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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238756 - 06/12/13 01:16 AM

Quote:

I was amused the other day as well looking through the new Nosler reloading manual --in ALL of their loads they show for the 264 W-they are using a 24" barrel..WTH?? are they that incompetent or just that ignorant??? and yet in some calibers where a 26" tube really isnt needed..they use one..wonder sometimes who is in charge to this stuff??




I never see the point of any rifle with a "magnum" large capacity case to bore size cartridge, having a barrel less then 25 inches. What's the point? Unburned powder? If using a shorter barrel rifle, a standard performance cartridge is just as good, as was pointed out earlier.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238757 - 06/12/13 01:18 AM

Quote:

Zeroed at 350 yards, the 26 Nosler® has a Point Blank Range of 0-415 yards.




Wow.

I can hear that barrel burning though.

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John aka NitroX

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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238758 - 06/12/13 01:19 AM

I really don't see where this is giving a huge increase of performance on the .264 Win...you can easily handload the Winchester to 3250-3300 with a 130 gr bullet..but anxiously waiting to find out more..think the .264 caliber is an amazing one...

As to buring barrels.. like Melving Forbes once said while shooting p-dogs..the guy next too him said Melvin was shooting too fast and will ruin his barrel..Mr. Forbes said I may never get a chance to ever do this again, but they are still making new barrel's..

Exactly..

Ripp

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DarylS
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238773 - 06/12/13 03:20 AM

An old friend of mine "wore out" a .270 Winchester (Belgium Browning) in 700 rounds - 2" of smokey throat erosion ahead of the chamber and groups opened to 1 1/2" - 1/2" larger than his 'maximum' allowable grouping. I assume he must have shot it VERY hot & as well, he was also using 'old' Hodgdon 4831 data for his new IMR4831 powder. He was only having slightly sticky extraction and the brass didn't last well - 3 or 4 shots, but locals told him that was normal??? He was recording 3,100fps with 150 Sierra BT's, which happened to be his favourite moose bullet at that time. One shot through the lungs, dead moose - straight down. He is a good shot.

I re-barreled his Belgium Browning with a Pac-Nor 26" tube, got him straightened around on his loads and he's getting just over 2,900fps with the 150 Sierra's. He says it kills just as well as it did before, of course and it will put 5 into a sub 1" group at 200 meters with double bags.

Standard calibres do well with long barrels too.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: DarylS]
      #238776 - 06/12/13 03:47 AM

I remember my gunsmith friend who had necked down a 300wsm several years ago to 6.5--had really good success in terms of both velocity and accuracy..this was before he 270WSM showed up..which would make it even easier now...

Ripp

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Con
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: DarylS]
      #238793 - 06/12/13 07:10 AM

Quote:


Standard calibres do well with long barrels too.




Yes they do!! And even better when 'slippery' high BC projectiles are put through them, with the newer slow powders. 24" barrel on my 270Win, heavy dose of Rel22, 130grAccuBond ... I dont need a fast 26cal.

But if this Nosler cartridge is based on a shortened RUM case, I'm buying a reamer!!
Cheers...
Con


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Con]
      #238800 - 06/12/13 07:47 AM

Quote:

Quote:


Standard calibres do well with long barrels too.




Yes they do!! And even better when 'slippery' high BC projectiles are put through them, with the newer slow powders. 24" barrel on my 270Win, heavy dose of Rel22, 130grAccuBond ... I dont need a fast 26cal.

But if this Nosler cartridge is based on a shortened RUM case, I'm buying a reamer!!
Cheers...
Con




When has "need" ever had much to do with getting a new gun???

I have a .270 or two as well..along with 6.5's..but the thing I have read over and over is, given the same muzzle velocity out of both calibers..at around 350 yds..because of the superior BC and SD, the 6.5 takes over and never looks back..have never tested it, only have read it..

Ripp

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500Nitro
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238801 - 06/12/13 07:49 AM

"given the same muzzle velocity out of both calibers..at around 350 yds..because of the superior BC and SD, the 6.5 takes over and never looks back..have never tested it, only have read it.."


How many people seriously use a gun past 350 yards ?

or even 500 yards ?

Some competition shooters ? They are in a breed unto themselves.

Hunters ?
Probably not that many.

Edited by 500Nitro (06/12/13 07:50 AM)


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szihn
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: 500Nitro]
      #238812 - 06/12/13 12:38 PM

The reason I like the 270 better is pretty basic.
I compare apples to apples.
There is not an argument that the best of the .264" VLD Target Bullets have an advantage in their flight characteristics over about anything else short of a 408 Chytac and the 50 Browning target bullets.
However I don’t shoot targets for any reason other than to zero in my hunting rifles.

Hornady makes a hunting bullet in .277” that goes a bit over .500 BC. There are a FEW .264” bullets that top that number, but dang few and ALL of them are target bullets.

So for a dedicated paper punching rifle I am sure I would also go to the 6.5 in some configuration.

But that kind of shooting bores me.
I have nothing at all against those that love it, but I just don’t.

When it comes to HUNTING, the 270 has shown me that it lacks nothing within the range of body size animals I’d use it against and about any range up to about ½ mile.
And there are a lot of GOOD long range HUNTING 270 bullets to choose from.
And there is no argument that a bullet that shoots 8” flatter at let say, 500 yards is of NO advantage to one that shoots 5” lower unless you can hold the difference.

So if my 270 shoots a few inches lower at a given range than a 6.5, it makes no difference if I hold a few inches higher.

If you can’t hold the difference then you should not be shooting at all at an animal.

A slightly better BC holds it velocity a bit better than a slightly lower BC. That can help with group shooting. Animals (or men) don’t let you shoot groups. I have no need for that supposed advantage. However a bullet that acts like a hunting bullet on impact instead of a target bullet?
THAT is an advantage I can and do use.


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: szihn]
      #238814 - 06/12/13 01:32 PM

Quote:

The reason I like the 270 better is pretty basic.
I compare apples to apples.
There is not an argument that the best of the .264" VLD Target Bullets have an advantage in their flight characteristics over about anything else short of a 408 Chytac and the 50 Browning target bullets.
However I don’t shoot targets for any reason other than to zero in my hunting rifles.

Hornady makes a hunting bullet in .277” that goes a bit over .500 BC. There are a FEW .264” bullets that top that number, but dang few and ALL of them are target bullets.





Not sure where you are getting your information from but the above statements couldn't be further from being accurate--I can name several "hunting bullets" that are over .500 bc--go to noslers web site and look up accubond-they have the standad and long range versions that both exceed that..or the swift scirrocco that is around .570 or in that range--or the Berger hunting bullets..140 gr at .612bc compared to .487 for a 270 in the same bullet configuration and weight..

There is no way the Jack O'Connor favorite in .270 even comes close to the same ballistics in the .264 caliber given the same velocity ..whether you are shooting at paper or animals..neither of which bore me..each to their own, but if I can get an extra 8, 10 12, or 16 inches over another caliber at given ranges I will take it..increases max POA along with several other advantages with todays available optics --IMHO, the 270 gets much more credit than it deserves..
--
==============================

As to the other statement...shown below..by 500..

How many people seriously use a gun past 350 yards ?

or even 500 yards ?

Some competition shooters ? They are in a breed unto themselves.

Hunters ?
Probably not that many.




---==================

Out where I live and those who I hunt with, depending on the species hunted, conditions, etc..quite a few actually shoot past 350...actually considered a chip shot by many...maybe to those who only hunt in forests or really close cover it seems long..but to those who live in the Western US..not considered a extreme range by anyone I hunt with at 350...agree once you get to 500 it starts thinnig the herd a bit..but is still done..and by those who practice alot and often and aware of the conditions..not that difficult to be done..my wife shot her antelope this fall over 500 with a 22-250...with a Tikka T3 lite..

I am not stating everyone should be out taking shots on game at distances they are not familiar with..and each to their own..but things have changed, optics have changed, rifles have changed, and technology has changed...a 300 yard shot isnt what it was 20 years ago..as long as people do their homework and practice what they preach. I shoot game with my bow under 20 yards and with my rifle at times under 100 as well..depending on where and what I am hunting..

So if the above is true..then I guess the west hunters I know are in in a breed to themselves..

Ripp

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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

Edited by Ripp (07/12/13 02:29 AM)


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DarylS
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238817 - 06/12/13 02:36 PM

I shoot past 350 yards every year I head out for field rats - and those little high B.C. .172" 25gr. Vmaxs do a wonderful job (way under .300) as well as the low B.C. 20 gr. Vmaxs at just under .200. That is where I do long range shooting. Here, one is more likely to get a 30 to 100 yard shot at a moose, or 50 to 100 yard shot at a deer, than anything past that range.

Iron sighted rifles work just about as well as scoped rifles - just ask the Captain - that's Cpt. Curl, of course!

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: DarylS]
      #238853 - 06/12/13 09:15 PM

Quote:

I shoot past 350 yards every year I head out for field rats - and those little high B.C. .172" 25gr. Vmaxs do a wonderful job (way under .300) as well as the low B.C. 20 gr. Vmaxs at just under .200. That is where I do long range shooting. Here, one is more likely to get a 30 to 100 yard shot at a moose, or 50 to 100 yard shot at a deer, than anything past that range.

Iron sighted rifles work just about as well as scoped rifles - just ask the Captain - that's Cpt. Curl, of course!




That is exactly correct..I read an article not too long ago by Barnsness who was mentioned in another post on this site earlier this week that had stated he has shot p-dogs out to and beyond 7-800 yards...what is a very very long poke..further that any I have attempted..but it is done...

Ripp

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szihn
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238927 - 07/12/13 08:31 AM

OK Ripp, I did as you suggested.
I went to Nosler's web site and I am looking at their numbers.
You should do the same.
It's interesting to look at their "Long Range Accu-Bonds"

Go look


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rigbymauser
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: szihn]
      #238956 - 08/12/13 05:13 AM

I can see the 26Nosler to have the edge over my .270wea in trajectory dept..but it isn´t enough to get a new gun/caliber in the safe. Regarding 6,5mm..I look oreward one day to load and shoot my 6,5x54KP Kurz-Mauser. It´s a 128grain bullet doing a sedate(or there about) 2500 ft/sec only. That is fine for a roedeer as it was presumeably intended for...

Edited by rigbymauser (08/12/13 05:14 AM)


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DarylS
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: rigbymauser]
      #238959 - 08/12/13 05:53 AM

Quote:

I can see the 26Nosler to have the edge over my .270wea in trajectory dept..but it isn´t enough to get a new gun/caliber in the safe. Regarding 6,5mm..I look oreward one day to load and shoot my 6,5x54KP Kurz-Mauser. It´s a 128grain bullet doing a sedate(or there about) 2500 ft/sec only. That is fine for a roedeer as it was presumeably intended for...




A fellow I knew in the 70's had one of those, but I thought it was the 6.5x53Mauser - or perhaps they are just similar? The ballistics you quoted sound familiar - I was surprised it's seemingly underloaded state, but assumed it was designed for a simple purpose - small deer or goats.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: szihn]
      #238966 - 08/12/13 11:08 AM

Quote:

OK Ripp, I did as you suggested.
I went to Nosler's web site and I am looking at their numbers.
You should do the same.
It's interesting to look at their "Long Range Accu-Bonds"

Go look



+++++++++++++



Hate to break the news but I looked before I posted my info..

YOU stated there were NO hunting bullets avallable in the 6.5 with a bc over .500 which was completely untrue.. the 129gr AB-LR has at .561..that at 129 grs-- it takes a 270 caliber to go to 150 grs to beat that..hardly an apple for apple comparison..

In the standard AB-- 140 6.5--sd 287--bc 509---compared to the 270..sd 261 bc 496

OR use the highly praised "do it all" Nosler Partition...140 gr bullets.
6.5 SD 287 BC 490
270 SD 261 BC 432

Have often heard the 130 gr is the go to bullet in a 270..
lets compare in the Nosler AB
6.5 SD 266 BC 488
270 SD 242 BC 435
Again..no comparison...

Same with the Berger I gave my earlier eample on..not only does it smoke the same gr bullet -6.5 vs 270 or 6.8...it also smokes it in SD..another very important component in long range shooting..

It even takes the mightly 30 calibers to go to 200 grains in order to beat the sd of the 6.5 at 140--the 30 cal 180's dont match it in SD or BC...

I stick to my original statement--the 6.5 is ballistically superior to the 270 Winchester...when its compared apples for apples...

Seems weird..if the .270 was such a ballistic miracle, why isnt it used in long range compeition like the 6.5/284 is?? weird...

Ripp

Edited by Ripp (08/12/13 01:52 PM)


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tinker
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238967 - 08/12/13 11:52 AM

Some time back I was given a 7mag
It's a ripper.
I'd happily take a .270 - I even have bullets and dies, and I'd happily take a rifle set up for this Nosler cartridge (please include brass and dies...) but I'm not motivated to look past my 7mag for improvement.

There seems to be some fad development on low BC long range hunting bullets lately. That's nice if they can get them to market and on the shop shelves.
FWIW I'd be happier to simply be able to buy a pound of powder or some primers or a few pounds of lead...







Cheers
Tinker





Cheers
Tinker

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--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: tinker]
      #238968 - 08/12/13 01:47 PM

Tinker

I agree--reloading components are hard to come up compared to 3 years ago--but in our area is seems things are getting a bit better...

As to looking past your 7mm..I feel the same way about my 300RUM...as my go to gun when I want to put meat in the freezer...but personally believe life is far too short to be hung up on one caliber..plan to use as many as time and $$ will allow...

Having said that, I personally have had some amazing results with different 6.5 calibers and welcome another to the stable...

Ripp

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DarylS
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #238999 - 09/12/13 05:31 AM

So - I guess my M74 Sharps pushing 505's at 1,650fps is not in the same ball park with these fast steppers, eh? I can get 1,850fps with 405's?????

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Rule303
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: DarylS]
      #239028 - 09/12/13 09:46 PM

Quote:

So - I guess my M74 Sharps pushing 505's at 1,650fps is not in the same ball park with these fast steppers, eh? I can get 1,850fps with 405's?????




The big danger here is when you go for a 500mt shot you need air traffic clearance as the trajectory takes the pill into the flight lanes


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: DarylS]
      #239038 - 10/12/13 01:07 AM

Quote:

So - I guess my M74 Sharps pushing 505's at 1,650fps is not in the same ball park with these fast steppers, eh? I can get 1,850fps with 405's?????





Hey, my first centerfire was a old military rifle in 303 British..still have it..was incredibly deadly...never ever tried to shoot a group with it as I am certain it probalby would have not been very good..but, seemed like most things fell over after I pointed it at them and pulled the trigger..

Ripp

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Kiwi_bloke
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #239185 - 12/12/13 04:06 PM

Actually, it seems the Nosler's "blazing" performance is slow.

The 6,5x68 RWS is based on a .280 Ross case and was introduced 1939. RWS offer 2 loadings. The heavier 8,2 gram, (126-1/2 grain), Kone-Point bullet does 3,779 fps. That compares with the Nosler 129 grain doing 3,400 fps.

It would have been really handy if Nosler had started loading the 6,5x68 and we could have all had a cheaper source of brass for the 6,5x68 and the 8x68.

The 6,5x68 is a powerful cartridge with not much in the way of recoil allowing most people to shoot it well. It's very like the .264 Winchester magnum but without the belt. A great mountain cartridge because the high speed reduces wind drift and long-range hold-over errors.

I won't be selling mine as a result of this development.


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gryphon
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: Ripp]
      #239189 - 12/12/13 06:26 PM

Quote:

Quote:

So - I guess my M74 Sharps pushing 505's at 1,650fps is not in the same ball park with these fast steppers, eh? I can get 1,850fps with 405's?????





Hey, my first centerfire was a old military rifle in 303 British..still have it..was incredibly deadly...never ever tried to shoot a group with it as I am certain it probalby would have not been very good..but, seemed like most things fell over after I pointed it at them and pulled the trigger..

Ripp






Ripp..just for you.....check the calibre.


http://www.outdoorhub.com/news/new-world...mp;utm_content=

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Iowa_303s
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: gryphon]
      #239192 - 12/12/13 10:28 PM

Thats right! No superduper wizzbang magnum needed. Just a good old 303!
125 years old and still taking game and setting records.

--------------------
Matt

formerly known as Iowa_303

"Once your reputation is ruined you can live your life quite freely."

"Enkelkinder über alles"


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Ripp
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Re: Noslers new 6.5mm/.264" cartridge, the .26 Nosler! [Re: gryphon]
      #239198 - 13/12/13 01:43 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

So - I guess my M74 Sharps pushing 505's at 1,650fps is not in the same ball park with these fast steppers, eh? I can get 1,850fps with 405's?????





Hey, my first centerfire was a old military rifle in 303 British..still have it..was incredibly deadly...never ever tried to shoot a group with it as I am certain it probalby would have not been very good..but, seemed like most things fell over after I pointed it at them and pulled the trigger..

Ripp






Ripp..just for you.....check the calibre.


http://www.outdoorhub.com/news/new-world...mp;utm_content=





Thank you--appreciate that...the old .303..a killing machine...

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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