Dreyse'sche Gewehrfabrik, a manufacturer of handguns, and cartridges. From this small start he was able to develop several unique patents on metal fabricating techniques which he developed into the Rheinmetall Works, one of the largest German metal working companies in Europe. Based on what the inscription says and the time frame for this pistol, this describer theorizes that this pistol was probably a gift or presentation to the Sultan of Turkey, for a military contract that may have used some of the raw material from this company or actually for small arms fabricated at the Sommerda works, probably in the 1901-1905 time frame. As you recall, the Imperial German government and the Turkish Empire were very close allies during this time and sold thousands of rifles, pistols, cannons and various war material to each other. As noted, the pistol and various accessories are all housed in a beautifully leather bound French fitted case that has been overlaid with several panels of almost a damascene leather pattern on all four sides as well as the lid. The center section of the lid has a raised, hand carved, leather coat of arms that looks like a double flag hanging on each side with a turban on top, with a crescent moon in the center. There is no name, markings or inscription on the coat of arms. The bottom front of the case is marked in gold "H&C SCHULTZE / DUSSELDORF". Inside the case are five compartments one for the pistol, screwdriver, cleaning rod, silver oiler bottle and small pin punch (which is missing). The lining is a light blue felt with the following three-line, Gold Letter inscription on the inside of the lid; "EHRHARDT WERKE/ ABTEILING SOMMERDA GEWEHRFABRIK/ SYSTEM MANNLICHER 1903". The barrel and lower frame have a rust blued finish, with the remainder of the frame and slide having a casehardened factory finish. The trigger, extractor and safety lever were all gold plated at one time. It has matching numbers on the various parts with the side of the slide having a small double "Crown over U" proofmark. Certainly this has to be one of the Crown Jewels of this auction that needs to be researched further. "

http://www.icollector.com/Magnificent-Su...h-Del_i11028142


the Mannlicher in the Alfa catalog, the cartridge showing the Soemmerda headstamp




https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/m-w-soemmerda/22884/8


Edited by lancaster (15/03/17 07:30 PM)


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #298215 - 31/03/17 10:06 PM

in the next hermann historica auction
pistol" Cal: d Zdsp: 0,44" SN 11399, "F. v. Dreyse Sömmerda"
http://www.hermann-historica.de/de/zuend...mp;currentpos=7







pistol ""Caliber 0,34 / 6 gran Pulver", SN 2118, build with the Lady's rifle action
http://www.hermann-historica.de/de/hinte...g=1&slide=0








very obscure revolver for the 0,34" needle fire cartridge, SN 523
http://www.hermann-historica.de/de/zuend...g=1&slide=4













F.v.Dreyse engraved 16 ga double gun what will be a 0,70" cartridge , SN 4595
http://auctions.holtsauctioneers.com/asp...5&saletype=



very old but beated hard, looks realy like SN 66 or 99 "Cal.d.Schlussp. 0,65" 5 1/2 /24 gramm powder
http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6405190

















never say never with old guns, a 0,70" double gun, SN 10266 with the old style ramrod pipes not necessary anymore for this model















Edited by lancaster (02/04/17 07:43 PM)


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #298771 - 09/04/17 06:00 AM

nice double gun, SN looks like 26201 http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-fo...un_id=100825076

"Dreyse Needlefire System Side Opening Needle Fire Shotgun. The bores measure to 18 Gauge a 16 Gauge shell will not fit to the chamber. This one is circa 1862 or so. The action functions well with a lefecheaux style lever that moves the barrels forward and then to the side for loading. The action is fully engraved with open vine European style engraving, double triggers, horn grip. The barrels are 32" when measured from the back of the chamber, steel, clean bores with light pitting ahead of the chamber. The stock is in very good shape with a cheek piece, nice chequering"














--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #299064 - 15/04/17 06:10 AM

http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-fo...un_id=100829943
SN 3380
seller was given the caliber as " Schlusssp. 075" " whats a problem because the gun is clearly for "Randschlusssp." cartridge but with this early SN its possible the gun was updated for the new cartridge in the factorry.

















--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #299644 - 26/04/17 05:17 AM

https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail...on-rifle#detail
patent rifle for an unknown 11mm cartridge, SN 19947












"These Dreyse sporting rifles are descended from the earliest bolt action rifles designed by Johann Nikolaus von Dreyse (1787-1867) around 1836 and are among the first modern bolt action sporting rifles. This very fine example has beautiful floral and scroll engraving with gold and silver inlaid accents including "F. V. DREYSE SOMMERDA" on top of the barrel and "PATENT" on the receiver ring in gold. The former indicates it was manufactured under Franz von Dreyse (1822 -1894), the son of the needle gun inventor. The barrel also has a blade front sight and adjustable notch rear sight, and the rifle is equipped with double set triggers. The matching serial number is on the left side of the barrel and on the underside of the bolt handle, and the barrel, receiver, and bolt all have "crown/V" proofmarks. The stock has a horn forend cap, sling swivels, leafy scroll carving intermixed with animal designs accented with glass eyes, a horn grip extension with scroll pattern at the tail end, cheek rest, and an engraved steel shotgun style buttplate.
"

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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chapmen
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #300219 - 08/05/17 03:56 AM

I have never seen before- an F.Dreyse falling block needle gun, i think before 1864 ( after this Franz was "von" and signed with "F.v. Dreyse")
even if it is patented, never seen the patent.....:









--------------------
some fine old guns from germany :
www.jagdwaffensammler.de

Edited by chapmen (08/05/17 04:01 AM)


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: chapmen]
      #300248 - 09/05/17 05:11 AM

very,very nice, no doubt made before 1864

do you have the SN and the caliber? is it yours now? never see a falling block like this before but with dreyse everything is possible.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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chapmen
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #300253 - 09/05/17 07:02 AM

not mine- hopefully not yet.
No SN, no stamp or mark on the whole rifle.



--------------------
some fine old guns from germany :
www.jagdwaffensammler.de


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: chapmen]
      #300315 - 11/05/17 02:16 AM

no SN ,is very unusual
have sen this only on some early prototype guns

very interesting engraving, I read Cal.d.Gesch: 0,49" Cal:d.Zdsp: 0,49" Länge d.Zdsp: 0,50"
Länge d. Patr. 1,73"

bullet and sabot diameter 12,81mm
sabot length 13mm
cartridge length 45,2mm

only the powder load is hard to read! can you give a better picture?

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #301814 - 16/06/17 04:46 AM

0,64" Randschlusss. cartridge, double gun with rifled chamber insert for the right barrel but as usual the shotgun chamber insert is rustet in, SN 17685 http://www.naturabuy.fr/fusil-Dreyse-Sommerda-1890-canon-damas-aiguilles-item-3901942.html











thanks to louis

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #302451 - 28/06/17 05:12 AM

it never become boring with dreyse guns, here a needle fire stalking rilfe with a scaled down military action never seen before, SN 14483



















bolt missing all internal parts, will probably help to bring it backi to work


a "12 ga" double gun, v. Dreyse with SN 5893 its made between 1864 and 1865 and chambered for a "Randschlussspiegel" cartridge

http://www.aiolfi.com/vente/vente-milita...es-type-dreyse/









will compare the pics with other guns but it looks like a 0,74"

Edited by lancaster (30/06/17 03:51 AM)


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #302579 - 01/07/17 04:54 AM

0,70", hate it when they hide the SN
http://www.onlinehuntingauctions.com/Ger...overa_i27184500























--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #303002 - 13/07/17 02:16 AM

16 ga hammergun, SN 23578
http://www.lauritz.com/da/auktion/f-v-dreyse-underlukker-haneboesse/i4708253/#



















--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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lancaster
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Re: Dreyse Double [Re: lancaster]
      #303193 - 23/07/17 03:40 AM

Patent rifle in 11x52R , SN 25208
http://egun.de/market/item.php?id=6550800






























































--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
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