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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Cast Bullets
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Perry
.275 member


Reged: 09/11/10
Posts: 73
Loc: Qld Australia
Casting for my 45.70, enjoying working out a good Load
      #211318 - 22/06/12 08:15 AM

G/Day Folks

I have just bought a Rossi Rio Grande 45.70 which I am very happy with despite just having sent it back for a minor repair under Warrantee.

This is a photo of a 10 Shot group I shot at 50 yards Sunday just gone. No great shakes but then again I was shooting off what amounts to a wobbly Card Table in the middle of a Cow Paddock.

As I am shooting a Plain Base Projectile I used a Trapdoor starting Load @ approx 1400fps. The Rifle Slugged at .451 Bore , .457 Groove. Load as follows Remington Cases, Remington Primers,40grains AR2206H [ 4895H ] Lee 405gr HB projectile .459 Dianmeter Cast from straight Wheel Weights and Air Cooled. Still saving for a Gas Checked Mould. OAL was 2.585

I tumble lubed with Lee Liquid Alox first time around and was rewarded with Bad Leading so after what seemed like a Week scrubbing Lead from the Bore I switched to a Homemix Lube of LLA, Parrafin and STP Oil Treatment. As I shot this group and the Wind Blew, the Table Wobbled and the Barrel Leaded slightly the Group shifted Low and Right



The Barrel Leaded very Slightly, a faint grey tinge near the Muzzle, so I have lubed up the next Load with White Label Carnuba Red mixed with Beeswax and ATF. This works well with my 35.303 at 1886 fps. If I still get minor Leading I will try Water Quenching the Proj or adding tin to my Alloy. I am loath to further reduce the Load. I bought this Rifle for a meaningfull step up in Power over my other Rifles and Trapdoor Loads don't do it for me. But Hey I had to start Casting for it somewhere.

The 2 shots touching off to the Left is a different Load 45gr AR2206H [ 4895H ] 350gr Westcast rnfp commercial Hardcast. These have a Teflon like Coating. The other shots failed to fire due to light hammer strikes. This is why I sent the Rifle back for repair under Warrantee, I know it's as easy a Fix as shimming the Hammer Spring but it's a new Rifle and I may as well use the Warrantee while it's there

Soon as I get the Rifle Back, this load sorted and my Gas Check Mould the Fun will start again

regards Jacko

--------------------
"To my deep mortification my father once said to me, 'You care for nothing but shooting, dogs and rat catching, and you will be a disgrace to yourself and all your family.' " -Charles Darwin

Edited by Perry (22/06/12 08:16 AM)

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DarylSModerator
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26535
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Casting for my 45.70, enjoying working out a good Load [Re: Perry]
      #211360 - 23/06/12 02:36 AM

Hey Jacko - your 'first' results are better than a lot of guys get - previous experience shows.

Is this rifle a rolling block?

Instead of "HAVING" to use a gas-check mould, you can usually use a card wad instead, for bullet base protection. A buffer, like GREX or Puflon also works. Just make sure the wad is under the bullet, not a distance below it on the powder. The 'filler's prevent a space between powder and bullet/wad. Since your mould is casting .459" - they are perfect & should be shot, as-cast - no sizing and with a card wad and that WW alloy, you should have no leading to 2,000fps - IF the lube is a decent one.

In a single shot rifle, bullet tension in the case is almost immaterial, so you can adjust the sizer die up, to only lightly size the case mouth for easier bullet fit - but do what shots best.

With straight smokeless powder, I'd be inclined to use a simple NRA formula lube, like 50% alox, 50% beeswax- ie: RCBS, Lyman, and many other compercial wax/based bullet lubes.

If you want to mix your own with good beeswax, try 60% beeswax/40% Vaseline. It worked wonderfully for me with both real black powder and with smokeless powder all the way to 2,200fps with .45 and .50 cal. bullets.

Failure of the lube/ie: leading :

1/. leading just ahead of the chamber means the lube is too hard, normally. Failure of the lube, ie: 2/. leading at the muzzle usually means not enough lube and 3/. leading one end to the other means poor lube. There is a crossover between #2 and #3.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Perry
.275 member


Reged: 09/11/10
Posts: 73
Loc: Qld Australia
Re: Casting for my 45.70, enjoying working out a good Load [Re: DarylS]
      #211520 - 25/06/12 09:12 AM

G/Day Daryl, the Rossi Rio Grande is a Lever based on the Marlin 336. I was surprised when my Rifle Fed and Chambered Cartridges with such a long OAL of 2.585 when 2.550 is the OAL listed in many load manuals for Lever Loads

I have no experience with Wads or Fillers so I'm all Ears as 45 Calibre Gas Checks are expensive.A Mate who is a vastly experienced Shooter is advising me on Casting and the 45.70 Cartridge. He was telling me the other week he does not like Fillers with smokeless Powder. My powders of choice are AR2206H [4895H] and AR2208 [Varget] which according to ADI are fine down to 60% of Case Volume.

I have read or been told as much Good or Bad Stories when it comes to the merits of Fillers and Wads so will have a look around for a broad Range of info and have a think.

Thanks for the Info with Lube. I will see how my Carnuba Red based Homemix Lube works for me and follow your tips if it does not. Your point re the Hardness of the Lube is interesting. Both mixes of my Homemix Lube are quite soft and Tacky compared to the commercial Wax based lubes I've seen. Is it possible they are too Soft and being used up before the Bullet exits the barrel in this Rifle??

The CBE 250359 Projectile I shoot from my 35.303 carries proportunetly less Lube than the Lee 405HB and the Rifle has a 22' Barrel Vs the Rio Grande's 19.5' Barrel so on the surface you'd think all should be well

regards Jacko

--------------------
"To my deep mortification my father once said to me, 'You care for nothing but shooting, dogs and rat catching, and you will be a disgrace to yourself and all your family.' " -Charles Darwin

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