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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
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Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Old Indian hunting grounds
      #25759 - 06/02/05 11:02 AM



--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
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Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25760 - 06/02/05 11:03 AM



--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25761 - 06/02/05 11:04 AM



--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25762 - 06/02/05 11:05 AM



--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25763 - 06/02/05 11:09 AM

These are pictures of the way it used to be in India. A heavy morning with hunters going out for greylag with their best Holland and Hollands, Bosses or Purdeys.

The hunting has long been banned though the old hunting preserves are now still very valuable sanctuaries.

I shall be inviting the owner of this beautiful spot to post more pictures not only from recent times but also from the old days. Hope you enjoy this and Good Hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25789 - 07/02/05 01:14 AM

Thanks Mehul.

When I am sitting on some wetlands in a couple weeks time I will think on these.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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Taos
.300 member


Reged: 09/05/04
Posts: 169
Loc: Nevada, U.S.A.
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: NitroX]
      #25796 - 07/02/05 05:05 AM

Mehul,


Very nice photo's. More please!

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: Taos]
      #25804 - 07/02/05 11:00 AM



--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #25805 - 07/02/05 11:01 AM

In the old days, it would have been a gundog waiting to retrieve greylag or bar headed geese.

It's enough to bring a tear to the eye!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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ThomasEdwards
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Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 246
Loc: Newport Beach, CA
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26756 - 24/02/05 03:05 PM

...thanks for posting the beautiful pictures...truely the golden age of yesteryear's safari applies equally to safari on the indian subcontinent...

...i recently read that india is once again opening the country to safari, albeit photo-safaris for now...any thoughts on whether 'turnbolt' and 'double' safari's for the general public can be far behind?...

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Mpofu
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Reged: 02/01/03
Posts: 140
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26770 - 24/02/05 09:46 PM

Just got back from a long sojourn of the length and breadth of India.
Mehul, the wetlands in the pics looks like the Bharatpur bird sanctuary.
I spent a few days at Bhandavgarh Tiger reserve, the old shooting grounds of the Maharajas of Rewa, and home of the white Tigers. We had the privelige of close up views of tigers on three days running. Pretty incredible stuff, in particular, we saw a tigress stalking a herd of Chital in the valley below, she was doing well till the Langurs (monkeys) spotted her and put up the alarm call.
I have a bit of footage of a tigress taking exception to an elephant (laden with tourists)getting a bit too close, she clears the front of the ele, and takes the mahouts arm off in one bite.
I will try and get it loaded up for this forum.
M.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39259
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: Mpofu]
      #26777 - 25/02/05 01:26 AM

Welcome back Mpofu. Long time no see.

Glad to hear you are still journeying in that land.

I would be glad to host any videos you deem appropriate. The one you mention sounds interesting if a bit gruesome and unfortunate for the mahout.





--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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iqbal
resigned as a member


Reged: 05/02/03
Posts: 778
Loc: Karachi,Pakistan
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: Taos]
      #26779 - 25/02/05 01:53 AM

Mehul,why has the Indian gov.banned all hunting i.e.of non endangered species like ducks,partridges etc.There must be a reason,after all the fees collected from hunters can be put to good use like preservation etc.Can you throw some light on this?

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26780 - 25/02/05 01:58 AM

So the scene of wetlands with the lovely dog (what a great picture of one's dog BTW - worth framing) is the same wetlands as the other photos further up. I note there are stone steps near the dog. Is one of the hotels or palaces near the stone steps or is it a boat landing of some sort?

Now I have a question. Many actually!

When waterfowl hunting was permitted, how was it conducted? were the birds shot from boats, from hides, were beaters (with snorkels perhaps ) somehow employed? Was the waterfowl flight shot, or attracted by decoys? Any nasties, such as crocodiles in the water?

The dog, is it a dalmation or another breed, a gun dog perhaps?

Just interested.






--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Mpofu
.300 member


Reged: 02/01/03
Posts: 140
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: NitroX]
      #26789 - 25/02/05 02:37 AM

John,the dog is a dalmation, not perhaps the best water dog, as opposed to a labrador.
I have done a fair bit of wildfowling in north India,many moons ago. The shooting I enjoyed most was for bar head and greylag. It was basically flighting them at full moon, as they came into the small irrigation lakes (known as Jheels) which were set in the middle of farmland, mainly gram and peanut fields.One still does a fair amount of wildfowling in selected areas.
The video clip of the tiger was taken by a Jap tourist, and because of the nature of the attack,it has been treated as extremely sensitive material. I have e-mailed the person who gave me the clip, and if he feels comfortable with it, I shall send you a copy. It is pretty dramatic stuff,particularly the way the tigress clears the ele's head with some considerable ease, to get to the mahout.
M.

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: ThomasEdwards]
      #26795 - 25/02/05 03:37 AM

ThomasEdwards,

The state of Chhatisgarh recently sold some wild boar permits to non Indian hunters for $ 50 each. But I have no idea whether they continue to be available.

There is a huge overpopulation of Nilgai in some of the North Western states and I have been hearing about a proposal to allow non Indian hunters. Farmers have been given licenses to hunt them recently. I shall post here as soon as I have any further information on this.

Good hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: iqbal]
      #26796 - 25/02/05 03:42 AM

Iqbal,

Pheasant hunting is allowed in Kashmir and Himachal Pradesh but only to residents there. No idea why other hunting is banned but technically only crop protection hunts are permitted in most parts of India. If an animal/bird is destructive of agricultural crops it can be hunted, or else it cannot.

Good hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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RHB
.300 member


Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 136
Loc: India
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: NitroX]
      #26797 - 25/02/05 03:43 AM

Hello John,

All of the above pics are of the same lake that is part of the Summer House. The house is about 150 to 200 yards from the lake.

He intends putting up a few tents 12 feet from the parapet wall.

No crocs in this water body though they did have a pet croc called Casper. The blighter did a runner one day and somehow found his way to another of their lakes many miles away.

From what I have read of waterfowl shooting in the old days, they were always shot as the flights came in or when they moved to another part of the waterbody. I suppose one could always have put them up with a well aimed stone after the guns had taken their position.

Rustam

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: Mpofu]
      #26798 - 25/02/05 03:49 AM

Mpofu,

The pictures are from a private property at Pivnia. In the same state as Bharatpur - the owner is a former Royal and a friend of mine. He is an infrequent visitor here and at the AR forums and does post occasionally. This is one of three lakes on his property and his old palace and hunting lodge have been converted into heritage resorts in Rajasthan.

While you were at Bandhavgarh, all tigers in Sariska were shot by poachers and 19 were poached at Ranthambhore. I would not at all be surprised if they ebcome extinct in India in the next decade. Sad and it makes me very angry at overall Indian incompetence, corruption and stupidity in preserving the country's wildlife.

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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RHB
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Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 136
Loc: India
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26799 - 25/02/05 03:50 AM

Hi Mehul,

I am no longer sure about the legality of pheasant shooting in J&K or Himachal by its residents.

My friend (the bloke who is selling his Jeffery .450/.400) is married to a Kashmiri and goes there once a year. I asked him if pheasant shooting was allowed but his answer was in the negative. He could well be wrong though.

Rustam

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: NitroX]
      #26801 - 25/02/05 03:54 AM

NitroX,

There was no formal bird hunting in the old days as far as I am aware. The driven game hunts were for tigers and leopard.

The dog looks like a Harlequin Dane from behind to my eye - not like a Dalmatian from the structure. But I may be wrong.

Speaking of crocodiles, the Gharial is almost extinct in most of it's former terrain though huge numbers of crocodiles have been bred in several Forest department Reserves in places like Sathanur. India won't allow their hunting or farming for their skins because it is a country where PETA's Jason Baker is a national celebrity.

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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ThomasEdwards
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Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 246
Loc: Newport Beach, CA
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26839 - 25/02/05 03:08 PM

...appreciate the info, mehul...

...please keep us updated on sporting opportunities (even eco-safaris) on the subcontinent...i would think many would be interested in retracing kipling's footsteps...

cheers.

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Mpofu
.300 member


Reged: 02/01/03
Posts: 140
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #26842 - 25/02/05 07:48 PM

Mehul,
Anyone walking around with a firearm in Kashmir would be very brave or stupid, given the current situation there. The bottom line is, there remains a cmplete ban. As far as nilgai in Northern India is concerned, the word Gai ie cow would explain what would happen if the locals caught you shooting one, other than the farmer whose crops are actually being damaged.
I do believe that human pressure on the tiger population, and the poaching of their natural quarry is the main threat to Tigers, not the actual poaching of the tigers. I for one would not agree with the hunting of these beasts, as the forests which provided 'fair chase' of these beasts simply do not exist anymore.
You need only to go to the Zambezi valley and see the sheer number of plainsgame and uninhabited areas to realise why hunting there is so good, and justifiable.
The main cause of tiger destruction in India is the poisoning of cattle lifters by local people.
I know that whilst I was there, a few weeks ago, the Lions of the Gir forest were wandering into villages looking for food, this was put down to their increasing numbers in a very small area of natural habitat.
M.

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RHB
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Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 136
Loc: India
Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: Mpofu]
      #26847 - 25/02/05 08:46 PM

Hello Mpofu,

I heartily agree with all you have said, barring one point, and wish there were more like you over here.

The point I am unsure about is that poaching, encouraged by countries to the North and East, isn't taking a relatively large toll of our tigers. Somehow, I very much doubt the entire tiger population of Sariska was exterminated by villagers using poison on the charge of cattle lifting.

If your future trips should bring you to Bangalore, do please get in touch.

Regards,

Rustam

P.S.: Nilgai shooting may not be as risky as you may think. Depends on the area though. However, apart from pest control reasons, I cannot understand why people bother about them - they make poor sport.

Edited by RHB (25/02/05 11:55 PM)

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: Old Indian hunting grounds [Re: RHB]
      #26850 - 25/02/05 10:57 PM

Having personally seen sizable quantities of tiger bits for sale in markets in Northern Burma plus leopard bits etc etc there is definitely a black market for poached tigers. Whether these animals came from India, China or elsewhere in SE Asia I have no idea. The market stall holders did not like cameras one bit.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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