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StephenCoker
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Reged: 01/12/11
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Loc: AR, United States of America
Fraser Magazine Rifle Project
      #220432 - 28/11/12 03:48 PM

Thought I'd share a project I'm currently working on. The bottom metal pictured is for a client's 98 Mauser, though Fraser typically used 93s as his foundation. I too personally prefer to build on 93-96s and Dutch Mannlichers due to how trim and svelte of a rifle they are. With the 98 I had to deal with the lock screw recess that isn't present on the 93-96 actions, but I think it turned out rather nicely and follows Fraser's design style. The trigger guard bow was also filed to shape based on Fraser's practice of narrowing, reshaping, and terminating the forward portion into a style that is more shotgun like.

A 96 action with flattened forward receiver ring awaiting serrations, a 96 bolt body with Fraser bolt handle, and the 98 bottom metal described above. All on top of an original Fraser I blueprinted.


The bottom metal...



A close up of the trigger guard...


A close up of the lock screw recess shaping...


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Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

Edited by CptCurl (02/12/12 03:07 AM)

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kamilaroi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #220434 - 28/11/12 04:55 PM

Will you roll the trigger guard and cant the trigger?

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: kamilaroi]
      #220469 - 29/11/12 02:17 AM

Thank you Stephen.
Trigger guard is looking good. I like the treatment of the lock screw ....thou the stocker may not..:) Keep doing those trigger bows as long as can, my old hands can't file like that anymore.

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #220485 - 29/11/12 04:24 AM

Hi kamilaroi,
The guard will be rolled according to the pictures of Frasers I have in my portfolio and in my notes and blueprints of original rifles. The canting of the trigger you mention is due to the "Fraser Patent Trigger" mechanism he utilized on many of his magazine rifles. I've posted a photo of the internals below. It's quite interesting in its design. For this particular project I am to leave the trigger mechanism as the military two stage, but it will be finely tuned to lower the weight and eliminate creep. That being said, I am presently working (as time allows) on building a copy of the "Fraser Patent Trigger" as an available feature/option. I just think it's too slick of a design not to!

Caprivi,
Thank you sir! I thought the same thing as I was shaping it up; it sort of brought a devious smile to my face though. My stocker is a gent from England that was kind enough to let me spend a great deal of time in his shop when I was younger, and he took the time to teach me a great deal. I sort of cut my teeth in the realm of fine guns under his wing. He's fully aware of the monster he created. He's also a Fraser fan, which should ease the pain a bit.



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www.stephencokerandco.com
Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

Edited by CptCurl (02/12/12 03:08 AM)

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #220779 - 02/12/12 03:08 PM

Again thanks for the info, in that Fraser used the "93 style action. As I have not handle one, only pictures, I was never quite sure which they where. Many are mis-represented as Swedish actions or simply "Spanish" or ???. Actually I had assume they where likely to be 1895 actions, as ones i have seen have no "thumb cut" in the left wall.


A nice 95 with "Deutsche Waffen" stamped in the receiver would indeed warm my heart as a basis for a Coker/Fraser rifle. Surely a 1893 marked "Oberndorf" would suffice :):)

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #220817 - 03/12/12 03:04 PM

Oh, either one of those marks will file off with equal ease!

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Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

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Huvius
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #220862 - 04/12/12 06:28 AM

There is a Fraser scope in the next Gavin Gardiner auction.
Might be worth a look.

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Huvius]
      #220876 - 04/12/12 09:42 AM

Yes, I did see that in their latest auction catalog a couple of weeks ago. I have closely examined and photographed the Davidson telescopic sight and mounts on a few Fraser magazine rifles, as well as the literature on case labels from Fraser on how to use them. However, I have not previously seen that later model optic that's listed. A trim, lightweight fixed power optic would be very interesting indeed to get my hands on. Thanks for thinking of me.

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Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #220893 - 04/12/12 03:35 PM

Quote:

Oh, either one of those marks will file off with equal ease!



Blasphemy.............:)




All of my books are packed up for the move, so had to rely on a internet search for photos.
Seems I was a bit wrong, the " '93 Spanish" action doesn't have a thumb cut, thou the later 1916 issue (still the smaller pre-98) does as well as all later type M98 actions used.

I like the well "rounded" floorplate of the 93 as opposed to the latter 94, 95 and 96's which are of the "flatter" design used well into the last stages of the M98

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #220922 - 05/12/12 03:01 AM

I think there is a bit of blending and sharing of features that come and go with the maturity of the design of the 93s and 95s. And their difference are minimal. However, you picked up on what to me is the most interesting - that being the "roundness". It is those subtle little things that contribute so heavily to both the feel and the aesthetics of Fraser's rifles. You really begin to get a since for both the little similarities and the differences across the Scottish makers. Most of them preferred "roundness" and curvature in their design and house styles. That translates across round action receivers, Fraser bolt handles, various stock panels, scalloped-back box-locks, and the shaping of front and rear sight bases. I'm working with a 96 presently for a client and am instilling some of those subtle changes to increase the roundness. I do tend to prefer the thumb cut as I enjoy carrying and utilizing stripper clips. They make an excellent way to carry spare ammunition in the field as they don't rattle around in one's pocket or pack. However, it becomes a bit of a moot point when one mounts an optic on top.

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Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

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kamilaroi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #220953 - 05/12/12 12:59 PM

Caprivi, an excellent piece of work!

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: kamilaroi]
      #220961 - 05/12/12 03:29 PM

Totally agree on the "Round-ness" preference of the Highland makers. Truly the best overall at producing double guns, single rifles and bolt rifles. As a whole in concert that is. I still think Rigby built the finest bolt rifle with there pre-98 and first generation 98 .275's. I think WR built the best double guns/rifles and I believe the Germans understand the single rifle as no other. But to repeat in there entirity, the Scots do it all the overall best..........to My Never To Be Humble Opinion...:):):)

Indeed the round feel to hand is the key ingrediant. Jerry Fisher once stated something to the effect of, "The difference between a very nice gun and a great gun is a half inch" to paraphrase. He was not speaking about accuracy, He was speaking of a accumulation of a few thousands here, few thousands there, few from that, more to this........i.e. it is all that subtle nuances that make the object (a bolt rifle in my case) come to Life. Proportion and indeed "Roundness" are for sure part of it.



........The small (pre-98) receivers themselves are, well, small. The are more rounded on the top surfaces as well...i.e. smaller ring, smaller bridge, rounder rail. Total circumfernce as well. I think they stock up trimmer, also.


All of this above is the ramblings of a man who likes easy handling, easy to hit with, light to medium Game appropriate chambered bolt rifles. My physical status no longer allows for much recoil anymore, thou at one time the sky was still not the limit. That said a 425 or a 500j, in proportion, would benefit from following the recipe.


-As to the thumb cut, while there utility is indeed there (I have 3 as new brass clips for the pending 8x51mm) my preference for not having them is strictly in my former IN-ability to stock them in a visually pleasing manner.
-Stripper clips, Stephen, you have rekindled a interest in them. In my parring down of firearms and related items, there is currently not a charger cut equipped rifle in-house (save the pending inbound, aforementioned 8x51). I believe that will need to change.
-"the shaping of front and rear sight bases"........while I am boxing up to move across town, I have no access to still photos, but will attempt to remember, find, scan and Post some pictures of bases I made. We should start a thread on them.


...................very much Enjoying this discourse started by mere Fraser bolt rifles....:):):)

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justcurious
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #220975 - 06/12/12 01:18 AM

Quote:





........The small (pre-98) receivers themselves are, well, small. The are more rounded on the top surfaces as well...i.e. smaller ring, smaller bridge, rounder rail. Total circumfernce as well. I think they stock up trimmer, also.

...................very much Enjoying this discourse started by mere Fraser bolt rifles....:):):)



Only the front ring diameter differs. The rest is equal in dimension and shape , at least what is to be seen over the stock line.

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: justcurious]
      #221108 - 07/12/12 03:51 PM

Quote:

Only the front ring diameter differs. The rest is equal in dimension and shape , at least what is to be seen over the stock line.



With all due respect, not exactly.
Yes, the ring is indeed 1/16" on average smaller in diameter, The over all length of a given 92-96 is a 1/4" shorter than the average M98. There are many macinations of charger guides on the M98 bridge, some grotesque large, where as the 92-96 is generally of a small well rounded shape. The a 92-96 is generally more rounded, as the M98 is more angular.

While I indeed realise this is all a matter of very small parts of inches, some in the thousands, it is indeed these subtle differences that, well make the difference.

None of this is to say a M98 has no place in my Battery, nor to declare that any such 92-96 is the superior to any given 98, just stating differences in preception.

In a trim, light recoiling, open sighted bolt rifle....I find few nicer choices then a long-ish barreled, half stocked, straight(or nearly so)gripped small ring pre-98 Mauser.

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k3030AI
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #221145 - 08/12/12 08:06 AM

Caprivi,

I like your ½” remark. Often when seeing a rather nice American style custom rifle, myself or Mr. Coker will comment “There’s a Fraser in there somewhere” (usually a race to see who gets the remark out first). The meaning being…keep going . A fine rifle isn’t finished when you have added as much as you can, but rather when you’ve removed every last bit that doesn’t need to be there. And then Americans wonder why a vintage English or Scottish rifle balances like nothing else.

I’m often amazed that so few in modern society just doesn’t “get it”. If you actually walk the woods with a rifle in hand, most of those straight stocked, hubble scope wearing, benchrest machines they call “mountain rifles” are not fun to hold on to and drag through the woods. Then slip a Fraser, Rigby, or Lee Speed in your hand and it’s a breath of fresh air that says; “let’s just keep walking”. Kinda like when someone puts a scope on a Winchester 94.

Not bashing scoped rifles, there are some that are fantastic. But in this modern era so few have a clue as to the use of the iron sight, and what a joy an iron sighted rifle is to carry in the woods. What’s more, they shoot just as straight. All you have to do is spend a little time re-learning the art of the iron sight.

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: k3030AI]
      #221260 - 10/12/12 04:07 AM

Could not agree more. I have yet to see a modern american Classic that wouldn't benefit from a few more hours on the bench. At that they are tauted as being so very trim and handy when compared to a mass produced sporter. The "magic' of these Edwardian era Bolt rifles is indeed there simplicity, there trim-ness, there "economy" of extras.

As to the scoped rifles. I own more than a few. They have there place, here in the High Plains of my Home. There was a certain 30/378 that ruled the Prairie. My current LR set up is rather ponderous 6.5x284. There is also a very trim stainless/plastic Tikka 6.5mm. With its 4x Zeiss, battue bolt handle and trench mag it is just the thing for a cull or driven shoot, but as trim as it is compared to its modern counterparts, it is a leviathan when seated next to a Lee Speed. Probably not any better as well.


I do apologize to Mr Coker for the wandering of his thread.

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #221292 - 10/12/12 02:49 PM

No worries Caprivi,

This discourse helps to codify why certain rifles appeal to us (especially Fraser ). I too am guilty. A Steyr Prohunter in .260 resides along side the Scottish, English, and German rifles for my hunting rifles (along with a clinical infatuation with the Savage 1899). However, recently I have been playing with the notion of combining svelte and long range. So....I picked up a Ross M-10 and am debating a custom scope mount and optic. Some how that rifle and cartridge (.280) scream svelte and long range in equal proportions. Can't make up my mind on an appropriate optic though. See, now I'm beginning to wander - at least it's eccentric designer was a Scotsman. See that? We may have just come full circle here!

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www.stephencokerandco.com
Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

Edited by StephenCoker (10/12/12 03:58 PM)

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #221313 - 11/12/12 02:20 AM

Please start a new thread on that......A Ross is a thing of mystery and intrigue.
I have seen the scoped. Svelte and long range for sure. Would be a honour to catch a pronghorn with that. Surely a scope will help to reach its potential. A neighbor had one when I was a kid and the barrel stamping of "Proved to 28 Tons" was not lost on me....:):):)

Years back Ross Seyfried did a article on the Ross, He included some pictures, if memory serves there was a scoped rifle, or at least pictures of scope bases. Maybe small Davidson style bases and a Malcom or classic little Zeiss ??? Or go with a modern Zeiss ??? Maybe a side mount of some sort ???

http://www.cabelas.com/scarborough-gun-library-ross-rifle-m-1910-280-ross-1.shtml

The Handloader Magazine, page 29, Issue No. 45, September/October, Vol 8, No 5, 1973

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VonGruff
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #221320 - 11/12/12 05:00 AM

Not sure I could go with a side mount like that though as it seems to be a snag waiting to happen



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Von Gruff.

Exodus 20:1-17

Acts 4:10-12

Edited by CptCurl (09/06/13 11:00 PM)

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: VonGruff]
      #221363 - 12/12/12 02:23 AM

Quote:

Not sure I could go with a side mount like that though as it seems to be a snag waiting to happen






Nothing to snag out on the Prairie..............:):):)

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Edited by CptCurl (09/06/13 11:00 PM)

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #221370 - 12/12/12 03:13 AM

Alright, I'm starting a new thread!

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Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: StephenCoker]
      #221415 - 12/12/12 11:56 AM

:):):) Thanks

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Caprivi
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #223396 - 11/01/13 03:06 PM

Any updates ???

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StephenCoker
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Re: Fraser Magazine Rifle Project [Re: Caprivi]
      #223476 - 12/01/13 05:00 PM

Yes, though I've been spending a lot of time on development for my website the past few weeks.

I now have a 26" profiled barrel per the Fraser style. This weekend I will drill and tap the barrel and action, and make up a knurled thumb screw to incorporate Fraser's take-down method.

The safety and bolt stop have been reshaped. They just need to be serrated and checkered respectively.

I filed up a Fraser front sight in all of its elegant sleekness. I have examples where Fraser sometimes incorporated a very minimal band on his front sights - about 20 thou. thick at the most. I've always liked the unique look of it, and so decided to utilize it as well. I'm about to matte/stipple the ramp and serrate the top of it. I have examples where Fraser did this, and examples without it, and examples with one treatment but not the other. Having said this, it currently resides atop my Ruger Flattop Target Bisley in .44 Special. It had been begging me for a banded front sight for some time.

I'll try to get some pictures taken and posted over the next few days.

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www.stephencokerandco.com
Uniquely superlative rifles in the Scottish tradition.

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