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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Lee Speed Forum & Archive

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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
New Find - No1 by William Evans..!
      #277068 - 25/01/16 04:03 AM

Greetings Gents,

I'm just back from the Las Vegas antique arms show and wanted to share a few initial photos of my latest find - a lovely gently used BSA No1 retailed by William Evans. The rifles looks to be all original, no refinishing, no alterations of any kind, a lovely original and untouched example. Not perfect condition, dings and wear here and there but just signs of good honest use.

Interestingly there is non of the scroll engraving which is normal with these ribbed/heavy barreled No1 rifles. Details on this rifle put the date of manufacture right around the turn of the century (give or take a couple of years.

Of note; I especially like the checkering on the underside of the bolt nob and also the sliding safety which has a beautiful engraved 'SAFE'.

Hope you enjoy the pics.

Roy.





--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html

Edited by Roy (25/01/16 05:42 AM)


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CHAPUISARMES
.416 member


Reged: 16/01/08
Posts: 2908
Loc: DUBBO, NSW, AUSTRALIA
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277079 - 25/01/16 08:25 AM

Very, very nice



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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: CHAPUISARMES]
      #277083 - 25/01/16 09:05 AM

Thank you kindly for that Sir.

Here is a close-up photo showing the 'SAFE' engraving. I love the way it runs clean across the screw head and uninterrupted, with the screw slot running up between the letters too. Love the attention to detail of these old-time gun makers.

Cheers, Roy.



--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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VonGruff
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Reged: 08/02/09
Posts: 1119
Loc: South Otago, New Zealand.
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277086 - 25/01/16 10:59 AM

That is a beauty Roy. Look forward to the rest of the pics.

--------------------
Von Gruff.

Exodus 20:1-17

Acts 4:10-12


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: VonGruff]
      #277090 - 25/01/16 11:33 AM

Thanks for that.

Will be sure to sort out some better pics over the next few days.

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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AlanD
.275 member


Reged: 14/12/08
Posts: 55
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277101 - 25/01/16 03:44 PM

What a lovely rifle. You are cornering the Lee Speed market in America!

You may find William Evans are able to tell you who the original purchaser was for this rifle. They have extensive records in their shop. They may charge a small fee for this of course. Does the rifle have a secondary serial number that William Evans may have applied?

Regards

AlanD
Sydney


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: AlanD]
      #277102 - 25/01/16 03:51 PM

Hi Alan,

Thank you for that, it hadn't crossed my mind yet that some research could be done, I will certainly look into it. And 'yes' it does have their retailers number on the trigger guard, so certainly worth looking in to.

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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Bidgee
.375 member


Reged: 08/04/15
Posts: 711
Loc: Northern Rivers, NSW
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277107 - 25/01/16 04:26 PM

Roy, you suck

Seriously that is a lovely find, more power to you!! I wished we had the opportunity to come across finds like that here. There was a LS advertised here on used guns just before Christmas and the bloke that advertised was swamped by a tsunami of replies.

Keep up the search, cheers.


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Bidgee]
      #277128 - 26/01/16 01:32 AM

Thanks Bidgee,

A bit cheeky of me to post this beauty but hey what's a chap to do?

The show was great all around as I was able to meet up with a couple of LS enthusiast friends, so we were able to share some of our rifles, so some real eye candy in one place. If I get time I'm hoping to get to some more photography later today.

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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lancaster
.470 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8664
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277133 - 26/01/16 03:06 AM

excellent acquisition

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: lancaster]
      #277141 - 26/01/16 06:24 AM

Thanks for that Lancaster, very much appreciated.

As promised gents, here are a few more images for your interest and enjoyment. Apologies in advance as I really do struggle with rifle photographs, seems to have its own unique challenges.

A few of the details that I like are the 'safe' engraving shown above, the knurled bolt knob and how the top rib is raised at the foresight. The more I look at this beauty the more I love it.

Cheers, Roy.











--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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Bidgee
.375 member


Reged: 08/04/15
Posts: 711
Loc: Northern Rivers, NSW
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277144 - 26/01/16 07:22 AM

Quote:

A few of the details that I like are the 'safe' engraving shown above, the knurled bolt knob and how the top rib is raised at the foresight. The more I look at this beauty the more I love it.





I can understand that. It is a pearler of a find. Thanks for the additional photos, they are excellent!

Cheers


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Rule303
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Reged: 05/07/09
Posts: 4896
Loc: Woodford Qld
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Bidgee]
      #277149 - 26/01/16 09:18 AM

Roy you have picked up a very fine rifle there. I too love the attention to detail the old smiths paid. Very envious of such a good find.

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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Rule303]
      #277153 - 26/01/16 09:44 AM

Hi Gents,

Thank you all so much for the many kind words. Finding and owning these lovely old rifles is a joy but it is so very much nicer to be able to share these treasures with those who appreciate them.

My small collection now totals 'five' in all and aside from my early Greener which is a restoration project, the other four are in wonderful condition, so I'm pretty chuffed.

One of the aspects of collecting these rifles that I love is that it seems no two are identical, perfect for the collector but not the wallet, well you only live once!

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html

Edited by Roy (26/01/16 09:55 AM)


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Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277170 - 26/01/16 10:47 PM

Yeah, Roy, that's a beaut! You've definitely got the gift.

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: AlanD]
      #277177 - 27/01/16 02:19 AM

Quote:

What a lovely rifle. You are cornering the Lee Speed market in America!

You may find William Evans are able to tell you who the original purchaser was for this rifle. They have extensive records in their shop. They may charge a small fee for this of course. Does the rifle have a secondary serial number that William Evans may have applied?

Regards

AlanD
Sydney




Hi Alan,

Just to update you; I contacted William Evans and they have confirmed the records for this rifle still survive - it was completed on the 11th January 1904 and was originally sold the same year to Mr E.J. Hudson. I'm now in contact with them to purchase copies of the relevant records.

Thanks for the heads up on that Alan, I'm excited to now have the opportunity to add some history to this wonderful rifle.

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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Sarg
.400 member


Reged: 20/01/07
Posts: 1365
Loc: Nil
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Levallois]
      #277195 - 27/01/16 07:59 AM

Very nice rifle Roy, you are getting some beauty's together all right !

And a Hello to Levallois, he has had some beauty's to !


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Sarg]
      #277198 - 27/01/16 08:17 AM

Thanks Sarg,

Very kind of you to say so. I must confess I'm quite taken with this pattern of rifle, so very much hope I can find more examples when able. As for this William Evans example, I have ordered the original ledger details from the maker, so excited to see some more history.

In playing with a few images for my own entertainment I put together the attached image of the five examples I now have.

Cheers, Roy.



--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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Sarg
.400 member


Reged: 20/01/07
Posts: 1365
Loc: Nil
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277204 - 27/01/16 09:05 AM

That Evans is quite different, maybe they did more than most to that rifle, same for the Greener, but I do think Greener made a lot from scratch !

Nearly all the higher grade BSA/Lee Speeds have the exact same Butt stock, shape & fitting's, grip cap Horn !
The fore ends differed some .

The Evans looks different around the grip cap & it appears to be steel ?

I hope they can tell you more !

Thank you again for showing us your rifles !

Oh what is the Butt plate like on the Evans please ?

Edited by Sarg (27/01/16 09:07 AM)


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AlanD
.275 member


Reged: 14/12/08
Posts: 55
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Sarg]
      #277382 - 31/01/16 04:03 PM

The only two firms that could make a complete sporting Lee Enfield from scratch was BSA and LSA. Greener was not able to make the action, although they could make pretty much every other part.

Regards

AlanD
Sydney


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: AlanD]
      #277393 - 01/02/16 04:39 AM

Hi Sarg & Alan,

Thanks for that. Yes it is rather interesting, one of the perpetual aspects that keep out interest in that no two rifles seem to be the same.

The Evans rifle also has no engraving, odd for a No1 with ribbed barrel. But perhaps Evans requested the action plain and in the white, so they could finish as per customers wishes? I have not yet received the ledger details from Evans but will write and remind them later today, so they have it first thing (Monday) tomorrow morning in the hope it will 'jiggy' them up a little.

On careful inspection, I note that the rifle has the BSA serial number in four places (bolt, bolt handle, action & barrel) and the Evans number is in two locations (trigger guard and barrel).

Interestingly there is no marking to indicate the calibre! I am of course 99.99% sure it is .303" so don't suspect any surprise in that regard. I have heard of other example that have no calibre marking, so it's not unheard of - still rather odd and could you imagine that happening today?

While I was tinkering with it over the weekend, I gave it a good clean, and to my joy the bore came up really well. I had thought it a lot worse but most of that appeared to be just crud and dust, so aside from a small amount of freckling, it appears to have been not used too much and certainly consistent with the condition.

So fingers crossed to the ledger details soon!

Cheers, Roy.

--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html


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Sarg
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Reged: 20/01/07
Posts: 1365
Loc: Nil
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: AlanD]
      #277407 - 01/02/16 08:23 AM

Quote:

The only two firms that could make a complete sporting Lee Enfield from scratch was BSA and LSA. Greener was not able to make the action, although they could make pretty much every other part.

Regards

AlanD
Sydney




Of course I meant from a bare action when I said from scratch, 90+% only put there name on the dust cover or barrel, some may have made there own fore ends as so much difference in these, but in 8-9 of the ones I have or had & tens I have seen the Butt is the same .

Except Greener, I think one of the few main stream guys doing this, then a few Gunsmiths making up some on BSA/LSA or maybe even surplus actions, the engraving & sights are also a clue .


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Sarg
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Reged: 20/01/07
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Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Roy]
      #277409 - 01/02/16 08:35 AM

I'm thinking this Evans may have had more input from Evans by the looks of stock & no engraving !

Strangely I have a BSA action that has the high end ornate engraving & no machining on the side for volley sight & has the later BSA sporter type butt stock made in a higher grade wood with the bag grip, never seen this before, only ever seen that butt on plain later rifles ?


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Roy
.300 member


Reged: 06/09/15
Posts: 219
Loc: New Mexico
Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Sarg]
      #277486 - 03/02/16 10:50 AM

Hi Gents,

A follow up as promised. I heard back from William Evans and got a copy of the records (see attached).

Here is the details in the letter I got:

Dear Mr Shadbolt,

Thank you for your request for the history on William Evans gun no.6893.

From the index book I can tell you that the original gun order was for, Barrel, action, Filling in soft wood fpart. BSA. The gun was completed 11th January 1904, for Mr E.F. Hudson. Stocking, Sighting, Finishing, was completed on the 24th February 1904.

Sarg I think you were correct when you mentioned that they may have done more work than is usual, certainly the stocking of the rifle was no small task aside from the other work.

Not as much details as I would have liked but hey better than nothing at all.

Cheers, Roy.




--------------------
My Website: www.wilkinsonfscollection.com

http://wilkinsonfscollection.com/wilkinsonfscollection.com/The_Lee-Speed_Rifle.html

Edited by Roy (04/02/16 02:53 AM)


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Sarg
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Reged: 20/01/07
Posts: 1365
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Re: New Find - No1 by William Evans..! [Re: Sarg]
      #277514 - 04/02/16 07:49 AM

Roy, I wouldn't disparage that info, I think that is absolutely fantastic & I would be over the moon to have that amount of information on any one on my Old fire arms, great work by you & William Evans !

Yes I thought Evans had done most of the work on your rifle as it differed from the norm .


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