CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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A "friend" has shoved me over the cliff or under the bus by enticing me to buy an H&H 10b Paradox. For now this sinister person will remain nameless; but let me warn you, he is a member of this board and someone known to all of you.
You who know me know that I am a dyed in the wool double rifle man. For these many years I have avoided the Paradox, though I must admit an errant glance from time to time. Now I am feeling corrupt, defeated, mistreated, misled, a traitor to all my beliefs. . . Can anyone recommend a counselor?
What does one do with such a thing? Too much free-bore for a rifle. And for a shotgun these sights seem a bit odd:


And then the muzzles!

I am told I can expect it to regulate with an 875 grain bullet traveling at 1500 feet per second. That's real horsepower!
Do you think a true friend would steer me into this? Maybe I'm keeping the wrong company. 
At least it has ears. Maybe I can talk to it.

I don't yet have it in hand. It was my "friend" who shot these enticing photos. I suppose I will give more information after the gun arrives if my keepers will loosen the straight jacket and let me out of my rubber room.
 Curl
-------------------- RoscoeStephenson.com
YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27721
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Ohhhh Boy! What fun is ahead! What a hog rifle! what's she weigh?
-------------------- Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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Watson577
.300 member
Reged: 05/03/09
Posts: 132
Loc: Fredericksburg, Virginia USA
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Yep, It's all my fault....
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Huvius
.416 member
Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3615
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
...And for a shotgun these sights seem a bit odd:

I'd say so! How the heck can you use sights on the bottom of the barrels?!
-------------------- He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.
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Rockdoc
.400 member
Reged: 07/12/06
Posts: 1213
Loc: NSW, Australia
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Ooh that is so very nice!
Congratulations.
Look forward to some more photographs.
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lonewulf
.300 member
Reged: 06/08/12
Posts: 227
Loc: South-East Otago, New Zealand
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It's just a pity they didn't have those super smart computer controlled cutting machines back in the day. Note that, as good as the H&H craftsmen were, they just couldn't get those nice gaps between wood and metal that we get with modern manufacturing techniques. oh well ...I guess there's just no substitute for progress. Shame............
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MikeRowe
.333 member
Reged: 23/11/11
Posts: 479
Loc: Arkansas, USA
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It does appear you have fallen in with a suspicious bunch. Much more of this and you'll be a lost cause.
The best remedy for this situation is to send this thing to me, for indefinite safe keeping, while you spent time reflecting upon the spot you're in…….
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TH44
.375 member
Reged: 21/02/09
Posts: 740
Loc: West UK
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I take it is the later "Heavy Load" 10 bore - most desirable
More pics for the team please, when you get it
"What does one do with such a thing"?
Enjoy it and SHOOT IT! (with info. pics etc.)
TH44
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27721
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Quote:

I'd say so! How the heck can you use sights on the bottom of the barrels?!
Looks like not only some crap but rust cancer in the grooves.
-------------------- Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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Claydog
.400 member
Reged: 17/08/12
Posts: 1154
Loc: Katherine, Northern Territory ...
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Heres what to do with it. This lady used her H&H 12 bore Paradox on this bull. One shot as can be seen in the photo. The projectile was lodged in the rear hip. I was both surprised and impressed. He ran 20m and piled up. She was a very small lady who handled it like a man.
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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Here's an incredible view of the face of the breach of this fantastic gun. Remember, I haven't even seen the piece, and I didn't take these photos.
Looks brand new to me.
Curl
-------------------- RoscoeStephenson.com
YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27721
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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No case base marks at all - yes - appears to be quite new.
I think you should send it to me - I've some round balls & a couple slug moulds that are perfect to test.
-------------------- Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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Quote:
I take it is the later "Heavy Load" 10 bore - most desirable
More pics for the team please, when you get it
"What does one do with such a thing"?
Enjoy it and SHOOT IT! (with info. pics etc.)
TH44
Yep, it's the Big Boy load - 8 drams.
The gun weighs 13 lbs. 1 oz. Here is the H&H ledger page:

Yesterday evening I got the shipment tracking information. It's due to arrive here Friday June 3 - one week from tomorrow.
Curl
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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Once again, commenting on the condition or lack of use of this piece, look at this very close crop of the face of the right hammer. There's a lot of dried and darkened oil, but I see virtually no use whatsoever.
Curl
-------------------- RoscoeStephenson.com
YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.
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rigbymauser
.400 member
Reged: 15/05/05
Posts: 2027
Loc: Denmark
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A spectacular and beautiful beautiful gun. Congratulations.
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TH44
.375 member
Reged: 21/02/09
Posts: 740
Loc: West UK
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Curl - Excellent engraving for a best rifle, I am sure you will be most pleased when you get it in hand
Interesting for the detail, this would be one of the first rifles made by H&H at their new factory opened late spring 1893 - All previous H&H double guns and rifles made mostly by W&C Scott or Philip Webley (as both mine are)
The fences and shape of the action are subtly different from the earlier bought in versions, maybe returning to flat hammers (which I had previously wondered about) as part of the new system, which would soon change to mostly hammerless. Like you, I much prefer the Black Powder Hammer double rifles, including the Paradoxes
Tony
Edited by TH44 (27/05/16 08:00 AM)
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sharps4590
.333 member
Reged: 09/03/16
Posts: 290
Loc: Missouri Ozarks
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I don't believe you are in bad company....outstanding piece. Oh what fun and privilege to work with such a gun.
-------------------- Jesus said, "I am the way the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father but through me." John14:6
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93x64mm
.416 member
Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4427
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
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Well Cap you are keeping with a very select crowd, as far as keeping with the wrong crowd; well that would be a very true statement as having a Paradox is exactly just that - neither fish nor fowl, but both! What a lovely piece you have there, its an absolute gem & appears hardly if ever fired apart from proof! After reading Graeme Wright's book (a good section on the 12g paradox) it will be worth every drop of blood, sweat & tears; this one will test your skills, but in the end it will astound you as it did him for all manner of game including water buffalo! Enjoy your new 'lady', we will all be waiting with bated breath for her to 'sing' once again 93x94mm
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470evans
.333 member
Reged: 30/03/05
Posts: 278
Loc: Texas, USA
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Hello Captain.
There is a gentleman here that posts under the name "Gatsby" that was a tremendous help getting my paradox up and running.
One of the things I love about my paradox is the lower recoil than I have experienced with a typical slug gun. I expect the fact that the slug is typically cast slightly undersize and doesn't encounter resistance till it hits the choke is responsible for it.
There have been some recent threads on various sites about the paradox that has inspired me to get off my butt and make some rounds for mine. The plan is to whack a pig in the next couple of weeks.
I'd say you are keeping great company!
Edited by 470evans (20/09/16 02:29 AM)
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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A quick update:
Yes the Paradox arrived into my hands!
As I suspected from the photos before the purchase, it was covered with a layer of brown dried oil applied over the many years since it was born in 1893.
My judicious and very careful cleaning cleared away that old cruddy dried oil to reveal a like-new, unused masterpiece underneath. I haven't posted more photos because I haven't had the time to photograph this stunning example of art. But I will!
Well, I guess I did take one quick photo after cleaning. Here it is, but not well done. You can get an idea of how fabulously beautiful this gun really is without its brown coat of old dried oil:
Here's the "before cleaning" picture:

And here's the "after cleaning" picture, similar pose, very poor light with a lot of glare. All the original colors are there.

Quite a change, wouldn't you say?
I've spent a good deal of time gathering information about the Paradox guns and about proper techniques for loading ammunition for them. I bought a copy of Paradox, Vol. 1 by David Baker and Roger Lake and have read most of its interesting information also.
A prominent "gun person" who has an extensive collection of Paradox guns and much experience shooting them inspected my 10b and pronounced, "If you ever want to know what one looked like the day it was delivered from the Holland & Holland factory, this is the one to see." He was kind enough to supply me with a few bullets cast from his mold.
My "enabling friend", Watson577, and I cobbled together eight rounds for the gun and took it to the range on August 20, 2016. I let him do the honors of the first shots. Here is a video he made as I fired my first two shots from this gun:
Curl fires his first 2 rounds from his 1893 H&H 10b Paradox.
You will notice I got konked on the nose by my thumb knuckle on the first shot. My long ape arms and long neck prefer a little more wood!
My first two shots were fired at a target set at 50 yards. For never having pulled the triggers prior to those shots, the gun did reasonably well. Here is my target. The first shot (right) is in the black. The left was pulled a bit to the left. Load development and more shooting will refine my skills and the proper load.

I have ordered a mold, which I hope to have this fall. Watson577, the wizard who started this mess, has promised to help me with loading dies. It will all come together in due course and should be a passle of fun.
470evans, I wish I could take it afield in search of pigs. We don't have those critters in my neck of the woods. Maybe I will bowl over a white tail deer.
Stand by for more pictures, coming soon.
Curl
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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Here's a scan of the page devoted to the 10b Paradox from Holland & Holland's 1895 catalog:
And here's a close-up of the text on that page:

Curl
-------------------- RoscoeStephenson.com
YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27721
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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WOW! Such a piece!
-------------------- Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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470evans
.333 member
Reged: 30/03/05
Posts: 278
Loc: Texas, USA
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Outstanding Paradox! My son and I just got back from the range shooting mine.
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CptCurl
.450 member
Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5318
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
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There's more progress to report.
Mike Rowe made me a fantastic mould, which I received last week. Sunday I spent the afternoon casting bullets for my Paradox. By the end of the day I had 117 bullets.

Now I am waiting for a few loading tools. Once these are in hand I will be up and running with this interesting Paradox.
More reports as events occur!
Curl
-------------------- RoscoeStephenson.com
YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27721
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Well done, what do they weigh?
-------------------- Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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