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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26516
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: Benchshooter]
#264490 - 03/05/15 12:53 AM

While CCI250's, Remington 9 1/2 magnum primers are quite hot compared to standard primers, Federal 215's, I think, have a longer flash - time span, that is, thus work better on hard to ignite powders for more complete initial primers.

What is strange though, when a parcial ignition or low pressure event happens, there is usually a lot of "soot" on the ctg. case.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Marrakai
.416 member

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: DarylS]
#264500 - 03/05/15 10:49 AM

FWIW my take is simply slow sealing of the case mouth in the chamber at firing.
As other have mentioned, this is usually evident at the shoulder or upper case body, and it happens every so often with my .400 Jeffery using "standard" regulating loads of AR2213.
Nothing to worry about IMHO; if in the case body or shoulder they pop out when next fired, if in the neck they pop out when sized.
Having said that, if they happen frequently, I would neck-ream the cases if thicker than standard, or at least neck-anneal, as they are possibly too hard in the neck area to seal properly. This is good house-keeping practice for case longevity anyway.

Of course, it could be the opposite....

Like Daryl implies, a partial ignition or 'low pressure event' will usually show up on the target. A minor chamber-sealing shortfall at the case-neck will likely not.

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
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www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Benchshooter
.224 member

Reged: 07/03/15
Posts: 11
Loc: Ohio

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: Marrakai]
#264526 - 04/05/15 01:53 AM

Daryl, You're right about the necks not showing the soot as they should with a partial ignition but the way they look in the picture is the way they came out of the chamber. They were not cleaned.
Marrakai, I'm hoping that when I receive my Lee factory crimp die, It may solve my problem along with the Federal 215 primers and I'll test out some Alliant Re15 along with the other changes.

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chuck375
.333 member

Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: Benchshooter]
#264580 - 05/05/15 12:01 PM

I had two hang fires (scary!) when I first started loading for my 500 Jeffery before I switched to Federal 215 primers and kept my loads with a grain or two of max. I'm shooting 570g TSX's at 2300 fps. No problems since. I had been shooting 535g Woodleighs (no fault to the bullet) at 2000 fps, too slow. These big cases want a hot primer and high load density.

--------------------
"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"

Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"

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albertan
.333 member

Reged: 13/06/06
Posts: 432
Loc: Alberta, Canada

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: chuck375]
#264655 - 07/05/15 12:32 PM

The hottest primer you can buy is the Winchester large rifle magnum primer. This is by any measure. The Federal was the hottest many moons ago, but the CCI 250 is so close to as to be the same.

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DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26516
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: albertan]
#264682 - 08/05/15 01:33 AM

The last test report on primers I saw was quite a while ago- maybe 1980's - the Fed 215 was not actually the "hottest" per say at that time, but had the longest duration of flame-out - which developed the higher temps due to the time duration of the flame - thus was better at igniting the slower powders.
This longer flame front was why it was the preferred primer for the larger cases & slowest, hardest to ignite powders.

Times change and so do components over the years.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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albertan
.333 member

Reged: 13/06/06
Posts: 432
Loc: Alberta, Canada

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: DarylS]
#265203 - 19/05/15 02:29 PM

If your cases are basically full and you are still experiencing ignition problems, Pierre van der Walt recommends that you place 2 grains of Unique on top of the primer with cases that hold up to 130 grains of water, and 3 grains of Unique (or Hodgdon Universal) for cases above 130 grains of water capacity. the .505 Magnum Gibbs holds about 178 grains of water. Mr. van der Walt emphatically stated that no ball powders are to be used as an ignition supplement; flake only for this procedure. A Lee dipper would be handy for this procedure. He also stated that you start with the minimum loads and work up when doing this. This is one hell of a book and I recommend it to all who shoot, hand load for, or own large bore dangerous game cartridges.

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Benchshooter
.224 member

Reged: 07/03/15
Posts: 11
Loc: Ohio

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: albertan]
#265375 - 22/05/15 10:06 AM

I haven't had a chance to try out my most recent changes but should be able to get to the range next week, I hope. I'll keep that tip in mind though. I found an earlier thread where someone was also complaing about hangfires in his 500 Jefferies. He noted that the freebore in his chamber throat was so long that when the bullet made contact with the lands, the base of the bullet was 1/4" out of the case mouth. After checking mine out, I determined that when seated to the correct cannelure seating depth, I still had .647" left to the lands. I am using the Lee factory crimp die now so I think that will make up for some of my hangfires plus I'm using Federal 215s now and also a filler for anything under 128 grs as Woodleighs manual claims. I also loaded some with a little faster powder. We'll see.

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Rule303
.416 member

Reged: 05/07/09
Posts: 4917
Loc: Woodford Qld

Re: Anyone run into this problem? [Re: Benchshooter]
#265386 - 22/05/15 04:30 PM

One of the most popular reloading manuals in Aust. is writen by Nick Harvey. His sarting load for a 525grian projectile in 505Gibbs is 132grians of AR2213sc for 2260fps.

The case necks look like there was not enough pressure to seal them to the chamber wall.

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