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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Discussion Forum
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jt
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Reged: 15/03/13
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mauser claw mounts
      #250221 - 09/07/14 10:17 AM

I am only beginning to learn about commercial mausers. did a search but haven't found anything yet. so are claw mounts considered safe dovetailed on the front ring. I have seen many photos of mausers that have mounts done that way.

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Marrakai
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250260 - 10/07/14 09:06 AM

Don't like it personally, but the proof, as they say, is in the pudding.....

A great many fabulous Mausers, Mannlichers etc have survived a century of hard use with deep milling of the front ring.
Well, many decades at least....

Couldn't bring myself to do it today though.

For one thing, many Euro sporters have crests, engraving, or vintage text on the front receiver ring, and cutting into it would probably be considered vandalism by most posters here.

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jt
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Marrakai]
      #250263 - 10/07/14 10:46 AM

thanks marrakai for your response.no I would not do that either.but I saw many mausers in photos where folk obviously shot those rifles and I thought it must be ok even tho it would be I think right above one of bolt lugs thinning that area considerably. thanks john

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lancaster
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250265 - 10/07/14 03:27 PM

Speed "Mauser: Original Oberndorf Sporting Rifles"





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DORLEAC
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: lancaster]
      #250271 - 10/07/14 11:07 PM

Notice that for the factory mounted scopes Mauser used receivers with large ring and inside small shank (same diameter than on the 96') and that the dovetailed front base didn't weaken the barrel assembly.
Also, the German proof house standards are extremely high and severe and would not have tolerated such a fitting if they have had any suspicion of weakness.
Later, the actions were square bridged on the front ring to ease that kind of mount.

DORLEAC
www.dorleac-dorleac.com

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jt
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: DORLEAC]
      #250272 - 11/07/14 12:51 AM

dorleac would the mauser model b in 30-06 also be large ring and small shank.thanks john

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Igorrock
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250274 - 11/07/14 02:09 AM

Quote:

Notice that for the factory mounted scopes Mauser used receivers with large ring and inside small shank (same diameter than on the 96') and that the dovetailed front base didn't weaken the barrel assembly.

This means that all those actions should be "Intermadiate actions" i.e. similar as military Turkey 1903 and Peru 1909.

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DORLEAC
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Igorrock]
      #250279 - 11/07/14 04:44 AM

No, they are standard length actions and I have encountered a lot !

DORLEAC
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Igorrock
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: DORLEAC]
      #250284 - 11/07/14 06:52 AM

Do you have any idea which type name Mauser factory use with these large ring -small shank actions ?

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jt
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Igorrock]
      #250285 - 11/07/14 07:27 AM

with that set up would a mauser model b 30-06 be safe to shoot.john

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Tentman
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250298 - 11/07/14 02:39 PM

Well if its any consolation to any of you, I shoot my Kurz (small ring) 250-3000 with a factory reciever dovetail at +P load levels (117gn at 2800fps) and have done for years with no problems.

I'll happily buy any rifles with such a dovetail if you are too scared to shoot them.

Regards
Foster

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Igorrock
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Tentman]
      #250299 - 11/07/14 03:36 PM

I just read from J.Speedīs Mauser book that receiver with large ring and inside small shank is very typical especially to Kurz actions and factory made .30-06 caliber rifles.

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DORLEAC
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Tentman]
      #250300 - 11/07/14 03:39 PM

Indeed, if factory scoped, the rifles are safe to shoot with either the 30-06GVT, the 8x60S, the 7x64 Brenneke and the like...
As I wrote earlier, the German proof house would not have tolerated any suspicion of weakness.

DORLEAC
www.dorleac-dorleac.com

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Lutz
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: DORLEAC]
      #250302 - 11/07/14 05:21 PM

Quote:

the German proof house would not have tolerated any suspicion of weakness.
DORLEAC



Today they don't accept mounts like that at all. So that many old Mausers with claw mounts in the front ring are nearly worthless in Germany.

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Ahmed577
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Lutz]
      #250308 - 11/07/14 10:36 PM

Do any members have a picture/s of dog leg style claw mounts fitted to English double rifles. Purpose to facilitate correct eye relief. Purdey are looking at this on a 300 h&h fl & 5.6x52r double rifle projects.

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jt
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: Ahmed577]
      #250313 - 11/07/14 11:59 PM

i appreciate every thing posted about claw mounts. i am new to german mauser rifles and the reason i started this thread is because i am looking at an original oberdorf mauser model b in 30-06. it is in very good shape and i mentioned it in another post.every serial number matches and is said to be all original except it does have the claw mounts dovetailed into the front ring.there are no rings for it.and i am wondering if it would be safe to shoot.headspace can be checked but since the claw mount may or may not be a factory installation i know of no way to determine if the rifle is safe to shoot or not.i have no photos at this time.the previous owner bought it but never fired it.it has good open sights.the bore is near perfect and everything looks good to go.thanks john

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deepwoods
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250410 - 14/07/14 10:20 AM

jt, Of considerable importance is whether or not the rifle is a square bridge action. Being a square bridge with the dovetailed front claw mount in the receiver ring would mean it most likely (but not necessarily) was done at the factory (the dovetail). Not being a square bridge would mean it was most likely done by a gunsmith (but not necessarily). There exists factory square bridge rifles with uncut front rings that were never scope mounted. The most common scope mounting on model B's you see is the double claw mount where the front is dovetailed into the ring and the rear is screwed to the bridge. Most of these were not done at the factory (from what I understand) according to Speed's book. Not being done at the factory would mean it would not have been proofed at the Oberndorf proof house and most likely not proofed at all. Mauser was proud of their scope mounting design and promoted it (the square bridge with mortised push button rear mount and dovetailed front claw mount). Speed does state that different scope mounts could be special ordered from the factory. But as stated if scope mounting was desired after the rifle left the factory it usually tends to be the double claw mount done by a gunsmith. See picture above.

Edited by deepwoods (14/07/14 10:31 AM)

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jt
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: deepwoods]
      #250436 - 15/07/14 12:55 AM

deepwoods thank you for your very good response. i have the rife in possesion but am not at least at this time able to take photos and i hope i havent drug this out too long but it has been very helpful to me. here is what i think i have. first the rifle appears to have been used very little. it two good cleaning sessions using wipeout for 24 hours each time there was only a little black and grey on the patches and no blue not a speck. so i guess i had a little powder and carbon fouling but no sign of any copper. the gentleman who sold me the rifle had it in possession for 20 years and never once fired it.it came from a collection in africa.i am very happy with the gun.once the headspace is cheeked i will fire factory ammo in it.could do this remotely. anyway it is not a square bridge but round front receiver.so i would think the work was done outside the factory. it would seem to me if someone went to the trouble to fit bases surely they had a scope on it and fired it some tho i certainally dont know this at all. but i dont think it could have been used much. i would think any problems would perhaps show up later thru more use. really nothing outstanding about the rifle except it is really in good shape wood and bluing and bore. serial # 101xxx. thank you all so much. john

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deepwoods
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: jt]
      #250470 - 15/07/14 10:16 AM

Congratulations on your model B rifle. If the rifle has a good bore and does not look heavily used and abused and the bolt is original to the rifle, then head space should not be an issue. Usually headspace becomes an issue when barrels are changed and bolts are not original to the rifle-like military k98 bolt mismatch rifles.

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HeymSR20
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Re: mauser claw mounts [Re: deepwoods]
      #251086 - 27/07/14 07:11 AM

Only down side to claws on the front receiver ring is the position of the back of the scope. Claw mounts have to be fitted at the front of the scope to allow them to tip forward. Claws in the front receiver are fine for a very short scope, but if you want anything more powerful you really need the front claws mounted in a barrel band. Germans tend to shoot very head up with just the jaw touching the stock and you often see old mausers with scopes mounted and far back.

Recknagel do make a swing mount that retrofits into old claw mounts so if you find an old rifle you can still mount a more modern scope quite nice and low.

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