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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Rifles
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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263179 - 06/04/15 08:10 AM

A good quality 3-9x40 is all the scope necessary for any big game hunting situations out to any range anyone has any business shooting at big game.

If you cannot do it with a 3-9, then more experience is needed.

At most, a 3-10X40 or 3-10x50 with stadia wires will be good. I suggest Leupold, Burris or Swarovski.

Long range shooting at big game brings forth hunting ethics questions in many people.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263197 - 07/04/15 01:06 AM

Good day Daryl S
No, I will not do long range hunting on animals...I am more looking at longer distances hunting up to 300 meters with the 8x68 rifle with heavy bullets for good penetration...the 8x68 will shoot out to 350 meter at a flatter trajectory than the 8x57JS or the .308 that fall substantially at that range..even slightly lighter bullets will still give good penetration...my next question:

The type of stock ?
Traditional stock, straight back with cheek piece? or Ultra modern long range stock like a GRS stock?

I am waiting for your opinion...

Regards

Gert

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263200 - 07/04/15 03:10 AM

As for a stock, straight comb - US style - Boyd's 'Jon Sundra' is a good general design. A cheek piece is not needed, imho. Too, I prefer to shoot with a straighter neck and back bringing the gun up to my eye, so a slightly higher mounted scope suits me better (if the comb is high)than a low scope that makes you angle your face and push your cheek into the comb too hard. Too hard a cheek weld is not my preference. Snapping the gun to your shoulder should have the crosshairs on what you were looking at as you mount the rifle.

The pre-CZ BRNO 7x57 is a good design - for me. Stocked for open sights, but fits perfectly with a scope.



--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263214 - 07/04/15 04:29 PM

Hallo Dryl

I will have to choose between a classic stock and a modern type like a GRS rifle stock. Since it is a longer than normal distance hunting rifle I will not shoot with open sights (I have enough open sight rifles) there will not be sights on this rifle it then seems the logical thing will be to use the GRS stock...since I will only fit a scope...





Edited by GPJ12345 (07/04/15 04:36 PM)

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263215 - 07/04/15 04:38 PM

My 8x68S has a Zeiss 1 1/2 - 6 x scope on it. I like scopes with a lower range power close to 1x .

I agree with Daryl, a 10x is the upper limit I would use on a hunting rifle.

I would use a classic stock. GRS ??? No way on a hunting rifle.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (07/04/15 04:39 PM)

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: NitroX]
      #263243 - 08/04/15 02:21 AM

GRS - to me, that is a target, or varmint stock. I cannot see it having a use nor 'place' on a hunting rifle.

The Mann. appears to be a perfect platform.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263245 - 08/04/15 03:01 AM

John/Daryl

Looking at the two photos the Mannlicher Schoenauer looks the perfect stock as you pointed out...sleek and beautiful...I will be able to make my own rifle stock duplicating this example...dis-advantage of GRS stock with our weak South African currency it is near impossible to purchase such a stock...maybe I should make sights as well just to round off the whole project. At least I do have time to work on the action ....thank you again for the input , it really is much appreciated ...

Next Question:
Recoil damper/Mercury Recoil Reduction system in the butt of the stock?

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263249 - 08/04/15 03:43 AM

Daryl
I missed something you mentioned earlier....9.5x68..??? Tell me about this caliber...is it a .375 x68??? Photos of this rifle please, some info regarding the history???

Gert

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Yochanan
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263255 - 08/04/15 04:50 AM

Gert,
I suggest you read Hatari Times article "The long rifle" by Harald Wolf. I would go for a 28 inch long barrel in a classic mauser profile and classic stock.

I got the article on file but cannot email it until Friday as I'm on the move.
There is range of wildcats based on the x68 case.
Cheers
Y

--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: Yochanan]
      #263256 - 08/04/15 05:15 AM

http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=0&Number=165772&an=&page=0&vc=1

Submitted by RigbyMauser:

H T Romancing The Long Rifle
2.8Mb PDF

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: NitroX]
      #263259 - 08/04/15 06:03 AM

Yochanan/John
Thank you very much, it really is an excellent write -up about the long rifle....I have a 8x57JS Turkish small ring Mauser with a step barrel 30" long excellent bore..looks brand new, have been standing in a safe for the past twenty five years until a good friend gave it to me...I still need to work out a specific pet load for it, but at least I have one long rifle and will build another 8x68 long rifle....

Edited by GPJ12345 (08/04/15 06:14 AM)

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263275 - 08/04/15 10:36 AM

Quote:

Daryl
I missed something you mentioned earlier....9.5x68..??? Tell me about this caliber...is it a .375 x68??? Photos of this rifle please, some info regarding the history???

Gert



You have mail.
Daryl

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263285 - 08/04/15 06:39 PM

Quote:

Next Question:
Recoil damper/Mercury Recoil Reduction system in the butt of the stock?



Personally wouldn't bother. Just a solid recoil pad.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: NitroX]
      #263295 - 08/04/15 10:00 PM

Yes , John, I think with the solid American Wall-nut blank I have(it really is heavy and solid) and the straight, sleek design stock like the Mannlicher Schoenauer in the photo ...there will be less recoil, I will use a heavy barrel as well, I hope it do not have any dis-advantage on the sleek design of the rifle stock....Daryl, thank you , have received mail, like I said I am impressed with your idea to use the 9.5x68 configuration ....

How appropriate will a silencer be on such a 8x68 rifle?

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263333 - 09/04/15 04:30 AM

Good day members
I will not make use of a silencer....here is the technical data regarding the type of barrel I am going to order for this self build project.

Here is the specifications regarding my 8x68 barrel I am going to order..I presume the rifling twist will be 1:10..I will just make sure bout this small detail...


Barrel blank special rifle steel 8mm 10", Ø=1.26", L=28.19"

External contour: #5130 "Mauser Type E" 28"

Breech thread: System 98 thread

Muzzle details: muzzle hunting style

Chamber details: 8x68 S chamber

Comments/opinions will be welcomed as usual..

Gert

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263364 - 10/04/15 03:10 AM

Good day members

Regarding the seating depth of the 220 gn bullet usually use to get peak performance from the 8x68 ...I looked at the 91mm opening up of the Mauser 98 action from a usual standard action opening..it will be possible to get to 91mm opening up of the action...as well as milling out the magazine well /floor plate from a solid billet to compliment the opening up of the action and facilitating the feeding of the total length of the 8x68 round bullet seated to receive an over all length of 91 mm.

Reading through the posts ...numerous contributors pointed out the need to seat the 220 gn bullet out to an over all length of 91mm ....this type of procedures is going to include extensive milling work ...before I commence I really need your opinions regarding the improved velocities/optimal performance of the 8x68 round in relation to firing a 8x68 round seated to be shot from a standard action...please give me a detailed motivation and discussion in this regards...as I pointed out ...it will be extensive milling work and I really need to be sure there will be a noticeable difference to commence with this procedure...I know the Germans designed the 8x68 to be used in a standard Mauser 98 action....

Regards

Gert

Edited by GPJ12345 (10/04/15 03:16 AM)

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263403 - 11/04/15 01:58 AM

Good day members. I did discussed the opening up of the action with Johan Greyling , my mentor, he suggested I should rather work out duplex loads for my 8x68 caliber rifle and not opening the action . He is sure I will get the required speed by using duplex loads....we in South Africa do not have the many different powders and slow powders you have in your country. By combining a slow powder with a fast burning powder I will be able to get to the velocity I want.

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263405 - 11/04/15 02:30 AM

YIKES!

I do not, will not, attempt that - beyond me & my short 47 years in handloading.

I also find it interesting, that duplex/triplex loading was only attempted once that I am aware of, with the .454 Casull Handgun, and that this practice disappeared within a couple or three years of it's inception/declaration. Why? Is it too dangerous for sporting arms? The .454 Casull handgun was a 60,000PSI gun, yet did people still had trouble with it and the duplex loadings?

I have never heard of this type of loading being successful in rifle ctgs. I suspect if it were, manufacturers would be using it, especially the American ctgs., to have Faster and Faster ctgs. I suspect type of loading is fraught with danger.

Instead, new powders are developed to produce higher speeds and ballistics- like the VV line and some that Hodgdon is marketing, like Leverrevolution, CFE 223, 4007C, 8208XBR and the even newer and slower powders released this year.

I do, however suggest that a suitable action is acquired that will allow full length magnum loading - perhaps a P-14 or Model 1917 Mauser, or a Brevex Mauser action.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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m4220
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263408 - 11/04/15 04:57 AM




I had always wanted a rifle in this calibre & that I didn't have a fortune in, so I bought a nice early tang safety Ruger M77 with Redfeild scope chambered in 30-06 as my donor gun. I disassembled & removed the barrel & replaced with a Delcour 1-11 twist 24 5/8" chambered in 8x68S & fitted the barrel channel in the stock, stripped the bolt & machined the bolt face to propper diameter & reworked the extractor, replaced the mag. box with a .338 box from Ruger with minimal metal fitting work & none to the stock in that area. Head space was checked with PTG go & no go gauges.
Works great with all factory ammo I have run thru it. My handloads are using Norma MPR driving Norma 227 grn SP @ 2700 fps, have have also loaded some woodleigh 220 grn @ 2600 fps as that is max velocity Woodleigh recomends for that bullet. I am quite happy with how all turned out & that I was able to do all the work.

m4220

Edited by m4220 (11/04/15 05:05 AM)

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pacecars
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: m4220]
      #263440 - 13/04/15 02:09 AM

Growing up and thumbing through the Steyr-Daimler Puch catalog I dreamed of owning a Mannlicher Model S in 8x68s with the spare mag in the butt.

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: pacecars]
      #263454 - 13/04/15 03:22 AM

You have a beautiful rifle..enjoy it , you are fortunate to possess such a caliber..like the 8x68 , it really is a caliber I want to build myself...but after all the opinions and advice from the members I am going to wait for a magnum action. My other option is to purchase a .300 H&H Magnum in a good condition form a friend of mine...he is willing to sell this rifle to me at an excellent price , remove the .300 barrel and insert a 8x68S Walter barrel...I am sure the 300 H&H Magnum action will be suitable for me to achieve the required OTL ...

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263455 - 13/04/15 03:37 AM

The .300 H&H extractor for .532" nominal rim size may or may not work with the 8x68's .512" nominal diameter rim.

If the action of the .300 is a Mauser, the claw extractor might work just fine, or a replacement could be found to work.

The magazine itself has a good chance of functioning/feeding properly in my opinion, for what that's worth? HA!

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263456 - 13/04/15 04:47 AM

Hallo Daryl

I think it still will be the best route to go, less metal work, opening the action will be bypassed...I will need to look at the extractor, since I think it is a pre 64 winchester Model 70 . 300 H&H Magnum ...I will go and take a look , just to be sure...

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DarylS
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: GPJ12345]
      #263457 - 13/04/15 04:57 AM

It is possible nothing will need to be done to the extractor. By that, I mean it might work perfectly as-is. Too, due ot the slightly smaller rim, the bolt might close over a round "thrown" into the chamber ahead of the bolt,then the bolt closed - that is something to "test" - carefully, you do not want to break the extractor.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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GPJ12345
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Re: 8x68S caliber hunting rifle popular? [Re: DarylS]
      #263514 - 14/04/15 01:25 AM

Thank you Daryl

I will take a look and see if it will be a problem...first I need to purchase the rifle and work from there...I will keep you updated...

Regards

Gert

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