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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months)
      #296785 - 11/03/17 10:52 AM

Westley Richards 1897 "second grade"

image by John Lindly, on Flickr

image by John Lindly, on Flickr

image by John Lindly, on Flickr

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26413
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Levallois]
      #296786 - 11/03/17 10:55 AM

Nice hunting rifle, that!
Is it a .35?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Waidmannsheil
.400 member


Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2363
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: DarylS]
      #296787 - 11/03/17 11:03 AM

Second grade or not, it looks bloody nice. Good looking sights as well. How does the safety work and what caliber is it. well done.

Waidmannsheil.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.


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HuviusModerator
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Waidmannsheil]
      #296792 - 11/03/17 11:25 AM

Lovely rifle.
Good bullet selection out there for the 400/360 too. Wonderful cartridge for North America.

Quite an addiction, isn't it?

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Huvius]
      #296794 - 11/03/17 11:52 AM

Thanks guys! Yes, the addiction is becoming serious. I'm already looking at what else I can sell to get another. It is indeed a.400/360. Safety works better that expected - easy to use. Sights are fantastic and the LOP is perfect as I can bring it to shoulder with my eyes closed and be lined up every time.

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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Iowa_303s
.400 member


Reged: 22/03/13
Posts: 1014
Loc: Iowa, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Levallois]
      #296806 - 11/03/17 03:17 PM

Fantastic looking rifle!

--------------------
Matt

formerly known as Iowa_303

"Once your reputation is ruined you can live your life quite freely."

"Enkelkinder über alles"


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Waidmannsheil
.400 member


Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2363
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Iowa_303s]
      #296810 - 11/03/17 04:54 PM

Yes it looks great but how do you use the safety ?

Waidmannsheil.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.


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Grenadier
.375 member


Reged: 20/02/08
Posts: 570
Loc: North of the Columbia, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Waidmannsheil]
      #296812 - 11/03/17 05:20 PM

Very nice indeed.

--------------------
~


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bouldersmith
.375 member


Reged: 23/03/06
Posts: 608
Loc: Boulder Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Grenadier]
      #296835 - 12/03/17 12:34 AM

Nice rifle. I feel the Westley 1897 is the best mechanical design of all the British falling block rifles. It has a rebounding hammer and inline rebounding firing pin with a small diameter tip. Much better for high pressure rounds than other makers concepts. I do like a top tang safety though, especially the design used by Wesley Richards. Much more positive than that used on PD Farquharsons and not dependent upon the action screw timing. Enjoy your new rifle in good health.
Steve

--------------------
New website http://www.bertramandco.com


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MikeRowe
.333 member


Reged: 23/11/11
Posts: 478
Loc: Arkansas, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: bouldersmith]
      #296837 - 12/03/17 01:55 AM

You will really like that 400/360. Very moderate recoil.
I have had good results in a Fraser with the PRVI 285 grain bullets.
The jackets are pretty thick for 9.3X62 and 74R velocities, so I have made
them into Fraser's Oblique Ratchet Bullets to help with expansion at the slower
400/360 velocity. They go into the same group as the unmodified bullets.
Even though the bullets are .006" under groove size, they will shoot into
3" at 100 yards with open sights any time, which is plenty good for deer. A
1/8" cork wad behind the bullet, and a little dacron to keep the wad and powder
in place, seals everything up quite well.


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Iowa_303s
.400 member


Reged: 22/03/13
Posts: 1014
Loc: Iowa, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: MikeRowe]
      #296838 - 12/03/17 03:43 AM

Mike,
Would you post a photo/description of the "Fraser's Oblique Ratchet Bullet" modifications you do to the Prvi 285 grain bullet?
Possibly in a new thread.

--------------------
Matt

formerly known as Iowa_303

"Once your reputation is ruined you can live your life quite freely."

"Enkelkinder über alles"


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MikeRowe
.333 member


Reged: 23/11/11
Posts: 478
Loc: Arkansas, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Iowa_303s]
      #296839 - 12/03/17 04:08 AM

I'll get to work on it.

Here you go:


http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat....true#Post296847


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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1652
Loc: Australia
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: MikeRowe]
      #296887 - 12/03/17 05:22 PM

Gorgeous! Perfection in my eyes!

--------------------
.


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Ash]
      #296930 - 13/03/17 03:29 AM

Very nice; looks to be the one that was listed by Kirby Hoyt at Vintage Doubles.
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: 3DogMike]
      #296933 - 13/03/17 04:47 AM

Thanks very much for the kind words and advice about the 400/360 cartridge. The only other falling block I have to compare to the WR97 is the Webley 1902. The WR97 is less robust and has style. The 1902 is built like tank. As far as the safety on the 1897, it can be disengaged with the trigger finger. This is probably not ideal but it takes a blink of the eye to do. Admittedly the tang safety is better because you do not have to take your finger off the trigger. This was one of Kirby's and he was terrific to deal with.

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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Wayne59
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Reged: 20/06/15
Posts: 1219
Loc: Lagrange Ga. USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Levallois]
      #296973 - 13/03/17 12:44 PM

Kirby has three more listed right now. You guys should check out Vintage Doubles web sight. Kirby is an honest and forthright person to do business with.

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93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3954
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Wayne59]
      #296989 - 13/03/17 06:24 PM

Superb!
Wonderful pickup Levallois!


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HuviusModerator
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Wayne59]
      #297012 - 14/03/17 02:04 AM

Quote:

Kirby has three more listed right now.




He does get in some interesting stuff.
One of the Westleys is the one in this thread - I think he just hasn't taken the ad off the site.

The little Webley he has is nice but NOT a cordite rifle. Any attempt to shoot a 50gr cordite equivalent in that gun will end up being a small Webley in small pieces!

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Huvius]
      #297017 - 14/03/17 03:17 AM

Looking at the pictures of that little Webley that Huvius refers to on the Vintage Doubles website;it looks like the rifle may have been through a reproof for said load? 50-200 would be unusual for a .400/.360
Resolution of the photos showing the proof marks arent real good but it looks like a "BP" closer to the action then an "RP" (reproof) in front if that.
Sorry to have added to some thread drift here.......
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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HuviusModerator
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: 3DogMike]
      #297021 - 14/03/17 04:12 AM

Thread drift is OK here as it helps to show the differentiation between the two 360s.
400/360 is much too big and powerful for a round block Webley.
There is a picture of the chamber cast showing it to be the 2-1/4" cartridge.
The original 360 2-1/4" BPE used a charge of 50grs and my suspicion is that this particular rifle could have been proved for the later NfB loading but it does have the BPE load stamped on it.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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3DogMike
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Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Huvius]
      #297022 - 14/03/17 05:06 AM

.360 BP Express.....NOT ".360 Nitro Express"......NOT 50 Cordite.

Ah, so there, thanks Ben, I didnt give a close look to the picture of the chamber cast.
That explains a lot because the original .360 Express (.360 2 1/4") was a BP round originally 50 grains black powder and 150-195-215 grain bullet. Therefore the 50 - 200 marking.
The old catalogs show the Nitro for Black as 22 grains Cordite and 190 grain metal base (like a taller gas check) bullet.

(The specific ".360 Nitro Express" nitro proof would have been marked 30 Cordite and 300 grain metal jacket bullet)

Agreed, the round "bolt hole" dropping block small action 1902 Webleys are not a Nitro Express deal. It likely would contain the pressure but would get battered to death in short order.

Decent looking job of a refinish on the action; the originals action, breech block, and lever would have been case color.
Maybe underwent reproof and so marked when it was restored?
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: 3DogMike]
      #297072 - 15/03/17 07:25 AM

Question - should the safety automatically engage once the action is cocked, loaded, and closed? It does not do that on this rifle. Safety has to be pushed back by hand.

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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HuviusModerator
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Levallois]
      #297077 - 15/03/17 08:56 AM

On this rifle the safety is manual. I believe all of the top tang safety models were automatic safeties.
The trigger safety is often found less than positive.
To check your safety's function, cock the rifle, engage the safety, squeeze the trigger, let off and then disengage the safety to see if the hammer falls. Sometimes they wear enough to allow that to happen which of course is worse than no safety.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Huvius]
      #297086 - 15/03/17 12:40 PM

Huvius

Good news that it's manual. Checked it as you suggested and it holds fast. I imagine that if you needed a second shot that it would be slightly quicker than adding one more step of disengaging the safety?

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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HuviusModerator
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Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Finally another SS falling block (been 3 months) [Re: Levallois]
      #297128 - 16/03/17 03:12 AM

Interestingly, Westley Richards adopted an automatic safety on their 1878 patent rifles (which may have been a first) and then reverted back to a manual safety on the 1881 and the 1897 patent rifles until the top tang safety was offered.

Let us know how she shoots.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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