Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact
NitroExpress.com: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures

View recent messages : 24 hours | 48 hours | 7 days | 14 days | 30 days | 60 days | More Smilies


*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***

Hunting >> Hunting in the Americas

Pages: 1
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures
      #260470 - 14/02/15 01:13 PM

September 2014 hunt report
Days – 14/9/14 travel day 15/9-24/9/14 hunting days 25/9/14 travel day back to hotel
Outfitter – Vince and Lisa Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures Ltd
Guide – Tyson Musil of More Musil guide service
Area - Total Outdoor Adventures Bull river north guide area southern British Columbia
Tags – Bull Elk, Mule deer, black bear and Wolf

Introduction
I’ve been hunting for over ten years in Australia and on several overseas guided hunts and have never had a more disappointing experience than dealing with Tyson Musil of More Musil guide service and Vince and Lisa Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures Ltd. My reason for doing this is to hopefully stop anybody else having an experience like I have recently had. I’m utterly discussed with the way the majority of this hunt was conducted and the way I was treated after paying close to $9000.00 US dollars for a 10 day guided hunt.

Back round
In Mid 2013 I began researching booking a rocky mountain elk hunt after lots of research I decided that I wanted to hunt in the rut to experience the bugle in a wilderness area with the use of horses. The Kootenay region of BC seemed to be the area where this type of hunt could be conducted after contacting several outfitters and contacting their past clients I was told by several other Australians that I should get in contact with Tyson Musil of More Musil guide service. I contacted Tyson Musil of More Musil Guide service below is his description of his operation from his initial email to me.

I only book hunts I can personally guide myself, that way I can ensure you are going to have a good hunt. You can book a hunt with the best outfitter in the world but if you have a shitty guide you’re going to have a shitty hunt. I only book in areas that I have guided in for years and know well so you know you’re going to see game. Long story short I'm putting my personal name on the line every time so if the hunt didn't go well then I can make it right at the end of the day. I can't guarantee you’re going to kill but I can guarantee you'll be in great area with a lot of elk, you will see game every day and you'll be in a first class camp with exceptional gear and horses.

Booking
After talking to several references I decided to book a hunt for September 2014 Tyson recommended Vince and Lisa Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures guide area. Tyson stated he knew the area like the back of his hand and had experienced an above average level of success it was described to me as 500 square KM area with a single access logging road that received little resident pressure and the residents that did hunt the area only hunted of the road usually using quad bikes. I was told that for the duration of my hunt I would be the only guided hunter in the area I was told by to expect plenty of elk action as well as seeing other game animals on a daily basis. I was sent a contract from Vince and Lisa Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures that was paid in full by the dates in the contract.

Hunt itinerary
The plan and what unfolded were quiet different before leaving Sydney Australia I was told I would be picked up in the early morning from my hotel in Calgary on the 14/9/14 driven to Total Outdoor Adventures main south camp (3hr drive) where we would pick up the food and horses/horse float then drive to the north camp and pack for 3- 4 days in the mountains then spend the remainder of the day riding into a high basin set up camp for the night then hunt the following morning this way I would have 10 days of total hunt time with a day each side getting in and out of the area.

Ankle Concerns
Around 2 months before leaving Sydney for this hunt I started getting ankle problems from an injury that occurred 2 years ago after seeing a specialist and getting a MRI I was told I had severed a main ligament and had a fair amount of cartridge damage. I described the trip I had planned based on information from Tyson Musil the doctor said he was okay with me going as long as I was cautious and explained if I severed another ligament I would require surgery to be able to bare any weight on that foot. I quickly informed Tyson Musil via a phone call and communicated my concern he assured me we could ride the horses to all the elevations he planned to hunt and said I would just need to communicate with him during the hunt any limitations I had and he stated he could go as fast or as slow as I wanted.

Wasting the 1st day
I had arrived in Calgary the previous day and was expecting to be picked up at 8am from my hotel as discussed via text with Tyson Musil before me leaving Sydney. I bought a prepaid sim and called Tyson several times that day and night trying to confirm the pickup time every call went straight to his voice mail. At around 10 pm that night I received a call from Tyson he said one of Total Outdoor Adventures guides had quit the day beforehand leaving a client with 1 day left on his hunt and he had been in the bush all day filling in guiding the client. He then went on to describe the hunter as a typical useless fat unfit American this was the start of plenty of unprofessional behaviour and bad attitudes that I was to witness over my time spent with Tyson Musil and Total Outdoor Adventures. I asked if he was still picking me up at 8am Tyson said he would be there at 11am as he had some things to do beforehand and to not worry as we had plenty of time to get up into the mountains before dark. Tyson Musil picked me up at 11am as we made our way to Sparwood he received a call on speaker phone from a work colleague from this call I found out that Tyson Musil had been sleeping with Lisa Cocciolo (the wife of the Outfitter who’s area we were hunting in) when he was finished with the call he spilled the beans and said that Vince Cocciolo had found out what was going on in the last week or so and that they had already had an altercation and that Vince Cocciolo had threatened his life so with me thinking to myself “what have I got myself into here” we drove to his father’s house in Sparewood where he picked up some gear we would need on our hunt then we picked up his personal gear from his house we then spent a good hour at a local workshop where he had to get a toe ball welded to his truck so that we could toe the horse float we were to pick up. By this time it was around 4 pm I was wondering how we would manage to get into the mountains before night fall as we were obviously wasting the day with things that should have been sorted out beforehand Tyson Musil assured me we had plenty of time and that all would be fine.

Meeting the Outfitter
Next we met Lisa Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures at a super market when I was introduced to her (the Outfitter I had paid for this hunt) she barely said hello and continued shopping so the three of us casually wasted another good hour or more picking up food for our hunt as well as food for others in their south camp. Once the shopping was taken care of she pulled out some documents for me to sign and my tags.

Catching horses
By the time we had arrived at the horse float we were to use in Total Outdoor Adventures southern area it was late afternoon we then had to wait for Lisa Cocciolo for quite some time Tyson Musil explained to me that we would have to catch some horses as they had only caught enough for the hunters in the south camp before the season had started and Lisa Cocciolo knew where the free horse would be grazing. By the time she arrived and we had the horse float attached it was close to dark I was thoroughly disappointed by this stage by the care free attitudes and the in efficiency so far. We found the horses who took off at our first attempt to catch them Tyson Musil said to turn his truck around and drive back the way we came he would follow them on foot. Somehow I managed up driving! Lisa Cocciolo’s attitude through the whole time I spent in Total Outdoor Adventures area seemed to be “somebody else can take care of it” (this coming from one of the owners) a half hour later in the dark she had guided me to a dead end not big enough to turn around in due to the toe ball only being fitted that day we quickly found out that it was quiet easy to jack knife this truck/float combination and very difficult and time consuming to fix after fixing the issue Lisa Cocciolo managed to quickly jack knife the trailer again more time wasted. The end result was me and Lisa Cocciolo taking turns reversing the truck and float downhill on a logging road for the next hour. When we finally found Tyson Musil he had not found the horses he dropped me at a walk bridge at around 10.30pm and said I’ll keep looking until midnight walk over to camp see if they can feed you if I’m not back by midnight find a place to sleep. So I walked over to the main south camp with all my gear feeling greatly disappointed.

South Camp
When I walked in the door of the main cabin there was 5 or six clients sitting in one corner looking miserable and a similar number of guides on another side of the room I said hello and barley got a response there was a Australian couple and another Aussie guy that recognised my accent and asked me who I was and why I was there. I filled them in when I asked if they were hunting the couple said that they were guiding and the other Aussie guy was helping with a bit of everything I asked if they had much experience hunting elk they replied it was there first time hunting them (so Total Outdoor Adventures to the best of my knowledge had two virgin elk hunters guiding paying clients). Shortly after my arrival the clients went to bed some of the guides and the cook stayed awake I introduced myself and told them that I was hunting with Tyson Musil after they knew I was a paying customer they began to bring up the following topics regarding Total Outdoor Adventures operation

1. The fact that Lisa Cocciolo was having an affair with Tyson Musil and that her husband Cocciolo was un contactable and had left them to run his operation and so far the season was a disaster
2. They didn’t have a competent wrangle in camp only a girl in her late teens who had started that day without any experience working as the wrangler
3. The fact they had no hot water so far that season due to a fixable issue with the plumbing/water tank
4. The fact that the lady cooking was Vince Cocciolo’s mother who had planned on having a holiday at their camp and instead had been cooking full time for everyone to hold up the fort
5. That they had 5 or six clients in camp with a day or 2 left on their hunts and only one elk had been harvested

I sat in disbelief listening to all this made me sick after a while the Australian girl came back and told me which bunk to sleep in I waited till around 1am for Tyson Musil to come back which he never did so I went and laid down to a the first of many sleepless nights worrying what else could go wrong not the best start to what was supposed to be a hunt of a lifetime.

The Next 7 days
Below are some of the key points that made this a terrible experience I ended up leaving on the 7th day as I had no wish to spend another 3 days with Tyson Musil
1. Tyson Musils general bad attitude regarding me the hunt and that he felt he would get paid for the hunt due to sleeping with the outfitters wife.
2. Tyson Musil having an attitude of keep up or get left behind regarding most of the hunt
3. Tyson musil treating this hunt and me as a inconvenience rather that a paying customer
4. Tyson Musil Physically mistreating the horses eg kicking and punching them to get them to co operate
5. Tyson Musil trying to convince me on several occasions to take animals I did not have tags for if I gave him additional funds
6. Tyson Musil telling me if I want to shoot a goat/moose he would get resident tags and make out he took the animals at a later date for legal reasons
7. After 7 days of riding into high basins then calling, glassing and walking game trails I had not heard one single bugle or seen one mule deer only 2 cow elk and a 5 point immature bull as well as one immature black bear
8. On the nights we spiked out Tyson musil after stating he had top of the line camping gear never brought a tent or even a trap when it was requested
9. I’ve never seen so much hunting pressure plenty of locals camping with horse floats along the bull river road (I was told this area received little resident pressure)
10. The North camp which I told had running hot water did not it had been damaged by a flood several years ago and only party repaired
11. The horses had not been ridden since last year and had a bad temperament and were un fit
12. Tyson Musil claimed to know this area like the back of his hand, on the second day of hunting he took me to an area he admitted he had never been to before
13. Apart from the first trail we used the others seemed to have not been maintained in a few years with plenty of dead fall to negotiate

After the Hunt
After returning to Sydney I contacted Vince Cocciolo of Total Outdoor Adventures and said I had concerns regarding my hunt I was promptly contacted by Tyson Musil who begged to keep the matter to myself I asked for a refund which he agreed to then came back and threatened me with legal action if I was to post what happened. I then contacted Vince who after being informed of what I experienced has stopped replying to my emails.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: NSW_HUNTER]
      #260481 - 14/02/15 04:12 PM

Sounds typical to what one reads a lot

Did you check references/referees? I assume you did. What were their "connections" to this guy? (ie seeing all the Aussie guides etc in the camp).

Sorry to read how it all went. Very disappointing when one is looking for a trip of a lifetime.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Waidmannsheil
.400 member


Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2377
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: NitroX]
      #260516 - 15/02/15 08:58 AM

This sort of experience seems to happen a lot with guided hunts all over the world. Unfortunately many hunters do not end up going on these trips of a life time for fear of having a similar experiences. I have to say that you seem to have had a really torrid time, sorry to hear that. The part about no local hunting pressure and when you get there seeing a gazillion locals seems to be pretty common.

Waidmannsheil.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3987
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Waidmannsheil]
      #260521 - 15/02/15 10:28 AM

NSW_HUNTER
Bloody terrible to hear you got such a bad deal, lets hope your next one is a much more pleasant experience! Hope the foot gets better soon matey, ligament damage can take a lot of time to repair; surgery may be your only option.
Better to get it fixed rather than blow a valve out in the sticks & put yourself at risk.
Keep the practice up, you can't go on your next hunt looking like a novice!
It'll happen for you - I bet the lads out there will be able to set you onto a proper outfit that will look after you no matter what game you're after & what continent!
93x64mm


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Rell
.375 member


Reged: 03/12/04
Posts: 642
Loc: Oyster Bay, NY, USA
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: 93x64mm]
      #260528 - 15/02/15 03:09 PM

I feel your pain and I'm sorry you had a terrible experience.

--------------------
450-400, 9.3x74r and 7x65r.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Old_Glass
.300 member


Reged: 17/03/10
Posts: 113
Loc: BC, Canada
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Rell]
      #260535 - 15/02/15 06:41 PM

I'm embarrassed, and that's just because I'm Canadian. I'm truly sorry you had that experience; especially an Aussie. To go half way round the world and get that kind of treatment in this country? Disgusting, and I would hope, unusual. A great many of the guiding outfits in BC are German or Austrian owned and I suspect a much higher degree of professionalism than what you describe would be in evidence in most of those outfits, sad to say.

There is a provincial Guide Outfitters Association in BC. They've been in the news a lot lately because many BC hunters are upset that the Guide Outfitters Association is lobbying the provincial government to give them a much larger share of the total licenses for certain large game in BC. Quite a lot of money has been donated to members of the Legislature by members of that Association.

Edited by Old_Glass (15/02/15 06:56 PM)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: NitroX]
      #260631 - 17/02/15 09:07 PM

John
Yes I did check several references I actually was checking another outfitters references and one of the guys I called put me onto Tyson Musil. From my understanding the Australians were meant to be doing a bit of everything in camp but after other guides quit they started guiding.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Waidmannsheil]
      #260632 - 17/02/15 09:10 PM

Quote:

This sort of experience seems to happen a lot with guided hunts all over the world. Unfortunately many hunters do not end up going on these trips of a life time for fear of having a similar experiences. I have to say that you seem to have had a really torrid time, sorry to hear that. The part about no local hunting pressure and when you get there seeing a gazillion locals seems to be pretty common.

Waidmannsheil.




Thanks Waidmannsheil
If more people exposed operations like this it would reduced chances of this happening in the future


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: 93x64mm]
      #260633 - 17/02/15 09:12 PM

Quote:

NSW_HUNTER
Bloody terrible to hear you got such a bad deal, lets hope your next one is a much more pleasant experience! Hope the foot gets better soon matey, ligament damage can take a lot of time to repair; surgery may be your only option.
Better to get it fixed rather than blow a valve out in the sticks & put yourself at risk.
Keep the practice up, you can't go on your next hunt looking like a novice!
It'll happen for you - I bet the lads out there will be able to set you onto a proper outfit that will look after you no matter what game you're after & what continent!
93x64mm




Thanks Mate
Yeh no big overseas hunts this year I will chase elk in the future after what I've seen I would say it will be in the US


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Rell]
      #260634 - 17/02/15 09:13 PM

Quote:

I feel your pain and I'm sorry you had a terrible experience.




Cheers Mate


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NSW_HUNTER
.224 member


Reged: 31/07/09
Posts: 40
Loc: NSW Australia
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Old_Glass]
      #260635 - 17/02/15 09:16 PM

Quote:

I'm embarrassed, and that's just because I'm Canadian. I'm truly sorry you had that experience; especially an Aussie. To go half way round the world and get that kind of treatment in this country? Disgusting, and I would hope, unusual. A great many of the guiding outfits in BC are German or Austrian owned and I suspect a much higher degree of professionalism than what you describe would be in evidence in most of those outfits, sad to say.

There is a provincial Guide Outfitters Association in BC. They've been in the news a lot lately because many BC hunters are upset that the Guide Outfitters Association is lobbying the provincial government to give them a much larger share of the total licenses for certain large game in BC. Quite a lot of money has been donated to members of the Legislature by members of that Association.




Thanks Old Glass
I hope a change is coming its sad to see any area over hunted and exploited for financial gain


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Rule303
.416 member


Reged: 05/07/09
Posts: 4913
Loc: Woodford Qld
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: NSW_HUNTER]
      #260675 - 18/02/15 05:46 PM

Sorry to hear you got stuffed. I have become a bit sceptical of referees that the guide offers you. They could be good mates, those that had the exception of a hunt or paid. I try and get on the forums to find out.

Best of luck next trip.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Ripp
.577 member


Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: NSW_HUNTER]
      #260685 - 19/02/15 01:04 AM

Quote:

Quote:

I'm embarrassed, and that's just because I'm Canadian. I'm truly sorry you had that experience; especially an Aussie. To go half way round the world and get that kind of treatment in this country? Disgusting, and I would hope, unusual. A great many of the guiding outfits in BC are German or Austrian owned and I suspect a much higher degree of professionalism than what you describe would be in evidence in most of those outfits, sad to say.

There is a provincial Guide Outfitters Association in BC. They've been in the news a lot lately because many BC hunters are upset that the Guide Outfitters Association is lobbying the provincial government to give them a much larger share of the total licenses for certain large game in BC. Quite a lot of money has been donated to members of the Legislature by members of that Association.




Thanks Old Glass
I hope a change is coming its sad to see any area over hunted and exploited for financial gain




Sorry to hear of this what appears to be a pathetic hunt..had a similar experience the first time to Africa in 2004--hunted with a crew run by Lloyd Yateman out of Zim..worst hunt I have ever been on..

If you ever plan to come over again for elk let me know, I can get you set up with a couple of guides I know that are honest and legit

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26510
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: Ripp]
      #260691 - 19/02/15 03:25 AM

Well put, Old Glass - I am deeply sorry this happened to you NSW.
Every hunt I've been on in the past, the guides have worked their butts off for the comfort and satisfaction of the clients. Have we ever been skunked? - yes - the wolves howling all night long tells the story why - a shock for us as well.
So sad.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Cazadero
.375 member


Reged: 17/10/11
Posts: 561
Loc: Texas
Re: Negative hunt with Tyson Musil and total outdoor adventures [Re: DarylS]
      #266735 - 20/06/15 12:41 PM

Don't be embarrassed because you were cheated by a slimy operator and a low-life individual.

I can tell the same story about my South African experience.

There are good people out there, you just have to keep looking for them.

Sorry it happened to you.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1



Extra information
0 registered and 21 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:   

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating:
Topic views: 4833

Rate this topic

Jump to

Contact Us NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5


Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact


Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved