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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap
      #260467 - 14/02/15 11:00 AM

I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap

Hello All,

As you have seen, lately my interests have shifted to Big Bore rifles. I found this one on an on-line auction while I was searching. Its really neat when you discover one where the seller has no clue what he has.


Here is how it was described in the original auction listing.



The description also included a lot of the other usual info about: good bore, good wood, etc., etc.

Well, I never heard of a "Full" Magnum Length Interarms, and when I searched the Net trying to find examples of one, I was stumped. Here are the pictures that were listed in the auction.











After much searching and comparing the shape of this action, to pictures of various Interarms Actions that I located on line, I was sure this was NOT an Interarms Action. The only thing I could see that remotely resembled Interarms, was the sliding safety.

Well, I had a 'hunch' what this was. Could it be? I watched this rifle for the full 14 days of the Auction. That was a very, very long 2 weeks. And, in the last minutes of the Auction, I placed my bids. After a couple of back-and-forth bids, I was the winner! - $720 - My total cost ... $755 delivered to Wisconsin. It was 2 days before Christmas, so this was a Christmas present from myself - to myself. Perhaps the close-Christmas timing kept the other would-be-bidders too busy to find this treasure.

Here is what I found when it arrived home ...

A very nice Magnum Length BREVEX Mauser action - you can barely see the "M400" model marking and the "/92" serial number stamp. It looks like these were partially removed during the final "squaring of the action bottom and the finishing process during the rifle's build.



and .... with a SAKO trigger..... This explains the sliding side safety that looks similar to the Interarms safety.





and ..... a LES BAUSKA barrel..... This was also a surprise. Les Bauska was a famed barrel maker and worked with Buhmiller during the 50's and 60's ... likely when this rifle was built. He was known for his superb Octagon Barrels.







I topped the rifle with a compact 2x-7x Burris Scope, which brought the shooting weight to just a tad over 11 pounds. The perfect weight for a 416 Rigby.

Lots of people ask me how I find so many rare collectibles. And some people call me Lucky - they are wrong. I credit my findings to a bladder problem. As I age, I find myself getting up several times a night - to pee. Before I go back to bed, I do a little WEB Surfing. The search engines run pretty fast at 2 o'clock in the morning. All the reading makes me sleepy, and I go back to bed until the next urge wakes me. And that's how I found this one.

Thank Goodness for a small bladder.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."

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Ash
.400 member


Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1653
Loc: Australia
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: buckstix]
      #260469 - 14/02/15 11:54 AM

$755 for a magnum action alone is a steal! Nice score! I like the octagonal barrel.

--------------------
.

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Rule303
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Reged: 05/07/09
Posts: 5063
Loc: Woodford Qld
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: Ash]
      #260487 - 14/02/15 05:23 PM

That is a real nice find. Like the rifle and the calibre.

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rglenz
.300 member


Reged: 14/03/08
Posts: 136
Loc: w. Minn
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: Rule303]
      #260495 - 15/02/15 12:20 AM

Nice barreled action,good find,_ you can use can use the grip to plow snow.

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DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2437
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: rglenz]
      #260496 - 15/02/15 12:59 AM

Looks like standard Gunsmith School product. Especially the Semi California laminated stock. We all built at least one exotic of some sort.

Brownells sold these Interarms Mauser actions in a number of different lengths. The last being the mini-Mauser.

Bauska Barrels were a common trade item in the schools. Bauska barrels were less expensive than most, readily available and in some interesting contours. All basic requirements for a struggling student. They all shot good.

I built several 338/06 and 338/06AI's with those actions and Bauska barrels. Number of the barrel makers over there in Kalispell trained under Bauska and moved on out on their own.

Bauska Barrels were not marked like this. They followed standard trade practice and marked them on the breech end with maker and barrel data.

I know Bauska from time to time followed the practice of Ackley and Barnes and took in apprentices to build rifles and learn the trade, then sold the rifle under the Shop name. That Les Bauska name indicates to me this rifle came from Bauska's shop. Whether Bauska made, Apprentice made or just a barrel install, I have no idea. (Shortly before his death, Chick Donnelly and I had a long conversation about how some of the current crop of well known custom gunsmiths worked their way through college back in the late 40's and early 50's building guns for Ackley, Barnes and several others. Donnelly being one.)

Laminated stock is similar to what was coming from a stock maker who was in that valley back in the mid late 80's.

There was a guy several years ago years at the Kalispell Gun show who was offering something similar. A three board laminated stock with the two outer layers fancy figured and the center kind of a holder for the out side pieces.

You got this rifle at a very good price, enjoy.

Edited by DoubleD (15/02/15 02:10 AM)

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27014
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: DoubleD]
      #260499 - 15/02/15 04:00 AM

I met Les in 1975, in his shop in Kalispel and spent the better part of a day with him in the shop, watching the planing of flats on ML barrels and I spent a few hours straightening a number of barrels on the multi-pegged barrel staightening machine - what a day that was too.

I also bought a dozen ML barrels from him. While there, I talked with old John on the phone - John B. had a stroke and had just fallen. Nice gentleman - and good friend of Les B. and Les H. The fall was to be his demise - talked briefly with his wife as well, who was concerned about Irene Hawkes living so far North.

That brings us that we all had a mutual friend in Lester H. Hawkes, formerly of Kalispel who moved to Northern BC with is most charming wife, Irene, in the 60's. They lived in the house that Les built on Walcott road, between Houston and Telkwa, B.C. I was posted at Smithers Detachemnt when I met and became friends with the Hawkes.

At one time, Les B. built scaled up Ruger #1 actions and barreled them up in .600 Nitro. I do not know how many were built - mid 1970's?

That .416 Rigby is a great find and nicely priced. Thanks for bringing back those special memories.
The stock should be very stable. I wonder if they used Resorsinal for the epoxy? The almost black glue lines would indicate this.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: DoubleD]
      #260508 - 15/02/15 05:29 AM

Quote:

Brownells sold these Interarms Mauser actions in a number of different lengths. The last being the mini-Mauser. DoubleD




Hello DoubleD,

Its not an Interarms action, its a BREVEX action made in Suresnes, France from 1955-1965 by M. Polonsky (an engineer from the Radom plant in Poland) using captured German machinery taken from Oberndorf by the French Troops (Gal. Leclerc 2nd DB) and delivered by the M.A.S. (Manufacture d'Armes de Saint-Etienne) before being sold to Polonsky circa 1951. This was the only true Magnum Mauser length action available to the trade in the years folowing WWII. They were imported and sold exclusively by Tradewinds. Here is a 1955 GUNS Magazine ad from Tradewinds.





Here's my rifle with the compact 2x-7x Burris Scope.

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lancaster
.470 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 9052
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: buckstix]
      #260538 - 15/02/15 09:38 PM

new to me there was a Mod 300 and 400 brevex action
what was the difference? only the bolthead?

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: lancaster]
      #260541 - 15/02/15 10:52 PM

Hello lancaster,

Thanks for the reply,

Yes, I believe that was the only difference, the bolt face. According to the ad, you could specify a standard Mauser Wing safety, or a Commercial shroud with a sliding side safety for scope use. Not sure if they came that was from France, or Tradewinds swapped out the safeties / triggers.

Two of my Brevex actioned rifles have standard Mauser Wing safeties, two have Commercial shrouds with sliding side safeties, and one, the 450 Ackley Mag, has a Commercial shroud with no safety at all. That one has since been upgraded with a Winchester style 3-position safety.



--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."

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DoubleD
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Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2437
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: buckstix]
      #260543 - 16/02/15 01:00 AM

Yes could also be a Brevex as Brownells sold both.

Did you find markings on the action to indicate Brevex? All I saw in your pictures is a possible date code /92.

Interarms like Tradewinds were just importers. Interarms also brought in Brevex. I believe there were a couple of other makes also.

The last batches imported by Interarms were Yugoslavian, and they included Magnum length actions. All of us at school had a least one Magnum action. The popular cartridge for us then was the 416 Remington. I recall at least one .500 Jeffery being attempted. Don't recall the outcome of that one.

In the schools there was a lot swapping and trading of components to make that "special" custom rifle. Changing of bolt shrouds-fitting a Winchester wing safety being the most favored change. Trigger fitting being the second common change.

These actions were absent the rail cut out and military wing safety to avoid ATF military rifle designation. There remains controversy over this action as ATF has issued several different rulings about them. (Post GCA 68 of course) I don't know the current status, but I do know at one time in the recent past ATF was refusing the import of any 98 Mauser action and any sporting rifle made with a 98 Mauser action. ATF took the position, that rules only allowed importation in the original configuration, not sporterized. I don't know the current stand on this, however.

This ruling is of course a backdoor attempt at gun control affecting a very small group. Why take a big bite when you can nibble away and eventually eat the whole cheese.

Les Bauska also had made and imported from China, some Magnum Mauser style actions. They were huge. At one time I had several of them. I never fit one up as someone was always offering me stupid money for them.

Back to this rifle, I stand by my opinion, that it came out of Les Bauska's shop.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

Edited by DoubleD (16/02/15 01:04 AM)

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buckstix
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Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: DoubleD]
      #260545 - 16/02/15 01:49 AM

Hello DoubleD,

If you look closely at the photo I posted, you will see the "M400" marking also, albeit light, above the "/92" stamp. All BREVEX actions were stamped "M300" or "M400". The "/92" is NOT a date code, it is the action's serial number. All BREVEX actions were serial numbered. Numbers from "03" through "455" are known. The "1092" serial number was added later by the rifles builder and also appears on the side of the action. It was a common practice to incorporate the action serial number into the rifle's serial number. Several of my BREVEX Mausers have serial numbers ending with the last 2 or 3 digits of the action's serial number.



There are also several other distinctive features which identify this action as a true BREVEX, not least of which is the 45 degree angle to the front of the triggerguard, and the cut-through anti-bind rail, amongst others.

Tradewinds was the "sole" importer of BREVEX actions. BREVEX actions were made "only" by M. Polonsky in Suresnes, France from 1955-1965 by using captured German machinery. This is a well documented fact, not my opinion.

Roy Weatherby was one of the earliest to use BREVEX actions on his first 378 Wby Mag rifles in 1955 - 1956, but there after used only his own Mark-V after it was introduced in 1957.

Yes, Interarms imported actions, but they were not the "Full Length" Magnum actions. Interarms actions were designated as "magnum" to identify "Long" actions with bolt faces cut for "Magnum" cases. Only into the 1980s did other manufacturers begin making "True" Magnum Length actions again.

As to your reference to the 416 Rem Mag., this cartridge was not introduced until 1988, a full 25 years after the importation of the French BREVEX actions ceased. (see this Wikipedia reference)

"...The .416 Remington Magnum is a .416 caliber (10.36 mm) of a belted bottle-necked design. The cartridge was intended as a dangerous game hunting cartridge and released to the public in 1989. The cartridge uses the case of the 8 mm Remington Magnum as a parent cartridge. When the cartridge was released in 1988...

Yes, it is possible that Bauska built the rifle. Also, one of the other forum members suggested that Merlin "Mel" Smart did the stock. Apparently He and Les Bauska worked together on projects such as this and both were residents of the Flathead Valley in Montana at the time. Mel's laminated stock design was the precursor to what Kilimanjaro Rifles now makes.

http://kilimanjarorifles.com/history.html

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."

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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 9052
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: buckstix]
      #260572 - 16/02/15 07:59 PM

when you think only 455 + brevex actions were made its amazing how important they were in the end for the post war gun trade

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: I found a real SLEEPER - unidentified 416 Rigby - real cheap [Re: lancaster]
      #260601 - 17/02/15 01:58 PM

Hello lancaster,

Yes, we assume at least 455 were made based on that being the highest number recorded to date. My highest action serial number is 431, and the lowest is 42, with 92, 281, and 302 in between.

As I mentioned yesterday, I made changes to my BREVEX 450 Ackley Mag. This rifle was built without any safety. I generally don't like to mess with the History of a piece, no matter how it looks. I think its important to preserve the builder's ideas of the times. However, the lack of a safety was totally unacceptable. Safety is one of the few things that will cause me to alter a vintage piece.

In this case I added a Winchester Style 3-position safety; the type with the little lock-bar built into it. This feature of a "safety for the safety" is similar to the stalking safety found on my Dan'l Fraser double rifle and my Alex Henry falling block. I'm told this type of "double safety" was intended to keep the gun bearer, who was carrying your rifle behind you, from accidentally bumping off the safety, and shooting you in the back. Sometimes called the "Gun-Bearer Safety".

Pictures below show before and after - and after close-up.




--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."

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