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Hunting >> Hunting in the Americas

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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
A true trophy
      #208811 - 23/05/12 03:32 PM

Just have to share this link. You don't see one of these everyday.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=134411

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Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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gryphon
.450 member


Reged: 01/01/03
Posts: 5487
Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #208817 - 23/05/12 07:02 PM

Link wont work.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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controlled_feed
.300 member


Reged: 23/05/08
Posts: 227
Loc: NSW, Australia
Re: A true trophy [Re: gryphon]
      #208818 - 23/05/12 07:22 PM

That is an awesome bear

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I was born 100 years too late


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375Brno
.333 member


Reged: 18/10/05
Posts: 354
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
Re: A true trophy [Re: controlled_feed]
      #208819 - 23/05/12 07:54 PM

Yes a great trophy.
Not taking anything away from it but I still don't get the "harvest" concept. When I went to school you harvested crops and shot / killed animals.
Rick


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Mike_Bailey
.400 member


Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: A true trophy [Re: 375Brno]
      #208820 - 23/05/12 08:35 PM

375Brno, amen, I hate that word, you hunt and shoot game, you harvest crops, just a milk sop to the antis´ ...lovely trophy but it was hunted, not "harvested" best, Mike

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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #208830 - 23/05/12 10:36 PM

I agree, I always say if hunting were easy we would call it farming.

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Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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mikeh416Rigby
.450 member


Reged: 24/02/03
Posts: 6051
Loc: The beautiful Oley Valley, PA....
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #208842 - 24/05/12 12:12 AM

What a magnificent beast!

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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39897
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: A true trophy [Re: mikeh416Rigby]
      #208865 - 24/05/12 01:44 AM







--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Sville
.400 member


Reged: 23/03/10
Posts: 1189
Loc: Sweden
Re: A true trophy [Re: NitroX]
      #208879 - 24/05/12 03:45 AM

Yes, really a true trophy. Thats a big bear....

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gryphon
.450 member


Reged: 01/01/03
Posts: 5487
Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Sville]
      #208889 - 24/05/12 06:29 AM

Something that i want to hunt too MB,agree with harvest etc etc.

Is it a sow?

It doesn't seem to have the big mother of a head like the big boars do.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27014
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: A true trophy [Re: gryphon]
      #208898 - 24/05/12 08:17 AM

THAT is a NICE black bear! If it wasn't for his claws, he looks like a grizzly.

I'd expect it's a boar. The head is a dang fine size, too, imho. Too bad they didn't give a measure on the green skull. I think it takes 20" to get into the book for a B.Bear.

I don't hunt bears, but if I ever see one like that while out hunting for ungulates, it's going down - 9.3x57 style with a 293TUG or 286 gr. Norma through his lights.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Ripp
.577 member


Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: A true trophy [Re: DarylS]
      #208900 - 24/05/12 08:27 AM

Agree--that thing is huge....with a beautiful coat to go with it...

Ripp

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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: Ripp]
      #208905 - 24/05/12 09:15 AM

The trophy class cinnamon phased blacks should be considered one of the greatest trophies a bear hunter can take. Most are killed young due to their unique coat. Few ever reach these proportions and even fewer are ever seen much less killed. Absolutely Fantastic!!!!

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Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39897
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #208922 - 24/05/12 06:47 PM

Would a black bear that size be a potential danger to humans, seeing black bear killings on humans are rare. But does this change with size? Just interested.

Great trophy.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: NitroX]
      #208959 - 25/05/12 01:55 AM

More often than not a Black Bear attack is a mature male boar. The scary part is in a poor year( food wise) they will view a human as a food source. That and the fact that they are naturally a smaller bear when they do attack they hold nothing back. Attack rates are relatively low but mortality rates of those attacks are extremely high. Last number I heard was 62 of the last 67 attacks were fatal. Often looked at as a harmless creature nothing could be further from the truth. I have a book somewhere entitled Bear Tales from Alaska and Beyond. The author escapes me now but it is a collection of short true stories cronicling bear attacks. Once read the bear woods never quite feel the same.

To awnser your question more directly yes mature large boars are more aggressive. I have not hunted my bait hard this year as I can tell from the bait site the boss has not been in yet. The rut will bring him around this last week of May and if lucky he may give me one chance. When they (mature boars) come you know because the boss man destroys everything. Last year he tore 1/8" steel plate around lag bolts that were holding a molasses tank to a spruce tree. Nothing short of impressive.

--------------------
Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #208962 - 25/05/12 04:06 AM

An link to purchase a great bear read
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0970953704/ref=redir_mdp_mobile

--------------------
Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27014
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #208998 - 26/05/12 12:44 AM

Going by my Government course in black bear attack survival, I'd add to Smoke's post, that over 90% of black bear attacks on humans are fatal to the victim.

The attack could be for protection of young by a sow, or protection of food by either sex - a young 3 year old strutting his stuff who still thinks Mom's handy to protect him if he gets in over his head, or by any sex for food, as Smoke indicated. When a bear steps out onto a trail in front of you or behind you, he is sizing you up for a meal. Believe it. He knows you are there - excellent sense of smell and hearing. Get an ichy or twichy feeling something's watching you- look behind you and there's a black bear? He's just sizing you up. He walks into the bush - in a few minutes 'another' bear walks out onto the trail in front of you? Same bear - still sizing you up. The frontal assesment is because you didn't scare him away when he was behind you looking you over. If he doesn't spook from you, the next time you see him might be from the side as he bursts out of the cover to run you over to get you on the ground - it will be a silent attack - at 30mph. Something to think about.

The reason most grizzly attacks are not fatal, is due to most grizzly attacks not turning into a predator attack on the victim - they are usually an aggressive attack to show superiority and to beat you up. Yes - you might need 600 stitches and/or might die from loss of blood if help isn't close enough. The difference is that most black bear attacks turn predatory and you become a food item during the attack.

This is as I understand the black bear/grizzly main attack differences. Of course, you never know what it is during or before and to fight back is your only choice. Play dead with a black bear and you will be. The easier you are to kill, the more likely he will think all humans are food items. I just couldn't play dead in a grizzly attack, I'm sure. Fellow just 60 miles West of here killed the sow that attacked him, with his hunting knife. He survived, she didn't.

Sheldon taught us to always pack the means of bear defense - for us, that was a slug loaded 12 bore. We found in town here, that buckshot is useless beyond about 15 feet - whereas slugs work every time. I'd rather be packing round ball loads, myself, to the performance of 1880's African round ball loads for a 12 - more effective than a hollow slug, especially on grizzlies - although store bought full sized slugs are better than sabots and buck. I was told by a parks ranger than buckshot point blank in the side of a big grizzly only pissed it off - didn't penetrate beyond the ribs but really make him mad. When he stood up, the other guy put a 1 1/4oz. Fed slug into his chest, which broke his spine.

In general, bears have small, light rib bones, but can have much energy absorbing hair, thick skin, fat and muscle outside the ribs to slow the lighter projectiles.

BBears are usually easily killed - but of course, the bigger the bear, the bigger the bullet - imoh.

If you cannot pack a gun, then a sharp blade of at least 8" length was his suggestion.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: DarylS]
      #209012 - 26/05/12 03:57 AM

I would back up Daryls claim of packing a good blade. In the above mentioned book the author points out that in most the stories of survival against a black the difference was a knife. Often the side attack will knock your firearm away then you are on your own. A good knife, strength and hopefully lots of experience bar room brawling as a young man is all you've got left in the whole world.

Best idea is to kill him when he presents himself front on as Daryl stated they will often do.

Most people are very poorly educated when it comes to bears, especially the blacks. It all stems from the fact that they are generally not hard to put down and most often just spook when they see you. Make no mistake though no matter what anyone tells you, when you enter their domain you may be lunch and you won't hear that side charge coming till it hits. Their ability to move silently has to be experienced to be appreciated. A fellow hunter said it best "They are the ghosts in the forests".

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Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27014
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #209035 - 26/05/12 07:38 AM

Too - they are not the 'clowns of the forest' some people want you to believe they are. They are always looking for their next meal.

Being aware of what can hurt you, is more than 1/2 the battle. Yes - they spook easily, especially if you are not a small, potential meal.

Opening your coat, coats, if more than one of you, facing him and yelling forcefully - even to attacking/running at him, will make him think he's inferior and not capable of attacking you. If you're not hunting him, scare him away. If you turn and walk away - the very worse thing next to running away, you are inviting an attack - maybe instantly - maybe from the side in a minute or two.

Edited to include the warning I gave each of my daughters, many years ago - at THAT time of the month, women are especially in jeopard of an attack. Seems to happen every year in one park or another in N America. In every instance, death is the result due to no-firearms laws in National Parks.

Edited by Daryl_S (26/05/12 07:58 AM)


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: DarylS]
      #209047 - 26/05/12 10:23 AM

As I sit in my bear stand I realize how sick we are Nitro. You are interested in the danger level of these hunts and I just figured out I long for the same. I always hunt bear alone and enjoy the walk in and out the most as my senses come to life. I am establishing two new sites this year and have chosen them based on their vantage points from the ground 25 paces from the bait so that the bar will be raised some. My rifle of choice is my 12 bore double so that I can enter the thick stuff alone as soon as possible after the initial shot (give em 20 I say). It's a sickness I guess, spread randomly among men around the globe.

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Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39897
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: A true trophy [Re: Smoke73]
      #209068 - 26/05/12 04:11 PM

Smoke73, I was just enquiring if a large black bear is more likely to be a threat to humans. If it is a size thing, ie black bear are usually smaller. Or if it is a temperament and food source thing.

But I also realised a long time ago, that eg for cape buffalo, every hunter fears a charge, but also subliminally desires one. Just one with a heroic successful ending. Sales of hunts increase after reports of a death, not decrease. Same with big nasty bears is my guess.

Gentlemen, thanks for the comments. All very interesting.

Quote:

I have a book somewhere entitled Bear Tales from Alaska and Beyond.




Is the book you posted the same?



Looks interesting and an exciting read.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27014
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: A true trophy [Re: NitroX]
      #209112 - 27/05/12 03:16 AM

I believe a larger bear more likely to attack than a smaller one. They know how big they are & as you stand almost as tall or as tall as they are - ie: 6' to 7' for a good sized bear - their normal caution in sizing you up can or will make a difference. He won't attack in a predetory attack unless he believes he will be successful - normally. Hunger can make even man take chances he normally wouldn't consider.

When it comes to protecting cubs, size probably has nothing to do with an attack.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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450_EXPRESS
.333 member


Reged: 04/01/09
Posts: 349
Loc: S.C.Montana
Re: A true trophy [Re: DarylS]
      #209161 - 27/05/12 01:44 PM

I agree with the larger bear being more likely to attack. I recall reading a study a few years back, 'bout elk calf & deer fawn mortality I believe, and it was saying how when fully mature (around 6 yr old) black bear boars became much more predatory in nature, rather than just opportunistic feeders. When I lived on a ranch, a few years back, that had sheep, most times when a bear took to killing ewes regularly it turned out to be a large boar.
We can't bait here so a couple seasons back I decided to get serious about calling. This time of year a call that'll mimic a cub's bawl and in fall a coarse jackrabbit/fawn distress type sound. Lot of fun sitting there squalling like some kind of bear happy meal. First one I called in ('10 season ) was a nice bear, fun hunt. Shot at 18 yds, hide squared out a little over 6 & 1/2 feet, FWP aged him at 12 yrs. .338 with a 225 gr Nosler Partion, never had anything I shot with it argue and it's a comforting thing to be carrying when doing that kind of thing.
For the most part here though if they get a whiff of you they're gone, especially ones that have been around awhile, but like anything else there can always be an exception.


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39897
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: A true trophy [Re: DarylS]
      #209218 - 27/05/12 11:44 PM

Quote:

If you cannot pack a gun, then a sharp blade of at least 8" length was his suggestion.




Daryl at the moment the bear appeared, forgot he had strapped his rifle on his back and had a revolver on his belt .... "GRRR, come and get it!" ....



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Smoke73
.300 member


Reged: 30/05/11
Posts: 164
Loc: Rocky Mtn. House Alberta
Re: A true trophy [Re: NitroX]
      #209225 - 28/05/12 12:28 AM

That is the book Nitro. It is a great book. Each chapter is a different story so maybe half hour to hour to get through each story. Absolutely great for hunting camp as no big time committment involved. Of course I read the whole book in a couple nights. Got to bait this morning at 6:30. 15 min later bear is clawing tree 20 yds away. No shot through heavy timber. Heard him walk off to the west. My guess he was bedded close woke up and headed on a walkabout. Hopefully he comes in for snacks before bedding down again. Good stuff anyway. Makes up for a long drive after only four hours on the deck.

--------------------
Your not tired, you just think your tired, you don't even know what the hell tired is.- Garth Ahlstrom (Thanx Dad love ya)

"When one of them is born, their god says ' Go in peace.'
When one of us is born our Gods say "Go hunting."- J. Emmett Willie


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